Grrl Power #705 – Hot tub space machine
First time making out with an alien cutie? Probably a good idea to take a moment and sort out all potential cultural baggage. Luckily Sydney is well familiarized with the trope.
Generally speaking, setting up some boundaries the first time you make out with anyone isn’t the worst idea either. The danger there is that you start outlining stuff like “Okay, you can stick your finger in my ear, but not your tongue, but if you stick anything in my butt, then I don’t want that appendage anywhere near my ear…” and the other person is like, “Whoa, I was just hoping to get to second base, you’re already planning the 5th inning.”
The idea of a bath or pool seems really weird on a spaceship, because we’re all used to Star Trek and seeing people getting knocked around the bridge when they’re in a battle or a gravitational whatsit. Large jarring movements don’t sit well with the idea of any sized body of liquid, be it a coffee cup or an Olympic pool. Presumably, the inertial dampeners on Cora’s ship are top of the line, or the tub is usually drained into tanks when not in use. Probably both, really.
I want to see an episode of a Star Trek like show where instead of the people on the bridge getting thrown around, they cut to a guy in his quarters trying to build a house of cards or a ship in a bottle. That or the daycare, and show a bunch of kids cartwheeling around in the air. I could actually see The Orville do the first one. Maybe not the one with the kids though.
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*hagrid voice* you’re a furry, halo.
She is totally not furry! She just likes buff sexy dudes covered in fur and sporting animal(ish) head…
I don’t think she’s picky, fur is just a plus
She’s a rock star – lost a few hundred light years from home, killed TWO planet-buster boss baddies in short order, kept her shit together enough to form a tactical plan that resulted in a huge power boost, and is currently cruising around with a Malien harem at her disposal, on a ship that puts anything the 24th century Starfleet had to shame. In a day full of several huge firsts, why not join the 100,000 Mile High Club with a sexy wolf-man (but he’s hung like a horse).
Compared to her reaction to Hiro, Frix probably isn’t horse size.
This feels like a job FOR MATH!!! :D Oh man, my browser history is going to get weirder …
I’d say her pupils traveled the full range in her field of view, roughly 30 degrees. Let’s figure she’s at slightly further than arms reach – the scene is intimate but she’s still a bit apprehensive. She’s 5″ tall so on average her arms are going to be 23ish inches long. Let’s say Frix is about 26 inches away, in case she’s being extra observant and keeping just out of his reach (instead of keeping him out of her reach). Next it’s a pretty easy geometry question for sides of a triangle. First our sides:
A – What we’re measuring on Frix
B – 26 inches distance between Sydney and Frix
C – Hypotenuse.
And some easy angles:
30 degrees at Sydney (intersection of B and C)
90 degrees at the intersection between A and B
60 degrees at the intersection between A and C
This works out to a side A measurement of 15 inches. Since her eyes are travelling straight down, I’m going to assume that he’s not standing at attention (yet). Google informs me that this is on the middle-to-small side for a horse, but definitely in the ballpark. Assuming this goes well, she’ll be flying for a few days to disguise the bow legs.
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/2496 (see the bottom)
One problem; object A was in motion. Over those three panels Frix went from standing on the side to standing in the pool.
I totally approve the compulsive use of math. Unfortunately, it is probable that her sight is just following the center of said object A in its motion. When trying to estimate the size of an object, we look at the center and estimate the distance and the perceived area. We only really move our line of sight if it occupies more than a field of view.
Oh! math. I thought you meant Math, and I was wondering how he got here. Probably his porn sense cut in and he just materialized here.
How?
and I mean this in a rather bad experience way. I USED to be into a sub-set of Furre scene, but GATE KEEPER types ruined the whole experience *first toxic fanbase experience*. My fursona was a 14 foot tall magical werewolf…I was always into things like cat-girls, centaurs, mermaids, lamia/naga, and so on. But apparently THOSE don’t qualify as furre according to some.
There was never a clear divide; I mean I used to have almost everything I did was animal like, a thief fox-girl named Vix the Vixen, aliens that were animal like (Kik: fox like) and (Kuhrai: cat like), even cat like vampires (Lit), among numerous other things.
But from my experience it seems “furre” was only referring to HUMANS that just happened to have anthropomorphic animal shapes. Like he’s a hedgehog but he’s like 99% human just with animal features overlayed ontop of that.
But I was more into what many try to claim is *totally* different, like yokai frog girls, slug girls, eel mermaids, octo-girls (now commonly called Scylla), as well as Centaurs, werewolves, cat-girls, ect…
if there was anything supernatural about them these gate keepers were quick to go on the attack.
But I realized, them or the anti-furre; the truth is almost everyone has some animal feature kink they like, bat wings, bird wings *on the back like demons or angels*, animal eyes, fangs, claws, horns, hooves, a tail of some kind.
So yeah, call yourself whatever you want, divide yourselves up however you want, its arbitrary. I can like Felicia from Darkstalkers AND Lola Bunny, and you call yourself whatever.
She’s so adorable!
Personally I find ladies like Sydney (as in the whole package body, mind and personality) to be cute and quite sexy.
For me, it’s the willingness to admit we’re all still kids who don’t know what the heck we’re doing, and we just want to have fun. (Which is pretty much exactly what Sydney’s default non-battle mode is like.)
To sum it up even better:
XKCD
She is going for it people!! -starts tearing up- They grow up so fast!!!!
-BAWLING LOUDLY-
Having fond memories of the very first time Serpentor overthrew you, I presume?
He got his in the end, all thanks to me! And no thanks to working with my greatest foes. Nope, that part never happened.
And making synthoid versions of giant robots? How’d THAT plan work out for ya?
Worked out quite well for Old Snake. He got away when the other villains got arrested.
Per Dabblers Advice I hope she has a lint roller handy.
From the look on her face in the first few panels its not the only thing growing fast. Lets just hope it isn’t spikey like a cat’s.
I think Schlock Mercenary has actually had similar scenes like that where someone’s doing something innocuous only to end up suffering the effects of inertial dampers glitching resulting in things going awry.
They did. First major encounter with it here- https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2005-09-18
Airplane, also – the guy trying to shave in the itty bitty loo.
With a pool on the ship too.
2016’s Passengers had a pretty good scene with gravity loss and a pool with some fun visuals
Although from a scientific perspective, while water does stick to things in zero gravity, I couldn’t think of a good reason why she wouldn’t be able to swim hard enough to get her arms and head outside the ball of water at all, let alone a few seconds to breathe. Or that the surface tension suddenly ratcheted up to a ridiculous level and the various masses of water started chasing her like some tentacle from The Abyss.
Humans are boyant in water. she would have been expelled to the surface of the ball same as floating on a flat pool.
Not so. Buoyancy is a function of gravity acting on objects different density. In zero G all the forces cancel out so density makes no difference. Put a piece of styrofoam in a bubble of water and it will stay there.
Yeah that whole zero g scene (and a lot of them) have the problem of things starting to float the moment gravity turns off. It’s lack of gravity not an upwards force.
By chance, I’m checking out a song I heard on the background of a YouTube video, which turned out to be slow and somewhat sexy- thus quite appropriate for what’s happening.
Have a good one, Sydney. :-)
“First time making out with an alien cutie?”
I get the feeling Frix has done this before.
I’m sure the entire crew is well versed in “First Contact” Protocols ;)
I think they also happen to be well-versed (& well-practiced) in “Subsequent-From-First Contact” protocols too…
Smug doggo
smuggo
With that sense of humor he and Sydney will be fine together.
I see pools in spaceships to be quite useful in the case of taking in guests who need a body of water to survive.. But it would be a lot of excess water just to go and take a hot bath…
But with a good filtration system and a cover when it is not used, the pool could double as a reservoir for drinkable water..
David Weber uses that in his “Honorverse” series as an excuse for having swimming pools on board ships.
I seem to remember the pools in the honorverse to be used as part of the gym. OTOH, even the smallest capital ships were gigantic and a Pinnace was the size of a 747.
in the FLAG officer’s gym. Rank does have it’s privileges and I think they’re relatively small, enough for laps and such, not Olympic size of anything like that. and probably more of an “Infinity” pool type anyway
Some scify universes have really big ships. The capital ships of WH:40k are like 5km long and one high and wide and have crews in the tens to hundreds of thousands. Then there are the really big ones. The really big one offs on the imperial side are like 80km long and like 10 wide and high with crews in the millions.
Considering we’re talking about a very futuristic ship, i’d put my guess towards systems for controlling the water to stay in its place.
Firstly, some kind of force field that would cover the pool when unneeded. Alternatively, specifically crafted gravity generators to pull the water down even when natural gravity works another way.
Secondly, any type of filtration and cleaning would be more sophisticated than simply sucking out dirty and shooting out clean water.
Thirdly, special cleaners, sponge materials and/or inlets that would suck the excess water from around the pool (splashed by mistake or otherwise).
Like seriously, who wants to clean the whole pool room, scrub the floors and the pool itself clean, when you could have special equipment for that.
and finally, a translucent aluminum cover in case power fails and/or drunk partiers need a non-transparent warning not to dive into aluminum floors.
Transparent Aluminum?!
Glass-steal. Its what they make ‘ship portholes/windows from in any decent sci-fi series.
Stolen glass is the best for windows.
Plascrete and plasteel, in the Honorverse. Grayson Skydomes uses Mantie transparent construction materials to cover and enclose entire cities.
The Geth in Mass Effect are the most practical: They don’t have structural weaknesses like windows.
Warships use Armaplast, Civilian applications use the cheaper Crystoplast. And I believe you’re thinking Ceramacrete. I think Plascrete and Plasteel are Anne/Todd McCaffery’s thing
Transparasteel in the early Star Wars EU
It’s a real thing! Aluminium oxynitride is the name of the ceramic. It’s transparent and four times as hard as silica glass. It can stop bullets with about halve the thickness compared to bullet prof glass.
Transparent aluminum isn’t as far fetched as you’d think: https://science.howstuffworks.com/transparent-aluminum-armor.htm
Granted it isn’t QUITE aluminum, as you think, in foil or aluminum pans etc, it’s more a ceramic. BUT it is aluminum based and transparent and QUITE strong.
In a post scarcity civilization, why not make the pool cover-plate out of AlON (AKA transparent aluminium/artificial sapphire)?
It would cerainly be an impressively large piece of artificial sapphire, with the added bonus of not requiring power to remain in place.
If the pools were designed to take the stresses of the sudden expansion, it might be as simple as just freezing the water in place in order to keep it in place. Some sort of science fictiony reverse microwave that sucks the heat out in a matter of nanoseconds. Just make sure that when the “everybody out of the pool” whistle blows you don’t ignore it.
It would take way, way too much energy to perform freeze/thaw cycles in an acceptable time frame, and water expands about 9% when frozen which would destroy or at least deform the container significantly. Much simpler to slide a cover into place, and it can be as fancy as you want – and double as a prop for pool-based party shenanigans.
One could also pump in a touch more water and replace any remaining air to make it completely full, which would help reduce the sloshing effect.
All of this discussion on water containment systems & not one of them has mentioned the most obvious one that also happens to be apparent when we see how the crew gets around…Gravity Control configured to orient everything to the decks they walk on. That would also keep the water inside of an uncovered pool.
Of course, they would also have to be equipped to put a cover on such storage tanks, especially when under combat conditions, when the decks might get shaking, but under normal (& calm) cruising conditions, they wouldn’t need to have any such covers in place.
Heck, just the fact that the crew of the Enterprise didn’t have to “float around” to get anywhere on the ship shows that Gravity Control is something that’s been a part of sci-fi stories for a long time.
Schlock Mercenary did a thing with aquiring a semi-aquatic species’ starship as salvage and discovering the massive indoor pond/pools (complete with fish and weeds) while the ship was tilted at an inconvenient angle…
Good read on Frix’s part, too. A bit of comedic overreacting to break the tension. Perfect audience for it, too. I like him even more.
Actually, it’s not all that difficult to handle a pool on a spacecraft, assuming it doesn’t have to be immediately accessible.
You just add a lid(maybe with a nice opening like an iris), and retractable/folding baffles.
We already use baffles in large tanks on ships and even in some cars just for this issue.
It depends on how big your ‘pool’ is, whether you’re using a-grav or spin for gravity, how powerful your orion drive is and if you have time to spin down to come to ‘battle stations’. The waterpark might experience ‘slosh’…but it’s not even fiddly bits. Internet cookie if people know what I’m referring to.
Greg Bear’s novel Eon? I remember them mentioning pools having sloshing protection to show how the asteroid and its drive mechanism had been upgraded over the years.
How ‘fiddly’ can that waterpark be if it’s the result of a bobbled beam in the main bay of a giant ball-bearing? Though keeping the water warm with that much cold iron around might be a problem…
The standard kinetic solution of Parking a Comet (Parker) in it won’t work here.
If you look back a page or two you can see the shape of the bath is self-baffleing (and spell check barfed on both possible forms of the word, so the heck with it). The narrow neck between the pools would reduce sloshing to the small disturbance that could find its way through.
Aside from the comically huge lower jawful of teeth and no chin in panel 10 (third-to-last panel, aka far left bottommost row) when she’s shouting “WHAT?!”…every single other shot of Sydney’s face is freakin’ adorable.
And DaveB, if you don’t put in every single one of the Syndey faces on this page (yes, even panel 10) into the banner rotation queue (you can use a speech-bubble-free version if you absolutely must)…ya might be facin’ an internet lynchin’ mob. Just sayin’.
Also, mad MAD props for continuing this demonstration of how consent should work in situations like this. Including the “okay, we have a slight misunderstanding going on that started to snowball, so I just wanna clear that up, but at the same not stop everything dead cold, since it turns out it’s proceeding in a direction I bashfully admit I like…” of this particular page. I love seeing stuff like this in entertainment sources…because we need to see good consent being modeled in our entertainments. What we see (or read, etc), we tend to absorb and internalize, and then enact directly, or discuss with others. So this is fantastic, thank you!
…Also, Frix’ expression in panel 11 (bottom row, middle) is perfect.
I agree, Dave, a masterful job on the expression. Smugness/suppressed hilarity is at maximum.
“It started to snowball, but I kind of like where it’s going.”
I lurrrrve the last 2 panels :D
Especially making a furry alien look like successfully holding back laughter, that is… I have no words for it. :D
Agreed, because that is not normally a set of facial expressions on facial features most artists practice, and yet DaveB did an outstandingly fantastic job of conveying not just one emotion, but several of them crammed together in a single expression…on a literally furry face, which softens and obscures things. (Mobile canine-like ears can make up for some of it, but not for everything!)
“. . .this demonstration of how consent should work. . .”
Yeah, it’s all cool so far. Just so long as they don’t fall into the paranoid, misanthropic vortex of feminist ‘affirmative consent.’ My eyes would roll right out of my skull.
Many years from now: It’s convenient for me for political reasons to say that I did not consent to something that I can’t remember if it even happened, never mind where and when exactly. Oh and I’ve never actually met the person.
This is literally stuff that happened. I may be living in a 3rd world country but at least I don’t have to live in America and have to deal with monumental BS like that lol. It’s beyond f-ed up.
Things haven’t gone completely to crap yet.
California, so far, is the only state that’s signed Affirmative Consent into law, and even there it was shot down for being unconstitutional.
Canada is the country that’s actually passing laws blocking evidence, that a sex-crime accuser lied, from being admissible in court.
Do you have a citation for the California affirmative consent law being found unconstitutional? I missed that.
Hmm, now that I look for it, I can’t find it. Maybe I’m mistaken and the U.S. is in worse shape than I thought.
I have found instances where judges had unflattering things to say about it, and plenty of musings about how it violates the Fifth Amendment, but I could have sworn I heard something about the California Supreme Court.
Yeah, I live in California and thought I would have heard about something like that, but there’s a lot to keep up with these days. I googled and didn’t see anythin besides a lot of people worrying that the system might get abused. Which I don’t see as a valid criticism, as every system can be abused, and I’ve seen no evidence that this system is more likely to be misused than any other.
Do you have a source on that Canada thing? That sounds like another case of someone not understanding the details of a law then spreading around that it’s a “real thing in “.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/government-bringing-sexual-assault-law-up-to-speed-with-the-courts-times/article35213485/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je65790syn8
Yeah I figured so. It’s not preventing them from saying they lied about it. It’s preventing abusive defenses like “it can’t be rape because she’s slept with people in the past”.
Things like “the victim has a proven history of lying about being raped” would still be let through baring standard protections about using someone’s past crimes against them in a separate trial.
Wait, here’s a video from just yesterday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtcWnXygako
You shouldn’t believe everything you read on the internet lol. Things don’t actually work that way in real life, no matter how much conservatives try to make consent into a boogyman. What’s happening here would be perfectly acceptable anywhere.
I always worry when I encounter people who pretend like affirmative consent is some sort of “feminist oppression.” Like asking a person to take reasonable steps to get consent is imposing an undue burden. I would think that the majority of people would prefer that their partners want to be there, but a surprising number of people seem to view willing participation as an insurmountable challenge.
Of course, I’m old enough to remember when people said the same things about “no means no.” The idea that consent was actually important used to be controversial. I assume the pushback now is mostly people who aren’t used to being asked to behave responsibly worrying that they’re not up to the task.
Under affirmative consent law, brushing your partner’s hair out of their face during sex without explicit permission is rape.
That law and the people who support it are retarded. It’s unenforceable and counterproductive. How do you prove they said yes?
This is the sort of thing that makes men demand women provide video evidence of consent.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/fabulous/7867376/women-consent-videos-before-sex-recorded-accused-rape-assault/
That’s not how affirmative consent laws work at all. I’d understand (and agree with) the resistance to affirmative consent laws if they worked in any way like that. Someone has lied to you about how these laws work.
In California, “affirmative consent” simply requires that consent be affirmative, conscious, and voluntary. I hope you’re not objecting to conscious or voluntary, as those actually strike me as pretty obvious and self-explanatory.
The affirmative element also isn’t a big hurdle if the people you have sex with actually want to have sex with you. All it requires is that every party to a sexual act take reasonable steps under the circumstances to make sure that the other parties consent. You don’t have to sign a contract or get express verbal permission for every act, you just have to do enough that a reasonable person would believe that everyone involved wanted to participate.
If that feels like too much for you, you probably shouldn’t have sex with anyone, because you run a real risk of getting in trouble even under the old “no means no” standard.
Also, brushing the hair out of someone’s face is under most circumstances not going to be sexual assault. The only exception I can think of is if you touch someone while they’re having sex with someone else without their permission, and even there it would likely qualify as harassment rather than assault.
You don’t get it. The woman can at a later date claim there was no consent and the guy’s life will be ruined. His word against hers. metoo has proven what happens in that situation. Has happened many, MANY times, will happen many more times. Men have died because of this. Get your head out of the sand and out of the feminist bubble and listen to some center left people like timpool (because anyone right of that is a naaaaahhhtzzzeeee right?)
There was a social contract where your scenario worked but it no longer exist in the west. Congrats and I hope it doesn’t affect you.
You don’t get it — the same problem existed before affirmative consent laws. If two people had sex (regardless of genders involved) one person could always later claim there was no consent. That’s just the nature of these types of interactions. Affirmative consent is actually a positive development for men (since you clearly seem to think this is a plan by feminists to get men or something) because it reduces the chance of misunderstandings.
If you get your partner’s enthusiastic consent, you have much less chance of having an experience that you thought was consensual where the other person wasn’t consenting. If you knew anything about the history of sexual consent, you’d understand that most people want their partner’s enthusiastic consent, but the failure to clearly communicate about consent has gotten a lot of people into trouble in a variety of different ways.
I understand that you’re scared because things are changing, but contrary to the conservative mantra change is not necessarily bad. You are so busy picturing nightmare scenarios that you haven’t bothered to educate yourself about how the old system failed or how the new system works.
That’s not part of any real law.
“Affirmative consent (enthusiastic yes) is when both parties agree to sexual conduct, either through clear, verbal communication or nonverbal cues or gestures.”
So even under Affirmative consent laws an inviting smile counts as consent. You really need to stop reading tabloids like The Sun for your information. It’s fine as entertainment but don’t mistake them for a factual source.
An inviting smile works in some circumstances, but I run into a lot of people who want a blanket rule about what counts. Some folks have trouble understanding that context is crucial to communication.
So I agree with you, but I don’t want anyone claiming that a person gave them an inviting smile from across the room so clearly they agreed to move straight to butt stuff.
I’m a fan of the Radiolab podcast, which covers a huge variety of topics. A few months back they had a very well done 3 part series on consent in various situations, what laws there are, and how variously-oriented communities are trying to address it. One example I recall was an app that has each individual record a brief video of explicit consent and puts them in private storage for the other party involved ‘just in case’.
Being in a very long term, committed, monogamous relationship I initially was going to skip the series since “this doesn’t apply to me”, but it opened my eyes on the many and varied issues that others face. While I expect to never need those insights for practical purposes, it has definitely affected the way I plan to talk to my kids about things when they’re older.
Yeah that was taking it to a rare extreme :)
Pardon Mike, but you scooped that description off of Wikipedia. I wasn’t using the Sun as evidence of anything. That was just coverage of a ridiculous trend.
But if you want a credible source;
http://time.com/3222176/campus-rape-the-problem-with-yes-means-yes/
“The law’s defenders, such as feminist writer Amanda Hess, dismiss as hyperbole claims that it would turn people into unwitting rapists every time they have sex without obtaining an explicit “yes” (or, better yet, a notarized signature) from their partner. Hess points out that consent can include nonverbal cues such as body language. Indeed, the warning that “relying solely on nonverbal communication can lead to misunderstanding,” included in the initial draft of the bill, was dropped from later versions. Yet even after those revisions, one of the bill’s co-authors, Democratic Assemblywoman Bonnie Lowenthal, told the San Gabriel Valley Tribune that the affirmative consent standard means a person “must say ‘yes.’ ”
Nonverbal cues indicating consent are almost certainly present in most consensual sexual encounters. But as a legal standard, nonverbal affirmative consent leaves campus tribunals in the position of trying to answer murky and confusing questions — for instance, whether a passionate response to a kiss was just a kiss, or an expression of “voluntary agreement” to have sexual intercourse. Faced with such ambiguities, administrators are likely to err on the side of caution and treat only explicit verbal agreement as sufficient proof of consent. In fact, many affirmative-consent-based student codes of sexual conduct today either discourage reliance on nonverbal communication as leaving too much room for mistakes. . .”
And as always, how do you prove verbal consent? Even if you have a video of it, as in the Sun article, how do you prove consent was not revoked?
Affirmative consent law is unenforceable, and ripe for abuse.
Sorry, but that’s pretty much just paranoia. There’s really no risk in a “yes means yes” rule that isn’t there with a “no means no” rule. In either scenario, the fact finder is responsible for determining whether there was or was not consent, and most times it’s going to be based on the statements by the people involved. If you’re worried that someone will lie about saying yes, there’s just as much reason to fear someone lying about saying no.
To paraphrase your concern – even if you have video evidence of consent to start with, how do you prove that the person you’re having sex with never said “no?” It’s functionally the same problem.
Under sane law, the accused is innocent until proven guilty. The prosecution must prove that there was no consent and that a reasonable person would know there was no consent.
This is consistent with human rights guaranteed by the Constitution.
If the accused is required to prove that the accuser consented, then the burden of proof has been reversed. The innocent are considered guilty unless they can perform a miracle and prove a negative, in a situation where there may be no evidence at all.
Even assuming you’re right, under the best circumstances, even with the best intentions, affirmative consent is a big step toward human rights abuses.
And it has no potential to protect anyone.
Affirmative consent laws protect everyone involved in sexual encounters by reducing the risk of misunderstanding regarding consent.
The accused is not required to prove that the accuser consented. The accused is given an affirmative defense that can protect them where the accuser asserts a lack of consent.
Under the “no means no” paradigm, the burden of proof is exactly the same – the prosecutor has to prove that non-consensual sex took place. That’s the same standard in an affirmative consent scenario. The difference is that a defendant in an affirmative consent scenario can prevail by showing that they took reasonable steps to obtain consent.
In a court case, testimony by the alleged victim is generally admissible evidence. Under the old standard, a victim could come in and say “I never consented.” That could be enough evidence for a conviction. You could say that on this basis the defendant has the burden of proving consent, just like in an affirmative consent scenario.
If you obtain affirmative consent from your sex partner, the chance that they felt pressured into sex (or threatened, or they were too drunk to consent, or any of the other factors that get people in trouble) are greatly reduced. You also have a scenario where, in the case of a false accusation, the accuser has a lot more lies to keep straight. They can’t just say “they forced me to have sex,” they have to respond to every piece of evidence you have (which includes your testimony about what happened). Most investigators will tell you that the more details a person has to keep track of in telling a lie, the more likely they are to get caught.
I’ve seen how the system works, and it doesn’t work the way you think it does. Maybe you should try actually listening to both sides of this issue rather than just falling for the scare-mongering.
I think the concern is more that people tend to get drunk, and at least here legislation change would imply that if both of you are dunk, have sex, and the other party denies giving consent, then you are in biiig trouble. Add the fact that not only public but also courts are more likely to believe men to be aggressors and women to be victims. Even if eventually found not guilty these are public affairs which can ruin your rep for good.
Of course there’s a simple paper solution to that: don’t hit on someone while drunk and make sure there are others around when consent is given. Unfortunately getting drunk seems to be the only time guys here have courage to hit on someone, and telling in a big group “hey, let’s go to my place have sex, ok?” might be a bit awkward. Even in the latter case it might be difficult to defend against a claim from someone who decides next morning they didn’t want sex after all (or were rebuked and got spiteful).
Having equally severe penalty for false claims might help a bit but it might also discourage people from reporting actual rapes. Luckily here (not in Canada) I think they are changing goal to have more severe penalties against all types of sex offenders. Not sure if it helps though as there are countries like India with actual death penalties and still rapes happen with frightening frequency.
Rape-laws in India are really weird, at least in how they’re implemented. It’s apparently considered normal to use false accusations to coerce a man into marriage. Or to extort money.
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-38796457
Read the article. The evidence reported does not support the claim you made. It’s not common to falsely accuse a man to coerce him into marriage. Under the law in India, lying to a woman about wanting to marry her to trick her into sleeping with you is classified as rape. While that’s a weird law in some ways, it’s the law and prosecuting someone for breaking it is not a false accusation.
The article offered one case where a man claimed that a false rape accusation was used for extortion, and quoted a lawyer who makes his living defending rape cases as saying it’s a common practice. That’s an accusation that came up a lot in the early days of reform in the US, and i personally would need some evidence to take it seriously.
To rephrase what you just said;
In India, being accused of promising marriage before sex is classified as rape.
How could law like that NOT be abused?
Also;
“That’s an accusation that came up a lot in the early days of reform in the US”
There are other similarities to past times in the U.S. Like, accused rapists being lynched based on the word of the accuser alone.
https://www.indiatimes.com/news/india/dimapur-lynch-brother-of-dead-victim-an-army-havaldar-fights-for-justice-231390.html
http://time.com/3734976/india-nagaland-dimapur-rape-lynching/
As to proving overall trends, I’ve read about India’s issues a bit, but I’m not an expert, and I’m not being paid for this. I’m not in the mood to produce a research paper. Take my limited evidence for what it is.
Well, since you’ve really offered no evidence and instead speculated about ways the rule could be abused, I guess I’ll take it for what it’s worth. Which is very little.
With regard to the marital promise law in India, in the United States tricking someone into having sex with you can be treated as rape in some cases. In the film Revenge of the Nerds, one of the protagonists has sex with a woman by pretending to be her boyfriend. Technically, that would probably be rape under U.S. law.
And the initial claim was that these were false claims. You’re now arguing that the law is likely to be abused. That’s moving the goalposts, and is also purely speculative. I’m not sure that the India law is a good idea, and it certainly isn’t appropriate for the U.S., but the reality is that the law says what it says. You might not like the idea of men being prosecuted for lying to get sex, that doesn’t mean that accusing someone of breaking the law would qualify as a false allegation.
This argument is tiresome.
I have not moved the goalposts. I have stated multiple problems.
In any case, false accusations, and easily abused laws are not mutually exclusive. A large part of my point is that bad laws facilitate and reward false accusations.
And I have not merely speculated, I have provided examples. Not that I should need to. A simple Google search will provide dozens for any honest searcher.
And I might note, you have not actually disproved any of my points, you merely dismissed them as “paranoia” and “speculation.”
I will end by saying that false accusations are a real and horrifying problem. And false accusers can damage the lives of many victims, over many years.
https://nypost.com/2017/08/25/woman-heading-to-prison-after-falsely-accusing-15-men-of-rape/
And here’s 35 more, if you’ll excuse the DailyWire article. It’s hard to find feminist-leaning sites that admit this problem exists.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/37090/35-times-men-were-falsely-accused-sexual-assault-kassy-dillon
I have responded to your concerns. The fact that you ignored my points does not, in fact, invalidate my points. You’ve offered anecdotes and speculated about the possibility of abuse, but the fact that a law can be abused does not ipso facto make it a bad law.
I agree, the discussion has grown tiresome. You have made up your mind and are clearly unwilling to engage with any ideas that do not confirm your position.
In closing – I never said false accusations are not a problem, or even implied it. I pointed out that this problem exists with any rape law, whether you go with “yes means yes” or “no means no.” You repeatedly ignored that point, and I assume you will continue to do so.
The thing I will say about false accusations is that I find it fascinating how many people worry about false accusations of rape but don’t worry about false accusations of other crimes. Any google search will show you that people are routinely accused and convicted of a huge variety of crimes they didn’t commit, including but not limited to physical battery of a non-sexual nature, drug dealing/possession, and murder. But you don’t argue we should get rid of the law against murder, or make it easier for a person to defend themselves against a murder charge out of some sense of fairness.
The criminal justice system has a huge number of problems, including all kinds of biases that seem to be pretty baked in. One example is that men do tend to get harsher punishments than women for many crimes. Knowing that, and knowing how often the system screws up, I don’t see anything particularly worrisome about affirmative consent. Your fixation on it, though, is somewhat worrisome.
Thread is hitting its limit.
First of all: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection
^This is you.
“I pointed out that this problem exists with any rape law, whether you go with “yes means yes” or “no means no.” You repeatedly ignored that point, and I assume you will continue to do so.”
Okay. Here I am addressing your argument.
I never claimed false accusations can’t happen without affirmative consent, and you know that. My point remains that affirmative consent law WILL make false accusations more common.
And of course people can be falsely accused of other crimes. However, accusations of sex crimes carry more social weight than accusations of murder, and you know it.
One of the points I made is that affirmative consent law protect no one.
Your counterargument is that when to people go to a private location, strip naked and spend hours bumping uglies, legally requiring them to state that they want to do the things they are doing will prevent misunderstandings.
That’s ridiculous. I feel like I’m wasting my time countering arguments so obviously bad.
Choosing to have sex is consent.
If you don’t want to have sex, (unless you are impaired) it is your responsibility to not consent to sex.
You have substituted accusations for argumentation, and simple denied facts you couldn’t counter.
I have ignored some of your statements because they were attempts at poisoning the well and ad-homonym argumentation, or other fallacious nonsense.
Here’s a list of some of your Greatest Hits.
“Your fixation on it, though, is somewhat worrisome.”
“I always worry when I encounter people who pretend like affirmative consent is some sort of “feminist oppression.”
“I hope you’re not objecting to conscious or voluntary, “
“If that feels like too much for you, you probably shouldn’t have sex with anyone, because you run a real risk of getting in trouble even under the old “no means no” standard.”
“I understand that you’re scared because things are changing”
I’m done. Bye.
This makes me wonder whether there’s legislation anywhere that would allow for a situation where, legally, two people rape each other simultaneously?
Not a difficult scenario to imagine, with alcohol involved. Two people who hate one another or find one another repulsive get drunk out of their mind and do the dirty with nary a word spoken, no consent given on either side. They come to, recoil in disgust, and each independently brings a suit against the other.
Not a LIKELY scenario mind, but certainly possible!
This is a hypothetical that I see a lot when affirmative consent comes up, but it’s really no more likely in an affirmative consent case than a “no means no” paradigm.
That said, it also comes up regularly in statutory rape cases. Some states make an exception to statutory rape laws where both partners are under the age of consent, but many don’t. So in some cases prosecutors have charged two fifteen year olds (as an example) with committing statutory rape for having sex with each other. Most the time prosecutorial discretion prevents this, but that’s arguably not a good way to handle it.
It also comes up with underage sexting fairly regularly – a minor is charged with possessing child pornography because their partner sent them a photo or video featuring naughty bits, and the partner who sent the picture or video is charged with creating and distributing child pornography.
So if you have teenagers, make sure they understand that they can get arrested for consensually sharing photos with a partner.
In certain US states when both are under 18 or 21 depending on jurisdiction. Also when you’re under 18 and send your SO a nude pic, technically you are on the hook for making and distributing child porn, your SO for having it.
I went looking for this case where a 17-year-old sent pictures of himself to his girlfriend, and was being charged.
https://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-manassas-sexting-photos-police-20140710-story.html
It was particularly foul because they wanted to give him an injection to make him erect, and take pictures to compare.
But I also found this story.
https://reason.com/blog/2016/09/13/romeo-and-juliet-and-sexting-17-year-old
Our sex-crime laws need soooo much reform.
Yes, because a few outliers are proof the whole concept and law should be scrapped.
Sydney’s face in the last panel. Oh my.
Can’t have a space adventure without doing a pretty or handsome alien you know? And she have also beaten giant space chtulus, Shepard would be proud of her.
As would Kirk.
And Riker
I could swear Picard had a couple cases of space boot-ay over the years
Vash, Neila Darren, Eline, Bev Crusher……any more anyone?
What about his “Wife” when the alien probe from a dead race that had him live an entire lifetime of memories?
Maybe Janeway before she got married
And after the ship has taken a wallop, nobody ever shows up on the bridge with food and beverage stains down the front of their clothes. That would be a perfect running gag for Bones. “Really, Jim? Why do you always do these things just as I’m sitting down to eat?”
“Dammit Jim, I’m a doctor, not a janitor!”
Red Rocket Ready For Raunch
What does team rocket have to do with this situation?
Red Rocket is from Dragging Balls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmrL9nQf-rY
Appropriate.
Damn.. thus proves you could play chopsticks on the sax and it would still sound like “Its time for a lovin!!”
First, why do I suddenly wish this comic was behind an adult check? =^_~=
And pools with gravity problems
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeaiVveZWD8
As I said…I keep expecting the next strip to be a “Meanwhile, back at Archon HQ….” (spinning Archon symbol crossfade….)
Dang, I heard the trumpet trill and read it in that voice and everything.
Well, we are approaching another Valentine’s Day sex drive…
Wow! That page alone just won you back my Patronage (I’ll have to shuffle some around, but I’ll manage!). An artist/storyteller, who manages to put that much fanservice, playful verbal sparring AND sensible dating advice into one page, along with one of Syd’s most adorable, loveable faces, needs to be supported! Please, more of this (along with Dabbler making pancakes, of course. ;D )
This strip reminds me that I would quite like to have dog ears. So expressive.
That is all :/
Bad for a poker player though.
I seem to recall a Far Side cartoon with the caption “Why dogs are bad at poker” and one dog’s tail is wagging and the other dogs are folding.
The Kids is an easy solution, the creche is a zero G area with soft bouncy walls, the kids can float around all day with little to no injury, just make sure babies are in a roll-cage with neck and back support :D
Well not all day. They need gravity to properly develop bones and muscles and such.
Thing is, gravity field generators are pretty much a must for practical FTL space travel, otherwise the inertia makes getting anywhere deadly for the squishy beings inside the ship. So you’d need inertial dampeners at least, or flat out generated-zero-G bubble inside the “standard” generated gravity/inertial dampening.
The core problem is that space battles should either be bump free, or everyone becomes strawberry jam the second you make contact. But that’s not terribly dramatic for TV, soooo….
Dat stare. That’s how you show something without actually showing it.
But hey Dave, can we get some kind of visual metaphor for visualization purposes? Like we did with Hiro’s elephant trunk.
I thought that’s what the long, vertical speech balloon was for.
Really? ‘Cuz that would put him at about 2.5 Sydney-heads. An average woman, from chin to crown, is about 8.5 inches. Sydney’s kinda small, so let’s say 8 inches.
8 x 2.5= 20 inches
That’s long enough to be really, really inconvenient. That reaches down to the shins. That would make walking and wearing pants a daily struggle. He’d probably get it caught on things and might literally trip over it. And that’s setting aside the biological difficulty of, ah. . . maintaining the implement.
That is an entirely unreasonable length for a humanoid-space-wolf’s dong. I find your interpretation unacceptable.
In any case, I’m not interested in size, so much as anatomy. There’s no reason to expect Frix to resemble a human in the relevant area, so what, approximately, is going on down there?
I ask only out of scientific interest, and concern for Sydney’s safety, of course. . .
It looks like it’s showing his shoulders in the third such panel so I’m assuming hie eyes were just locked on while he was sitting down in the water.
Yeah, panel one has Frixy getting into the pool, panels 224 are showing him slowing settling down into it (panel one show the back of his knee, panel 2 his hip {and butt}, panel three his arm, ending with panel four showing his shoulders)
Sydney’s eyes are locked onto his pouch, and she is finally able to break the lock once he gets deep enough
I like the idea of showing trek outside the bridge in combat… but then my mind fills bith bad anime tropes..
people falling about and accidentally kissing(because that happens instead of violent head clashes and migraines)
And
1. Half the ship are now dating
2. Half the ship is avoiding the other half
or
3. Half the ship is chasing the other half is hiding and being tsundere or hiding in abject terror
I am…knot… sure cultural issues will be the biggest… problem.
That’s the kind of comment I wouldn’t be surprised to see on E621 or FA.
The Tardis has a pool and a ocean in it.and is knocked around alot.I wonder how that functions.
Wibbly wobbly.
Hmm.. stasis fields for any sections of the Tardis not currently in use? Nothing like freezing time to keep things put.
It’s simple. That part of the TARDIS isn’t being knocked about!
Except that the Tardis isn’t a ship, it’s more like universe of itself, with an interface shaped like a police callbox that can be moved around to poke into our universe at will.
Oh I read about this years ago in a book called “The Science of Doctor Who”. Okay so – the inside of the Tardis is basically a pocket or area of hyperspace or subspace or something similar. The inside of the Tardis never actually MOVES. It’s stationary in it’s location – only the outer structure which is said to consist of the core engine moves, being sucked into or out of the alternate space. But – that outer structure is basically connected to the engines, and when bad stuff happens to it this can cause the engines to phase – sending a tremor through the internal structure. Like making an earthquake. It’s even possible for the control room or a piece of the tardis to be Ripped off or pulled through into the real world depending on situations and the requirements of the script!
Now some of this may have been contradicted in the new series; I read that back in the 90’s. But the episode where the tardis became huge was cause a large portion of the tardis structure had been pulled through to normal space!
Daaw! Cute Halo is Cute!
I think that Sydney deserves to have her fun time without interruption.
Star Trek the Next Generation. Since that Enterprise did have entire families on board at times, I can see the situation occurring with small children bouncing off of walls. *ouch*
AAAANNNND now I’m picturing a surprise attack while a couple are in bed. Talking about “Earth-shaking” loving. >_o
Sydney still insecure about her…appearance!?
The first time getting undressed around ANY new person is usually a bit unnerving. Even if they aren’t rather tall canine alien anthromorph from a culture you know nothing about when you’re unsure exactly how far you’re planning on actually taking things.
Except if this happens in a public shower or sauna or some such. I mean public sauna and shower rules here dictate that you need to be naked for sanitary reasons. Then again they are rarely mixed gender environments – though those do exist.
It also largely holds true to personal saunas as in groups of men and women usually take separate turns. Depends by person though as me and my female friend used to go to sauna together naked as did some of our mutual friends. Others felt too uncomfortable to go naked mixed, but unlike Sydney’s situation here, naked bathing here is not viewed sexual so it had usually more to do with body image issues – I guess. Me? I’m fine naked in saunas, showers, baths, and while skinny dipping or at home. No discomfort as long as water is involved. Remove the water and it becomes awkward!
Pretty sure it’s implied she and Krix are the only ones there currently.
Think you’re overthinking things a bit.
It really feels like it’s just standard nervousness about potentially being naked around someone new for the first time. Especially given she literally just met him a few hours ago.
I merely pointed out there are many situations where you might not feel awkward getting naked before other people. Clearly this is not one of those cases. Especially (as I pointed out) there are sexual undertones to it. Yet Frix doesn’t seem awkward at all, though he probably has had more experience being naked with human looking aliens than Sydney with non-human looking aliens – or being naked with other humans for that matter (if you recall the shower scene but that was mainly because of body image issues).
On TNG’s Enterprise, the arboretum did have a small pond. It features prominently in the episode Dark Page. No starship battle sequences or gravity failures though, so we’re left to wonder just how much of a mess is made in the arboretum when those events do occur.
Also on the holodeck. In one early episode i think Wesley falls in.
Yeah we walked out dripping leaving a wet puddle in the hallway. After that first episode nothing from the holodeck ever left the room despite them saying it also worked as a replicator for drinks and food and such.
Not true. In the episode where Data played Sherlock Holmes, a note from Moriarty was carried off the holodeck.
In the original screenplay, it was evidence that Moriarty could, in fact, be released from the holodeck, whereas in the final version, it is merely a continuity error.
I worry for Sydney when/if Dabbler finds out about this. She is gonna pester her for a play-by-play account I just know it.
I see two possibilities for the pool.
1. It’s a part of the cooling / shielding system.
2. With technologies like hard light, it might just be a hologram.
There was that one episode of Star Trek: Enterprise….at the start of the show, in the teaser before the opening credits, Captain Archer is in his quarters taking a shower…
(because this is in the 22nd-century, before the invention of sonic showers)
….when the artificial gravity cuts out. His shower stops working (because apparently standard showers require gravity to help propel the water out), all of the water that has yet to go down the drain starts floating around him, & he leans over the top of his shower stall to hit the intercom to complain to the bridge.
Then when gravity kicks in again, he, & all the water drops back to the floor rather abruptly…I’m sure he felt embarrassed even without anybody being there to witness it other than his pet beagle.
Seems like common sense to include an automatic cutoff to the shower in case of problems with environment control – not much you can do about water that’s already in the air, but you can at least stop making matters worse…
That episode was early enough in the series that I was still expecting Captain Archer to say “Oh boy!” every time something like that happened…
You too huh?
A quantum leap of logic, I guess.
And she is actually following through on it… more guts there than most people would have, I think. Everyone says “yeah, I would do that” but, throw most people into the situation and they would fold.
Not sure I’d do that, but I’d do him.
Star-trek The Next Generation and Voyager have numerous scenes with rather significant bodies of water on the ship. Female characters have been in standard bathtubs full of water, and the mess-halls have people drinking out of cups or glasses.
No word on how any of that plays out during battle though… Perhaps it’s only the bridge section that has violent shaking going on?
Galaxy/Explorer Class starships are the size of small cities/large towns. Plus they replicate the water they use and rarely have need to maintain large free-standing bodies of water. Artificial gravity is the key.
And in a combat situation I imagine one of the first things that happens on Cora’s ship is an automated process that turns off the water flow and drains the pools into holding tanks.
actually… no they aren’t. a Galaxy is barely over a half-kilometer long, and has just over a thousand crew. when an impact hits the ship, it’s shaking the ENTIRE ship. there HAS been plenty of episodes where they’ve shown engineering during a battle and it shakes just as much, and it’s on the complete other side of the ship.
They also show forcefields stationed all over the place at intervals in the corridors, doorways, etc… Those corridor walls have those little “bracing archway” things every so often that look decorative, but are literally where the forcefields activate…and they are strong enough to contain atmosphere, objects, and even super-strong androids. (The Borg have to match the frequency of the shield energies to pass through, which requires consciously applied high tech.)
It would be child’s play to install those around around the rim of a bathtub, arboretum pond, or swimming pool. And during Red Alert, that’s when everything of that nature gets sealed. Swimming pools, bathtubs, ponds, you name it. (People would have to scramble to get out of such things, but I’m sure there’s like emergency transporters that snap into action to extract a plethora of swimmers so the pool can be sealed quickly enough.)
She looks better with her hair down like that :)
As much as I’m loving this (and I’ll take a fade to black and coming back post-coital) Sydney is going to cause everyone to do some serious re-evaluation on her abilities and character. Taking out 3-4 city-size constructs, traveling through deep space on her own (or the orbs) power. A street-fight in a back alley of a distant world, and finishing with a little “fun” on the way back home.
I’m really looking forward to everyone’s reactions.
As long as the fade to black is just before Sidney, ah, gets his goat…. I’ve a comment I’m saving for just that
See, ARCHON is trying to set itself up as a traditional American Military system, just with people of ‘extraordinary ability’.
Sydney’s a SUPERHERO.
Therefore, shenanigans. At some point there’s going to be a mind-controlling starfish and Sydney’s going to be the only one it doesn’t capture. There’s going to be a ‘normal’ madman who somehow manages to give the whole organization the runaround, leading to acid pies in the face and a funhouse of DOOM… And at some point, giant toy robots WILL go marching through the streets of New York.
Love the last panel. Sydney is usually unabashedly rocking the tomboy, but the last panel is 100% ‘gently feminine’. At least to my eyes.
If a spaceship had their food prepared in a mess hall instead of by replicators, then during sudden course changes it could turn into a real “mess”.
I’m totally not furry in the same way that Sydney is not but I’d also totally go for Frix! He can groom me any time he wants! I wonder if he does home calls. I think I’ve this alien thingamabob that needs fixing… Eh, assuming he was also into guys, and maybe fixing wasn’t the best choice of words here… meh, details!
One would hope any relatively advanced civilization would be past our primitive societal hang-ups
Unfortunately, if Earth is any example, then the alien culture that is most likely to spread to the stars is not the ‘lets all get along’ variety. It is probably the predatory colonialist version with the ‘I must cleanse all the unbelievers of my particular deity’ attitude.
I would think that would be an issue that tends to work itself out. There appear to be a large number of different civilizations with FTL technology developed to different degrees. I would imagine that a fair number of races develop FTL technology and set out to conquer the galaxy only to discover they’re a few million years too late, and their “cutting edge” weapons are laughably primitive by galactic standards. Given what Cora said about the expectation that cultures figure out technology on their own, most aspiring conquerors would find themselves playing catch-up for long enough to integrate with the existing galactic civilization.
Those cultures that don’t/ won’t/ can’t overcome their warlike impulses would likely be a problem for awhile, but eventually they’ll tick off a significantly technologically superior race and end up with giant space-squid wiping out their home planet.
Well I’d be equally concerned with actual biological differences. Even if the alien in question looks largely human because some weird universal quirk produces humanoids modeled after earth primates, and even if the life-form in question is carbon-based, there’s still quite significant risk of their fluids causing allergic reaction if not being outright toxic (phew, long sentence, out of breath!).
Nothing like dying from sex induced anaphylatic shock after some tender lovemaking. Remember stock on condoms, immune boosters, and antihistamine – and asolutely no frenching! At least there shouldn’t be chance for a cross-species contamination – or kids. Not that it would be a problem with male alien and me.
Remember the wise words of DR. Mordin: “Do not ingest.”
And watch out for Varren scale itch. Implications…unpleasant.
Humans are so parochial. You are a warm-blooded air breathing ape, and interested in all the things that warm blooded air breathing apes are interested in.
For some reason, you believe that all such beings should want to have sex with all other such beings. It’s almost like you don’t believe in the words “sexual preferences”.
Chances are pretty good that if humans ever meet and attempt to romance an extremely human-like alien, that their response will be something like, “A male of my species is not sexually mature and a candidate for sex until their verzlans turn orange… (licking lips) BRIGHT orange… (quick frown) and you don’t even *have* a verzlans. Why would I be attracted to *YOU*?”
Look at any of our nearest relatives and see how interested you might be in sex with them. Mandrill? Chimpanzee? Orangutan?
nope nope nope.
This is an old bit for interspecies anti-Kirk discussions.
However it also ignores that KINK can exist in other species too…just so long as both parties accept they are pretty much a fetish to one another.
On that however, if humans are any indication you may be more inclined to be sexually receptive to less human aliens only humanoid in shape.
Look at Furre stuff for example (how often do you find fox, dog, wolf, and cat,) relative to those same primates you mentioned?
Same too with the monstergirl/boy scene, how often do you see Lamia, Harpy, Mermaid, Scylla, even plant and slimes, relative to say Sasquatch fetish scene?
An inverse can also be present, you may have some feature that by chance attracts them. Using another fictional source here, but a great example of this was Dan and Mab comic.
A mythos girl, ‘taur body shape, reptilian smooth, cobra hood and lizard tail, is dating a feathered incubus with blue wings. She confessed when she met Dan she flirted with him because in her species the males have huge blue frills they spread for sexual display; while she had integrated herself into the common society she still had that instinct and Dan’s big blue wings set off that same allure for her.
So maybe you don’t have some feathered crest, but your hair is close enough to be attractive. Of course your clothes can also be a factor and a bit disappointing for them to discover those sexy scale stripes and back frill were just pantyhose and a dress, and without them you looked like an adolescent or someone skinned you from their perspective.
Found it
http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol1731.png
Well for humans I suspect it comes down to how close the alien is to actual humans in overall shape. I’m likely to believe that most furry stuff involves beings with muscular or voluptous human bodies with a dash of “ideal human body” mixed in. Sprinkle in some extra features like tails, animal head, and digitigrade legs, and you still have something very close to a human.
This is actually emphasized in how they are drawn. Most male and female forms are drawn with very short fur and include features like clearly visible nipples (just a pair of them usually) and have also tendency to have human proportions (i.e. head is proportionate to their human body)
Actually much of that applies to Frix here. He also has eyebrows which is weird for a being that has actual fur. My point is: there’s quite a bit of scale on how inhuman someone might find appealing. I may find Frix appealing, hell I can also appreciate sexy demons (i.e. google D&D Balor) but once we start entering into actual alien from Alien category the sex appeal is gone. The same applies if furry art depics actual animals on two legs (as in literally dog on two legs). They are not sufficiently human to be sexually appealing. Might be really nice from art perspective though.
Indeed, putting aside mascot like costumes, most furre art is like 99% human. Just with fur, a tail, and an animal shaped head or face.
I’ve had issues with gate keeper toxic fanbase types in the past on the whole what is a furre vs inhuman monster-girl/demon/gargoyle; as in also mostly human but either half their body is not human, or things that have some animal features like cat-girls *Nekomimmi class especially* just some ears, maybe tail and eyes, occasionally paws or claws.
I mean a Mermaid is less human than most rabbit people or fox people art I’ve seen, they just don’t have a fish head…and even when they do have big monstrous fish jaws and such it is still less taboo apparently than a cute furre bunny girl. This inconsistency and arguing is why I ditched every furry site I was on. The constant “this isn’t furre” when posting stuff about vampire cat-girls, werewolves, and the like was annoying. (also why I don’t use that as a tag for anything anymore).
But yeah, humans are still sexually drawn to human traits, you may add on accents, but the core human shape or some aspect is *usually* there in one part or another.
I kind of don’t get the appeal of mascot-like or furry costumes (fursuits?). They look unnatural and akward on people BUT I get some folks are into them. I mean some folks finds shoe racks sexy, and that’s fine, too. It’s not away from me if they do.
I’ve visited quite a few furry sites and while the art is often good and pleasing to the eye I also sort of grow bored when it comes to uniformity. For example I find it weird if the site bans art that involves humans, but not furries, or if it bans furries but not monstrous humans – like you mentioned.
As far as I’m concerned I just place them all under big umbrella term called “fantasy” which can run from robots and aliens to demons and furries – and humans. Can’t forget humans!
I don’t think there’s an art site that runs full gamut of different fantasy types. At least not one that allows also nsfw art which I’m also fan of! I mean I’m not 100% flexible in my tastes but I just skip the art I don’t like (i.e. I’m fan of bara but not yaoi). Categories are your friend.
Have you tried Hentai Foundry? It has almost everything (in a couple different mediums), about the only thing it seems to frown on is Loli and Shota (butt that’s fairly easy to bypass)
And the best part, is that it has categories (personally turn them all on and then decide if want to see the full image from the thumbnail)
and the site surprisingly has one of the best set ups for written stories for posting new chapters, and editing them. Even better than the set up Fictionpress has….and a million times better than Deviantart’s set up.
They even have a Discord channel :D