Grrl Power #984 – Don’t tug on etc etc…
The problem with someone who speaks in 18 point monster font is that you can only fit so much per page. I’ll probably have to lower his volume quickly. (For reference, the normal dialog font is 6.5 point.)
Tamer: Enhancer 2 – Progress Update:
It’s getting close! At least the end of the fight scene is. The chapter is also pushing 10K words by itself so a separate wrap up chapter might be in order. Man, I am not good at planning this stuff out, am I?
September’s vote incentive is up! It’s been over a year since Max was featured in one of these, so I figured it was time to revisit.
If you just popped by to see it right when it went up, you might have missed the update. Her nipples were a touch high in the first version, and if you poke through the comments there, you can see the reference I used, only that model’s boobs were about 3 cup sizes smaller. Anyway, I flew her nipples south for the winter and updated the relevant pics.
Nude version is up at Patreon.
Double res version will be posted over at Patreon. Feel free to contribute as much as you like.
SuperheroThey're super, thanks for asking!
Meatspace ComicSeriously these are awesome. Check 'em out!
Not UpdatingNo longer updating or only updates sporadically, but definitely worth reading.
SeriouslySeriously you guys. If you like Grrl Power the check these out.
"Mature"Mature subject matter and occasionally something explicit but usually safe. Can't guarantee the ads are safe though.
Dongs Ahoy!Full frontal and backal. Lots of skin, sex on some or all pages, explicit or otherwise.
Well. That seems ill-advised.
If Thothogoth is relying on intimidation, we already know that Max responds to it by digging in her heels. Um, digging them into the guts of whoever tried it, at least metaphorically.
But he made a real mistake here. Now he’s talking invasion, and he mentioned the word “armies” and expressed an intent to overthrow not only all the nations in the world, but also, by implication, the particular nation that Leander is sworn to defend.
Which to me, means nobody is going to give Leander so much as a reprimand if she murders him straight back to Hell. At least not unless it turns out to be bad tactics in dealing with his people or his army – and I don’t think it actually would be given the opening overture he’s provided. It’s looking like “peace was never an option” becomes the operative principle here.
If Kevin becomes important to this conflict in any way (and he might, if he gets sufficiently powered up) this is the sort of thing that could earn him a pardon.
And Dabbler could still intervene to save his life, but she’d need to get him to quickly retract his last couple of statements, and I don’t know if he has enough good judgment to listen. Also I have no idea whether she will.
Harem is still recording this encounter, right? That will go a long way to absolving her of any war-crimes or other charges.
Thom will be hard asskickek on so many ways that even GLaDOS will avoid f… it up.
The question is: Máxima will Solo him or it will be a tag team battle with Sidney?
I hope she gets a good angle on the violence that Maxima is about to perpetuate.
Dis gonna be GUUUUUD!
Yeah yeah… he is speaking of invasion.
But he already is invading the personal space of Maxima.
I fully expect the next panel that comes out includes a broken demon finger.
Merely a broken finger?
I envisioned a panel where a smiling Maxima is holding his ripped off index finger and then either ‘gives him the finger’ or literally gives him his finger. This by inserting it as a pointy object in some suitable part of his body.
Of course… She IS a Law Enforcement Officer. even in the military we were trained to start out low key, and escalate the levels as required by the situation… we’re “usually” NOT STARTING at “Kill on sight”.
Here she started out as “presence”,you know how if somebody’s acting up and a cop just drives by, the guys instantly clam up and the tension goes down, maybe even enough so cooler heads settle it out without violence, etc… same thing here: she showed up and got his attention, asked for papers and was basically ignored, then she stepped up to verbal orders for compliance, again he ignored her… this time she should try a “little bit” of force, ie> she grabs the finger and uses it as the grip for an arm-bar take-down or something similarly NON-Lethal… THEN, if required in the event he escapes the take-down and counter attacks with lethal force (as it most likely will be) THAT’S when she’s authorized LETHAL force levels…
She’s under DoD, and TGoth is literally declaring himself and invading foreign power.
She’s under zero obligation to restrain herself.
At this point, in her place, I would ash this guy where he stands.
He hasn’t actually done anything except talk big, and poke the giggly-button (which… seems to be broken on this golden Elmo)
He suffered a broken finger, as he was picking his nose at the time of the punch.
He says ORDER, I hear slavery!!!
*anarchist detected
Professional: “oh look, a threat. **murder**
Scrublord: “INSIGNIFICANT HUMAN! Let me demonstrate extremely clearly that I have not read the evil overlords list!”
I believe the proper action is **services target**
There are some clients you serve, and some clients you service. And as a mercenary, they are one missed payment from swapping lables.
Huh. I don’t see that one in my copy of Seventy Habits. Oh well, that’s what the back pages are for…
I get the feeling Maxima is going to give him The Finger. His own finger to be precise, torn off and probably shoved someplace uncomfortable.
No, her finger, like the one she used when demonstrating to Sydney why she carries a gun.
How about both?
I think the proper counter to a finger poke in the tummy is using that same finger for a nose boop.
Hehe!
*boop*
Another point here is that Leander is normally constrained by collateral damage. They had to get the press conference out to a missile test range for her to demonstrate the near-nuke that she heavily implied was NOT the top end of her powers.
But now she’s facing someone whose body from the waist up is inside a stone quarry, and from the waist down implied to be firmly in a strategically valuable section of enemy territory. To me this looks a lot like he’s dead center a free-fire zone where she’s free to use the biggest baddest bomb in her basket.
That hasn’t happened before. Even the Fel carrier was too near an inhabited area for her Sunday Punch.
The closest comparison is Sydney versus the Calamarians on the Alari homeworld.
are you suggesting that it is time for a world made of cardboard comment? hopefully this time instead of hitting down she hits up. that was his mistake- he let his opponent get back on his feet. after casually threatening to conquer the world thoth does not deserve or need any more warnings.
Yeah….yeah, no. That wasn’t a threat, so much as a statement of imminent action.
So Tom’s a one-man target rich environment?
Well, that is one of the negative consequences of size increasing spells. Makes you kind of hard to miss.
F
F
Sorry, Max has never struck me as the giggly type.
I think this is the first time we see thirthogith or whatever as more than a giant face, and I gotta say, he’s really pulling the giant demon look off.
Yep, the transparency in various places is a nice otherworldly touch. But, like Xuriel says, there’s clearly some low self esteem going on, and Max is leading into that.
Really digging the bone wings, actually. I believe this is the first hint we’ve seen of them – wondering if they’re in-shot for the first time, or just now manifesting (in stages?) as he prepares for action.
They were in the flashback, when he was being dragged down
Uh oh. This isn’t going to end well. For Thothogoth I mean.
Calling it now –
Maximal gets her powers stripped and has to go to Deus, who has figured out a way to make superhumans, to get them back. She hides the loss of powers behind her new choker.
Bad call.
It would completely upset Dave’s world-building applecart.
I’m glad Dave already got the reference in for the title, because that Jim Croce song was the first thing that ran through my head.
Me, I’d hope for the surprise that it was the other way around. I mean, there must be someone out there in the universe that is more powerful than Max, at some time. Why not him? Why not now?
He was watching TV and saw Max’s kaboom. So he’s done his homework, at least to some degree. He knows here powers, and she doesn’t know his. Which one’s superman?
I think Dabbler would be warning Max off if she thought Tom had a serious advantage. For an even match she’d probably be content to watch things play out for a bit.
Or, she could be not letting Tommy know that he could easily defeat Maxi
It will be interesting to see if Tom means “armies that I command” or “armies commanded by a greater entity for which I am herald”.
‘Secunde’ would seem to imply the latter.
Oh my! Maxima will break a nail… but not hers…
Max: Be very glad I am not considering your statements to be a declaration of war nor touching me in that way to be assault. The last army that tried invading our world when near me did not end up in a good (or even survivable) state. I will now give you this opportunity to leave. This offer will not be repeated. Should you remain on United States ground or airspace without authorization, you will be arrested and charged with Immigration violations.
He will set free somewhere in Tx to join the rest of them
Thoth is gonna get a hell of a surprise when his claw does a nice *tink* against what he thinks is just colored skin, but feels more like dwarf star alloy.
Has Max ever taken physical damage since her body changed to non-flesh? Does anyone even know what material she’s made out of now?
Vehemence broke her nose once
I was thinking Sciona’s robot may have scratched her with its laser cutter as well, but on closer inspection that might just be a shadow.
I think it was an actual scratch but if so, its odd that nothing came of it.
Then again the super manekiller did get away, unbeknownst to arc swat. Sooooo it might have a drop of Maxima’s blood or something, for all we know.
I’m torn over shadow, smudge, or actual scratch. And unfortunately we don’t get another look at that shoulder until Maxima has found alternative clothing.
Maybe we’ll find out more when the super Manekiller returns
You must realize that you’ve placed your bets on the wrong horse?
Ivermectin is not your miracle drug. Neigh!
I have literally no idea what you’re talking about, Oberon.
Just some free association from manekiller: mane killer -> horses have manes -> anti-vaccers are eating Ivermectin paste in a “made for horses” formulation because they can buy it at the local feed store and no reputable doctor will prescribe it for COVID.
I may or may not have had a decent amount of bourbon in the hours before my prior post…
“I may or may not have had a decent amount of bourbon in the hours before my prior post…”
That does give some explanation to the post, admittedly. :)
Kevin broke her nose, Atomic Bombshell caused her pain and popped her back with a small-ish bomb charge, Brüt hurt her jaw with a punch and made it clicky while she was allocating everything into speed, and presumably the stand-still fight with the “presumed dead” enemy super was what put her in the hospital to heal up alongside Peggy.
I’m with you on Kevin and Atomic Bombshell, both of who hurt Maxima when she was at a moderately high armor level. Brut technically only hurt her as much as he did because she was at a minimum armor level at the time (most of her points were in speed to counter the slow time field). Once she was at a moderately high armor she pretty much brutalized the guy after he was done with his clothing destroying spree.
Where did we hear that Max was in the hospital? I’m not doubting you, I simply don’t remember it.
It was mentioned that that was how she and Peggy first met (when Peggy was in hospital after having a chopper land on her)
Might have been in Afghanistan? We know Max fought some Arab-speaking super who was about as powerful as she was, so that might explain it.
She and peggy met when peggy was in the helicopter when she lost her leg, not when peggy was in the hospital IIRC.
You sure? Was equally sure they met while in hospital together, implying they both were recovering from injuries
Just read the Cast Page, and we are both correct
Yay! Everyone wins.
I had never picked up on Max getting injured in Afghanistan (after Peggy, not in the same incident), and want that story now. Presumably related to the late super she mentioned at the inaugural press conference.
I don’t know if it’s been mentioned anywhere in the comic, just on the cast page and in the comments.
If I recall correctly atomic bombshell was actually hitting Max with the biggest blast she could, to the point where she needed the Periwinkle Buttsniffer to protect her while she charged it, and needed Vector to direct it after she threw it. There was a whole scene where Bombshell freaks out that Max walked away with nothing but a burnt jacket and Sydney called her out on it since they just saw Max stand in her own fallout unharmed a few hours ago. A blast that was much bigger than Bombshells firecracker.
No, atomic bombshell was NOT using her biggest charge. She specifically said she was using a shaped charge because her biggest charge would be too dangerous to OTHERS in the fight on her side. And it got theough Maxima’s armor even when it was at apretty high level. The only blasts we have seen that were more powerful have been the squidwards, although sydneys shield protected her instead (which makes me think it could have seriously hurt or killed maxima from narrative logic) and the explosion of the super mannekiller, although that was pure heat instead of concussive force also
That’s fair, but I’d still argue it’s unfair to call bombshells attack a small-ish blast since she was very clearly trying to put as much power into her attack as was safe, and the entire point of a shaped charge is to focus the explosive impact into a small point to inflict disproportionately high damage.
In other words, bombshells thinking wasn’t “a big attack is to dangerous, so I’ll use a small one.” it was “a big indiscriminate explosive is a danger to others so I will use the strongest shaped charge I can manage instead.”
My point is Atomic Bombshell was holding back a lot on the power output that she’s capable of doing, and it still managed to hurt Maxima.
Still… her reaction to Max surviving the attack with no more than superficial damage suggested that even her full power may not be sufficient to seriously threaten Max, as long as she’s armored up. Dave’s notes on the page do say “Bombshell could definitely hurt her if she caught her flat footed”, but I’m guessing that shaped charge is still near the top end of her power level, though certainly not her best attack.
“her reaction to Max surviving the attack with no more than superficial damage suggested that even her full power may not be sufficient to seriously threaten Max, as long as she’s armored up”
According to Atomic Bombshell, the shaped charge could have cut a tank in half. That doesnt exactly make me think Atomic Bombshell was ‘the most powerful shot they had’ unless her actual power output was a LOT higher than that. As in ‘vaporize the entire area’ higher. Or at least ’cause scalding heat from the surrounding area’ higher. Based on her NAME alone ….. Atomic Bombshell’s full power is probably…. a lot more powerful than that. Might I suggest it might be equivalent of an Atomic Bomb? This is a guess as well, but I’m at least using her naming convention as a basis for the guess. I’m not sure why you think that the shaped charge is her max or even near her max. She seemed quite concerned about limiting the power output of her blasts in general.
Simply putm, I’m not so sure that Maxima would be able to survive an atomic bomb. Or at the very least wouldnt be SERIOUSLY hurt by one, rather than just ‘ow, my back’ hurt where she can’t just fake not being hurt. I’m not even sure she’d survive at max armor (although if anything could, it would be that), let along medium high armor, but my point is Hence why Atomic Bombshell thought it sucked that she couldnt use her full power because it would wind up killing almost everyone there?
According to DaveB, Atomic Bombshell could have hurt Maxima if she caught her flat footed, probably because usually Maxima’s armor level is at some golden triangle of armor, strength, speed all at medium. During the fight, Maxima’s armor was probably a little higher than medium, since she was coordinating and taking fire from everyone. And even at that level, it did hurt Maxima – Maxima just chose to not advertise that it did hurt.
“I’m guessing that shaped charge is still near the top end of her power level, though certainly not her best attack.”
I’m seriously doubting that based on her description of what the shaped charge was capable of doing. But I think Atomic Bombshell was probably not used to someone being able to tank even something like that, let alone her full power or near-full power.
The thing about Max’s power that is not advertised is that her power levels are variable from a total pool of power. It’s why Brut was able to hurt her – because most of her power was in speed and her armor was at its minimum level, which was still enough to SURVIVE Brut, but it still hurt her. I think Atomic Bombshell would have been able to take out Brut though, even with the shaped charge.
I also think, and this is also a guess, based on how she dresses, that Atomic Bombshell has probably not been in many fights in the first place, doesn’t generally use her powers that aggressively despite having a fairly aggressive power (she almost dressed like a hippie, which would be a funny contrast if she had nuclear power blasts) and only was in that one because of Vehemence’s influence.
In response to Pander’s comment (since apparently you can only go so many layers deep) i’d point out that Brut didn’t hurt Max, he was just able to teleport grenades past her outer force field. Even his initial surprise attack only really sent her flying. Brut explicitly said that he didn’t think his attacks would hurt her, he just expected that they’d distract her and impair her ability to fight by causing her golden globes go bounce all over the place.
Also, DaveB said that Atomic Bombshell could HURT Max. Now we can argue all day on what the criteria for hurting someone is, (like, if bombshell calls Max a potato déficit famine jockey, does that hurt her feelings?) but people can keep fighting after they’re injured even pretty severely. I mean, Hiro was sporting a bloody nose and a black eye as well as plenty of bruising during the parking lot fight. He was definitely HURT but he could keep on fighting, and Max dislocated his opponents arm but still had to give him the golden pimp slap to make sure he was going to stay down.
Lastly, while Max probably did invest in armor when bombshell attacked, she was also flying around, so if her baseline is an even speed/strength/armor split, she now has some form of a speed/strength/armor/FLIGHT spread.
“i’d point out that Brut didn’t hurt Max, he was just able to teleport grenades past her outer force field.”
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-886-insert-joke-about-airbags-here/
No, he did actually hurt her from the initial surprise attack
panel 6: Maxima: “Ow, that REALLY hurt.”
Not only did he hurt her, he managed to INJURE her jaw in the process.
panel 7: Maxima: “Ug, my jaw is all clicky now.”
“Also, DaveB said that Atomic Bombshell could HURT Max.”
I agree with you. That’s what I said as well.
“Lastly, while Max probably did invest in armor when bombshell attacked, she was also flying around, so if her baseline is an even speed/strength/armor split, she now has some form of a speed/strength/armor/FLIGHT spread.”
Even when she has minimal points put in one area, she still HAS that power. Just floating in place is not likely to need much in the way of ‘juice.’ We already saw how her powers work. She has an initial level of strength, speed, armor, flight, and plasma-blast, which are initially at a minimal (but still existing) level. Then she has a power pool, which she USUALLY places, according to DaveB in a ‘golden triangle’ of strength, speed, and armor. She can change this at will though, as needed, like she did when Vehemence was killing her (putting it ALL into armor so that she had minimal in all other areas), or when she punched Vehemence in the throat (putting it all into strength instead to be minimal in all other areas once she was no longer being choked and electrocuted by Vehemence) or when she blasted the Fel Supercarrier (putting it all into her plasma blast), or when she tanked Vehemence’s haymaker to the face (putting it all into Armor, although she CONSIDERED putting it all into Speed).
“Kevin. You want 2 weekends a month for a year?” ‘Um That sound nice?’ *points at Tom* ~Vehemence SMILE~
Yep. Get fighting and when kevin has enough to not die just point him like a gun
We don’t know the circumstances but the flashback to his first appearance in the comic suggests that Dabbler managed to solo him.
With Dabbler, Maxima, Sydney, Kevin, Hiro, and Ren here (as well as a few others that might be able to give support of some kind), I don’t think Thothogoth has much of a chance.
Dabbles managed to force him through a portal, that is not the same thing, why else do you think she’s been hiding out on this piss-ant planet?
Guess we are about to find out if the theory that Max’s power set comes from him.
Now this is a great wind-up to issue #1000. I was wondering how DaveB was planning on stretching the Vehemence arc to that magical (pun absolutely not intended) number. Now I don’t have to.
That said, let’s not assume this is going to be a cakewalk for Maxima, her team, and the Big V. The team assumed that going into #200, and at #264 (https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-264-the-team-receives-some-bad-news-or-oh-crap-is-right/ ) they started to figure out they’d completely misread the entire situation.
Of those present, only Dabbler has any idea what Tom is capable of. Very specifically, we in the audience don’t.
Right……..
Mr…”Thot O’Goth” is it?
Yeah…..
Ever heard of a guy named “Surtur”?
You know, Sydney could just drop him through an Ethereum causeway and call it a day!!
Can he breathe in space? Does he have reactionless drive?
“(Possibly ill advised) Poke.” = Certainly massive understatement :)
Depending on how the ‘Size Manipulation’ spell works, Max might have to aim low
*grabs big bag of popcorn and sets big gulp soda down for the incoming show*
Am asking my financial advisor to look into popcorn futures.
well, where is it?
sir, low carb popcorn is really hard.
we have low carb pasta, bread, and cake.
get on it! the show is getting good.
“grab my box of low carb peanut butter cups.”
Thanks, Dave Barrack! I love your writing and art. Your ability to ruin a weekend with anticipation is probably a super-power all by itself.
… We’re never going to get to see Spiders-Man Vance show off his powers, are we?
Only when it’s most hilarious and/or awesome.
Possibly even in combat against Thothogoth, should it go that way. A single spider isn’t much of a nuisance. But a host of them, making their way into places you didn’t realise you had places while you’re distracted by the bigger combatants before all biting at once?
Vance’s claimed power would be very disconcerting, during combat or no.
Memories of Skitter’s fighting style intensifies.
Scionia’s robot appears to have done a skin peel in https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-520-from-distress-to-datstress/
Nothing good is going to come of this interaction. Tothogoth needs to think before he speaks.
…I’ll prepare the “And that’s when he knew…he fucked up” clip…
along with ” hi guess wondering how i got here” clip cliche XD
To all of those who say Maxima will totally curb-stomp Thoth: well, we really don’t know his current power level, do we? Yes, Dabbler managed to defeat him at one point… but he could’ve grown stronger. Also, she defeated him one-on-one… but we don’t know anything about Thoth’s army, do we?
On the other hand, this situation could be still be a case of a massive misunderstanding. Maybe Thoth is really a leader of a galactic peacekeeping force and his “army” is a billion of cosmic goodwill workers… ;)
Much like in real life, heroes (and heroines) are not defined by their strengths, but by their limitations. Aside from her defeat at the hands of Vehemance (neatly overturned by the proceeding fight), Maxima doesn’t appear to have any limitations whatsoever. If she had any, she may have considered the strategic (and possibly political) ramifications of confronting a 50-foot creature from who knows where, with who knows what powers, and had not exhibited any overt hostility to this point. He has stated very little of his intentions and only referenced a previous deal with Dabbler that she has not fulfilled, which she hasn’t denied. I imagine Max is thinking along ideological lines (male aggressor, female victim) and if she’s allowed to get away with it (by, say, defeating yet another super-powered being with appaarant ease), she will become more of an ideological icon, instead of a character.
TL;DR: It’s never a good idea to insert yourself in someone else’s domestic squabble…it’s always messy and you never have enough relevant info or context to sort it out.
Part of Max’s interruption may be a friend’s intervention between Tom and Xuriel, but I think the primary motivation is that Max is also the leader of the supernatural response team, and her active training exercise with a work-release super-criminal is being interrupted by an unknown supernatural being with a hostile attitude. It’s literally her job as to intervene and determine an appropriate response before things get out of hand.
He _literally_ said he’s going to invade.
Dude.
Right, my first thought as well – but not until after she’d insisted (twice) that he justify his presence. Now that he’s openly declared war, the gloves can come off.
I doubt Max loses to this guy. I also doubt this guy is going to die in the next couple of pages either though.
If he does go down within the next 15 pages, DaveB would have to have something else ready to roll out for page 1000.
My bet if so? Hidden, for traceability without risking accidental spoilers if lucky. On the page where the number gains a figure, a major character gains a figure. A new recruit to the team isn’t unusual enough for such a one-off occasion. An extra body for Harem would be the obvious foreshadowed one, but she may not be ‘major’ enough. An extra Orb-equivalent for Sydney, or the unlocking of the seventh that she currently has?
Ah yes the famous ego of the demon when encountering any mortal regardless of their power. The question is if he can actually back that up or if he is relying on some fear aura or something to try and make Maxima stand out..in short is he bluffing.
So I just realized this guy’s got the Iron Man aesthetic going on, complete with arc reactor… is that intentional?
There seems to be two ways this can go.
1) Maxima could find herself outmatched. Possible since this guy is supposed to be one of the ‘boss level’ enemies from the splash page, and so far the two she’s already fought have given her PLENTY of problems (one of whom almost killed her), even with backup and her not holding back at all. It would put Thothogoth in a different level of bad guy than the usual baddies. It might also make sense because Thothogoth apparently knows SOMETHING about Maxima’s power levels, and seems to think that, even with her abilities, he would be able to defeat her.
2) Maxima could horribly beat the hell out of him in a laughably one-sided manner. This would also make sense because of how Thothogoth is acting – it’s practically SCREAMING for a ‘Arrogant jerk villain gets totally pwned’ response. When villains sometimes go overboard on being jerks, it makes it a lot easier for the narrative to call for them to be thoroughly or brutally trounced, like Salsa McSpacklewall’s fate against Cora (he went overboard on being outrageously evil, no nuance whatsoever in his evil-ness, so therefore he HAD to die in a particularly brutal fashion). It might be a little more boring overall because of all the build-up that went into Thothogoth’s arrival (dozens of pages alluding to how powerful this guy is supposed to be and how dangerous he is), but in the more immediate time, it would be very satisfying to some readers.
A couple of things to consider:
1. Despite the size difference, Max probably beats him in terms of sheer stats. Strength, speed, and durability all in her favor.
2. However, there’s one aspect no one has mentioned: magic. A great deal of the power hierarchy among demons is measured by their mastery of the arcane arts. This guy is some sort of boss among demons, so I expect he packs a powerful arcane arsenal.
3. Remember that Dabbler was able to hold her own against Maxima with her magic. And that was a more-or-less friendly spar. If Maxima continues to piss this guy off, we’re going to see how well she holds up against a truly hostile spellcaster of comparable level.
It’s true that Max can’t really hold her own vs. magic. But Dabbles is right here to buff, debuff, dispell, shield, or counterspell him as required – and apparently she’s somewhere near the same league as he is in that department.
Syd’s shield also seems to protect from enchantment, and she’s got a bang-bang that’s pretty damn high tier, possibly in the same class as Maxima’s as well as a pretty deep set of powers that gives her a hell of a lot of options, many of which could be incredibly effective and simultaneously completely unexpected.
And then there’s physical violence. Max is hard as hell and faster than bullets. When Kevin gets powered up, he’s possibly the ONLY creature on the planet better than Max at physical violence. Finally, we don’t really have a good idea yet how powered-up Anvil can get. Depending on where her top end is, she could be in the same ‘ultra’ tier. Finally, if she and Kevin cooperate, they could work some fairly astonishing combos, like taking turns throwing each other at the guy as missiles.
I’m just saying, While Max herself does have a weakness or two in terms of magic, the team she’s on does not. Dabbler or Syd are capable of protecting her from magic. And taking the team into account, there is huge potential for first-class hurt here that he’s probably not aware of.
“But Dabbles is right here to buff, debuff, dispell, shield, or counterspell him as required – and apparently she’s somewhere near the same league as he is in that department.”
One problem with that is that for Dabbler to do that, she’d have to be outside of Sydney’s shield, which leaves her vulnerable to attack. Sydney’s shield is magic-proof.
“And then there’s physical violence. Max is hard as hell and faster than bullets.”
Again, we don’t know if that means ANYTHING compared to Thothogoth yet.
“When Kevin gets powered up, he’s possibly the ONLY creature on the planet better than Max at physical violence.”
Again not entirely true. There are several others we’ve seen that have done well against Maxima, or that Maxima thinks might be a match for her, like Vale and the super who she THINKS was killed (but isnt). The Super Mannekiller also had managed to stop her, and if not for Hiro’s intervention and a cracked lens on the Super Mannekiller to help her resist at all, Maxima might have lost that fight. We only know one thing for sure, and that’s that Maxima is one of the most powerful SUPERS on the planet. That doesnt mean the most powerful anything on the planet, let alone in the galaxy or universe.
“Finally, we don’t really have a good idea yet how powered-up Anvil can get.”
Again, that would require Anvil to be outside of the shield and thus vulnerable to all sorts of danger that kinetic absorption might be useless against. Remember, Anvil dived behind Sydney’s shield during the Super mannekiller fight when it was about to blow up because she knew, despite her powers, that she’d get killed or at least seriously injured from that type of non-kinetic explosion.
“Finally, if she and Kevin cooperate, they could work some fairly astonishing combos, like taking turns throwing each other at the guy as missiles.”
This is true. Plus there’s Blulk (I will keep calling him that until someone gives a better name and I do not care #Blulk4Ever) as well which can also be a force multiplier.
“I’m just saying, While Max herself does have a weakness or two in terms of magic, the team she’s on does not. ”
Ummmm with the exception of Sydney and Dabbler, no one on the team has any defense against magic.
“And taking the team into account, there is huge potential for first-class hurt here that he’s probably not aware of.”
Thothogoth is a boss level character, and so far each boss level character has managed to easily hold their own or better against not just Maxima, but several members of ARC-Swat as well simultaneously (Sciona at the mountain hidehout, Vehemence at the restaurant fight, and Death Toll also at the restaurant fight if you want to consider him a boss level character).
He really shouldnt be casually dismissed as a cakewalk, unless DaveB is going to go with a subversion of expectations thing here, Rian Johnson-style. Which if I had to make a guess, he’s not going to do since there’s been so much foreshadowing and buildup to Thothogoth so far.
“1. Despite the size difference, Max probably beats him in terms of sheer stats. Strength, speed, and durability all in her favor.”
Why do you assume that about Thothogoth vs Maxima in terms of strength, speed, and durability? Do you have any examples? I think you’re just making an assumption here without any actual basis. We’ll need to actually see more evidence of anything happening first.
I mean it’s a good guess, but it’s only a guess, and not really based on anything that’s been in the comic so far. The last time Maxima faced off against something Thothogoth’s size (the Squidward Kaiju), her initial response was to retreat. That could have been because of being with other who were more vulnerable than her, or more likely because she had no idea if she could tank their hits or not, so without knowing, the tactical smart play is a strategic retreat.
” However, there’s one aspect no one has mentioned: magic.”
Yep, that’s true. Thothogoth likely has a lot of magic, and Dabbler mainly is able to fight Maxima and Math to a standstill (or win) because of magic, despite being physically weaker and slower, and a less skilled fighter.
“Remember that Dabbler was able to hold her own against Maxima with her magic.”
I agree. And like you said, both Dabbler and Maxima hold back when sparring. This would not involve a lot of holding back.
to add to those points.
on Alari prime, their portal home was shrinking and they had nothing to gain by sticking around to fight an unknown enemy that attacks indiscriminately as far as they could tell.
but also yes we have zero data points on Thothogoth’s strength, Dabbler may have defeated him once but the circumstances are unknown and her method looked to be a banishment spell not direct conflict.
We also have nothing on the Maxima vs Dabbler fight, such as if it was a sparring match or a superhero first encounter mistaken motives type fight. A sparring match to a stand still just means both parties reached a point they couldn’t defeat the other using less than lethal methods; we don’t know if Dabbler or Maxima would win in a death battle. So as far as we know Dabbler without resorting to lethal spells and weapons couldn’t get past Maxima’s defenses, and Maxima without resorting to atomization moves couldn’t get past Dabbler’s defense spells. There is a point of *okay, better not use my next up move because while the last didn’t break their defenses, the next one might kill them if it does*.
Maxima after all has never shot her strongest beam at Sydney’s shield to test it, or hit it as hard as she could. She stops short and tries to guess how strong it is from there.
Also if Thothogoth is handwaving taking down a Fel carrier than either he is bluffing or he has some Disgaea demon lord power behind him and can do the same himself.
“Dabbler may have defeated him once but the circumstances are unknown and her method looked to be a banishment spell not direct conflict.”
Couldnt have said it better myself. The only clue at all I see to her escaping/temporarily banishing him might have something to do with that glowing gem in his chest, since in her flashback, there were little pieces of similar gems on the ground.
‘We also have nothing on the Maxima vs Dabbler fight, such as if it was a sparring match or a superhero first encounter mistaken motives type fight.”
Also true. The only concrete spar result with Dabbler that we know about is that she is one of only two people who have ever beaten Math in a fight (Maxima being the other one), and Dabbler had to use some sort of spell involving ‘sticky air’ whatever that means in order to win. Dabbler’s main method of winning fights against people who are more powerful than her tends to rely on her ‘jack of all trades, master of none’ build. Because she’s an expert in so many areas, she’s more likely to be able to attack with significant, if not ultimate, power in an area where her opponent is weak. IE, she can’t beat heavenly sword in swordfighting, so instead she uses magic to freeze her in place then electrocute her. She can’t beat Math in pure fighting skill, so she does something to make him ‘stuck in the air’ since then he can’t use his phenomenal martial prowess. The only evidence we’ve seen so far in any sort of fight between Dabbler and Maxima, aside from Maxima’s admission that there are only two people to ever fight her to a standstill (and Dabbler’s nudge to Sydney that one of those people is Dabbler) is she’s capable of making shields which a pissed off Maxima can’t simply punch through like it was nothing.
I wouldnt be surprised if their first fight was a ‘heroes meet, so they have to fight first’ sort of thing though :)
“Maxima after all has never shot her strongest beam at Sydney’s shield to test it, or hit it as hard as she could. She stops short and tries to guess how strong it is from there.”
This is also true, although she has shot at Sydney with a beam greater than what she used to liquefy the tank and create a fireball in the desert, since we know that she would have used something equal or less than what she knows for sure that Sydney’s shield can tank before putting the press in danger. I do think, however, that Sydney’s shield might be one of the few things in the universe that MIGHT be able to tank Maxima’s explodiest explosion. Mainly based on the sheet amount of damage to the surrounding area that happened after the Squidward Kaiju’s blast was BARELY held back by Sydney’s shield.
And if Sydney’s shield is not now capable of resisting Maxima’s max plasma blast, then probably when Sydney upgrades her shield – which is still not at the peak of what it CAN withstand (4 pips currently). I think Maxima is amazingly powerful, but I think Nth tech is probably going to be even more powerful than Maxima, especially if it gets to it’s peak effectiveness.
“Also if Thothogoth is handwaving taking down a Fel carrier than either he is bluffing or he has some Disgaea demon lord power behind him and can do the same himself.”
Excellent point that I hadnt considered. Thothogoth is really not seeming to be that worried about someone who was able to bring down a Fel Supercarrier with one shot, which means he can probably handle something of that magnitude, so at the very least, he probably has some sort of counter to the plasma blast.
That, or like you said, he’s REALLY good at bluffing.
which thinking about it, Dabbler had to use magic to defeat a human (assuming Math doesn’t have access to Ki/chi enhancement techniques like no super muscle boost Kaioken technique stuff or Hadoken), which tells us
at best a regular human can reach D class in the super hero ranking without boost abilities, (peak human performance borderline on super power, when classing physical traits like strength, durability, agility, stamina; this is the breaking many bricks with your hand, leaping your own height, no need for rest on long runs, ect…range; basically all around peak performance, or just above it *one can argue F and D on these stats honestly).
but that said, this likely means Dabbler in the sparring with Maxima had to be turtleling, Maxima couldn’t go through defenses, Dabbler had nothing to take down maxima.
but that raises some eyebrows, demon lords are rarely (on the supernatural powerscale) below an A class, you see some B class demon generals, but get up that rank and below A is rare, S is actually fairly common for high ranking demon lords.
Unless this is less a brutality demon system and more a cunning one (more common for devils), in which case rank may not be linked to power.
so yeah back to either he is super bluffing, or Maxima is staring down Trigon/Surtur pretty much.
“at best a regular human can reach D class in the super hero ranking without boost abilities,”
Lets give Math his due. The ONLY person he has never beaten in a straight up fight without magic being used has been Maxima.
Which means he’s beaten Anvil, Hiro, Stalwart, Mr Amorphous, Achilles, Heatwave, Jiggawatt, Jabberwokky, Blulk (I will call him that forever until he has an official superhero name #Blulk4ever), Harem, Varia, and any other superpowered member, and probably also all the non-superpowered members as well. Plus he beat multiple supers in the Super fight and only got beaten there by Jabberwokky because he got distracted by her exposed boobies).
Not beating Maxima doesnt really mean a normal human can only reach ‘D Class’ – although as Maxima said, he’s so skilled at martial arts that deciding whether he’s a super or not is ultimately a futile exercise. :)
“so yeah back to either he is super bluffing, or Maxima is staring down Trigon/Surtur pretty much.”
Yep, I completely agree. And as we saw in Teen Titans vs Justice League, Superman (and the rest of the Justice League combined) vs Trigon is pretty much in Trigon’s favor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cuw-iI7QGeU
(sorry that it’s in spanish, couldnt find one in english of this fight)
Ultimately in that fight, the only one who had been able to beat Trigon had been Raven (who has been beaten by Supergirl before, more than once) – mainly because of Raven’s tie to Trigon via the crystal that she bound him with.
I mean yes, it’s possible that DaveB will just have Maxima utterly decimate Thothogoth here, but it does seem like not the best use of all the setup for him, not to mention given how each boss character so far has taken an entire storyline to either beat or even just thwart the plans of so far.
Dabbler seems to know Tom well and she is not afraid of him. Should be easy enough to handle.
Dabbler is safely behind Sydney’s shield. It adds a bit of courage when you’re safe from physical coercion. She’s afraid enough of him that she’s been hiding out on Earth specifically to keep off his radar, according to the convo she had with Cora.
True. Also it would be in Dabblers playfull nature to smack talk even if she was afraid. Also she is very old and experienced so I think she know how to hide her fear.
That is also true. Although I’m betting she might not be that old compared to Thothogoth. He seems to be similar in age, if not older. I’m sort of basing it on the flashback to the classroom where someone who looks A LOT LIKE Thothogoth seems to be the either one of the other students or the Teacher’s Assistant (he doesnt have a desk while the students do).
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-311-succubi-rarely-diet-insert-joke-about-juice-cleanse/
(Last panel, all the way to the left, near a young Dabbler and young Cthulhu and Him. Wearing a white shirt.)
They know eachother very well so its possible they were a highschool couple. I like the idea of Dabbler in a honest romantical relationship.
Me too. At the very least, it would be humorous. Especailly if he’s basically ‘Mr. Tantalus.’
Especially of Tom is the mother of their children.
Ok…. that would be a fun twist.
Kind of wonder if Syd is using her true sight orb. Since Denver said he’s losing the spell and it’s something to do with size change, it might be a pure illusion that you’re seeing now.
Also considering the last time we saw tom he was probably only maybe 2 to 3 times as tall as dabbler.
Also wonder about what career he went down, and what the agreement actually was
“Kind of wonder if Syd is using her true sight orb.”
If she is, it would have to be during this comic, because the last comic, she was only holding the shield orb in the next-to-last panel.
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-983-business-or-pleasure/
Kevin might literally explode if these two start fighting.
Y’know, ‘explode’ is not the word we usually use for the moment of peak physical gratification, but in his case I guess it’ll do.
Might I propose ‘evilgasm‘ as a descriptive compromise.
If Dabbler is powerful, one would assume this devil would be equally powerful, even if he may have some inferiority complex. Maybe it’ll finally be a challenge for Max.
Mr. Trotogoth, or whatever your name is, did you just threaten an American citizen, soldier, and superhero, with an outright invasion? you’ve never been to earth, have you? especially not in the last 1200 to 200 years. you don’t know what you’re getting into.
(this next part is tangential, you don’t haft to read it if you don’t like the exploration of historic memes)
(depending on how you draw the line, the roots of American culture can be considered to have started forming anytime between the Norman invasion and the American revolution. at any point on that timeline, Americans and the people who would form the core of the future USA have had “foreign invasion as one of the driving factors of their cultural inertia. alongside “occupying foreign leader class”.)
Oh, he gone LOSE that finger
All his talk or Order makes me wonder what will happen if Maxima does ever encounter someone with authority in a situation that is bigger than her own. As she’s tread very heavily on ‘I am a representive of the American military, that means I have authority here’ but we haven’t really seen any interplanetary organizations challenge that. The closest we’ve seen was the magical organization and even then, she played the ‘no, my authority is bigger’ card.
It would be interesting to see what happens if she ends up overseas/in space and how she responds to situations where she doesn’t have that ‘I can just tell people what to do, legally’.
Having authority also means having the means to back that authority up with force, possibly all the way up to lethal force. Just like our own police forces are able to.
If said “galactic authority” representative gets turned into either a sticky red puddle or a giant scorch mark, they may reconsider whether it is worth the cost of trying to impose their authority and if their authority really does extend to Earth. An “all these places, except Earth” approach.
The issue there is that there is force other than throwing punches and Maxima doesn’t have unlimited authority. For example, if she was implicated in a crime in say…France…the police likely couldn’t overpower her but having her simply ignore that would be a bad look.
Which is sorta what I’m curious about seeing. How Maxima ends up handling a situation where she can’t just overpower the situation (Either with physical force or legal threats).