Grrl Power #618 – Bridge building
In some ways, Maxima is doing Sydney a disservice by humoring her antics. Sydney’s going to be in for a big fucking shock if she ever gets seconded to a JSOC unit for an operation, and she tries to razz the JSOC Commander about his dating habits.
The poor discipline of Arc-SWAT in general also probably means Maxima winds up wearing the silly hat at the DoD X-Mas party and everyone razzes her about being a big ‘ol softie. As long as she gets results from her people, she doesn’t care.
One thing I think I’ve been a little negligent about with the comic is spending so much time with the female characters that any male potential romantic interests haven’t gotten enough screen time for us to really see why they’d even be in the running. Honestly, I think the male with the most development in the comic at this point is Deus. So this page started off as a longer bit with Hiro doing something properly heroic during this bridge kerfuffle, while Maxima looks on thinking “Alright, alright, definitely a contender. Gonna have to figure out how to get him promoted.” But I didn’t want to get sidetracked for the, I don’t know, 4 to 6 pages that would have taken to properly play out, so I just compressed it into this quick field flirt.
Honestly, not wanting to derail the story is what happens to all these asides I have planned for the guys, so the next story arc may straight up include a few guy’s day arcs or something.
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No you! I’m surprised Halo isn’t carrying cars off the bridge with the Molestical…
Come to think of it, her current work is much more important.
And, honestly, that’s a damn clever trick with the lighthook. I’m sure Dabbler’s a bit disappointed that the free end isn’t being frisky, but what’s she gonna do, eh?
Sydney knows there’s no point in the Lighthook going all Hentorb on Dabbler. Then again, we don’t know if Sydney’s… experimented with that potential functionality… in private of course.
Im not proud of it but id be using the lighthook as a “doggie treat” to keep dabbler on mission
She doesn’t need the lighthook. She has Edward Elric.
Heh. Both you and Xero made me smile.
Mind you no reason why Sydney cannot use both. Especially given that we know she is into hentai! And the name that she wanted to officially give the tentacle.
Actually I should not omit either Stormtalon or yuffiek, whilst giving such credit. And Joe Guy made good observations for that matter.
I was impressed that the end was placed where it could be an instant tether if high winds or recoil from the space-goo(oooooo) gun managed to make the footing unstable for Dabbler. That’s the kind of detail you don’t often get in a superhero comic.
Wholeheartedly agreed.
Can she lift that much? She tried with the steel beams and failed, she might not want to risk it with an audience.
I think it’s 16 tons and cars weigh less than that…
Yep.
She lifted her own car once.
“Figure out hot to get him promoted”? A bit of a Freudian slip there…
Assuming it wasn’t intentional in the first place.
It works either way.
Hah, whoops.
:-D
I wonder what’s up with the molest-orb tentacle around Dabbler’s leg? Either it is sub-consciously reacting to Sydney’s arousal or she’s about to toss her off the bridge.
It’s been around her leg since the first one. I think it’s meant to be a stabilizer but has changed position slightly
As fun as it is to speculate with the mind in the gutter, it is most likely just to anchor Dabbler in place so she doesn’t fall off the platform.
Safety line. Not to hold her in place, but to catch her if she falls.
The tossing off may come later….
I have to say I’m with dabbler on this one I would like to watch. Then again I don’t know either them personally so yeah.
NEEEEERDS!
Honestly, having a command position and being in charge comes with a price in that regard. Yeah, Max may end up wearing the silly hat so to speak, but she also has a better relationship with her people. In most cases if you’re the big guy all about discipline you end up being know as “that hard ass” or something to that effect. In most cases, you’re looked at as the guy in charge or the person they have to go to when something goes south and you have to have your first shirt or above bail you out. This is exactly why almost every base has an officers club. It’s so those with rank in similar positions can actually socialize and have some camaraderie.
It should also be remembered that pretty much noone in Arc-SWAT has CHOSEN a military career. The division was basically set up as a way to keep superpowered individuals under control, and everyone, except perhaps Maxima, was more or less drafted. Under those circumstances you don’t want to treat them in a way that might make them decide to go rogue and become supervillains.
Also, Arc-SWAT is a small group and its members have highly specialized abilities that make them difficult to replace. That means that they’ll be allowed more personal leeway than the average squad.
Pretty sure most of them were military for varying lengths of time except for Sydney and the other new recruits, and Achilles, Amorphous, and Heatwave (who were basically told to join and get paid extremely well so as to not be arrested for vigilante activities, and now Jabberwocky, who’s part of an experimental program). Everyone else (in ARC-SWAT, at least) has been military (as far as I know), including Harem (I’m assuming she’s probably the newest one other than the trainees), and they have ranks.
You forgot both Dabbler and Math. Both of whom are rated as ‘civilian specialists’.
We have no clues about Stalwart, and he is only a corporal.* I suppose the nearest is his liking of nice suits, but that does not really help us one way or the other. He may have been recruited from a high paid office job. Or he may have been in the military and just looked forward to a job where he could wear fancy clothes that he liked.
But he could be career military and just have no interest in progression. So maybe.
Then there are the new recruits. All of whom seemed to have come from civvy street. Barring Vance of course, who doubtless was just happily spinning his webs in the corner of a laboratory conducting radioactive experiments, with transmutagenic chemicals and DNA extracted from supers.
* No disrespect to NCO readers. Supers will be like pilots though, in that they can qualify for higher rank, than strict time in service might normally imply, in other branches. If he had prior military experience, and any competence in leadership, I would expect him to be more senior at age 38.
“You forgot both Dabbler and Math. Both of whom are rated as ‘civilian specialists’.”
You got me there. You’re right. I forgot about Dabbler and Math not being military before Archon.
“We have no clues about Stalwart, and he is only a corporal.”
His being a corporal does seem to imply he was military though. But we haven’t really found out much about Stalwart except that he like wearing expensive clothes and is friends with Hiro. Hiro was definitely career military beforehand though.
“Then there are the new recruits. All of whom seemed to have come from civvy street.”
I mentioned that in my post when I said ‘except for Sydney and the other new recruits.’ :)
Err, no, they were not drafted. Most will have been transferred to this new branch, but they were already in the military and, as such, do not have much of a say regarding their affectation (some, but they are still supposed to follow orders).
True, it is starting to change, as we can see after the Royal Battle at the restaurant, but even then, it is not that different from the US tradition of offering a tour in the army to small criminals to redeem themselves, and remains purely voluntary.
On the other hand, the fact that each member of Arc-SWAT is so valuable is a reason for them to have a less strict relationship with their commanding officer. I would guess that the same goes true for some special units, but, here, it would be far more noticeable due to the scale of their value (see the parts about their wages).
Heatwave, Morph and Les were not in the military, they were former vigilante’s caught by Archon
It’s a good chance the other rookie’s in Sydney’s class are also not former-military (including Jigs)
The Daphne’s are physically only 19, and doubt she would have joined the military (even as a ‘life experience’ thing) due to the background checks and the fact if one of her was spotted while ‘on duty’, her jig would have been well and truly up
The only one’s confirmed to be former military, are Maxi, Pegs and Sean the Seal
Where did you see this information about Heatwave, Amorphous and Achilles? I don’t remember ever reading this in the comic.
Harem, I will concede, may have been recruited really recently, but, here again, there is no indication she was drafted. But she could have be approached and convinced to join Arc-SWAT immediately, not having a stint in the regular army at first (which would also explain her overall behaviour). This is still different from draft, where people have no other option.
In fact, Ariana’s speech when Archon was presented insisted on the fact that supers were not to be either registered or forced to enlist. Even vigilantes were presented as having the choice of stopping altogether, join Archon, or be arrested. There again, no draft.
Possibly mentioned in the defunct Cast page
Yeah, not really much of a choice, is it, between: stop being helpful, join the SuperArmy, or go to jail
That’s like getting caught speeding 5 miles over the limit and being giving the option of pay the $200 fine, spend a night in jail, or join the Army, with the judge then saying to the Bailiff – “Did you hear? The Government has just declared war against the most powerful nation in the world!”
Well, stop being helpful by doing something illegal like vigilanteism, rather than just making legal citizens arrests, and instead join us where we will pay you a ridiculously high salary so you can continue to legally do the same thing. :)
Agreed. Plus vigilantism should not be trivialised. Neighbourhood watch patrols (conducted under police guidelines and/or supervision), citizens arrest and self defence are all socially responsible and legal.
If though the principles are abused, and done so in illegal ways, such as assaulting suspects, illegally imprisoning them or persecuting people out of prison on parole, then the perpetrators are themselves conducting crimes! Further they are risking even more serious ones, such as inflicting grievous bodily harm or manslaughter.
Plus I follow the news and take note of vigilante-like behaviour. In which misidentification of criminals or criminal behaviour predominates. People see news stories, get wound up, see someone that looks like the individual, or has a name that sounds similar, or they just look like they don’t belong in that neighbourhood, or car, and they get beaten up or killed.
Then there are the lynch mobs. Pure and simple. Which can happen anywhere in the world. More often though in countries which do not have a clear and tough response to vigilantism. If any politicians condone such an act, or downplay it, then it proliferates.
This is what happens in real life. Having good intentions does not turn ill-thought out, poorly informed, actions into moral good deeds.
Let alone endangering the public by doing all this due to their lack of training in safe arrest techniques, de-escalation and numerous other things that the police get taught, and practice extensively. So even if the individuals have seen a real crime, they could be making the situation worse!
Even more so when they are doing all this with self-taught super powers, that have not been tested to see how safe they are. Now whilst the Grrlverse authorities might be OK with supers doing that if they behave responsibly and test their abilities in some safe place, where others might get hurt, a conflict situation is very different. That is uncontrolled and is likely to challenge the powers in unexpected ways.
So what might normally just be endangering one or two lives, for a muggle vigilante, could easily be exposing an entire building or vehicle full of people to death!
Plus there is the idiotic concept that putting on a two-tone outfit and a mask somehow justifies this. So we have a culture which would promote this kind of dumb behaviour. Countering that, and saying ‘you are still committing crimes by doing this, even with your underpants on the outside’ is a good thing.
Finally this is nowhere near being comparable to being slightly over the speed limit. These are people who are purposely breaking the law and creating a serious risk to the public.
That’s so unlike getting caught speeding 5 miles over the limit and being giving the option of pay the $200 fine, spend a night in jail, or join the Army, with the judge then saying to the Bailiff – “Did you hear? The Government has just declared war against the most powerful nation in the world!” that there haven’t been words invented yet to describe just how unlike that it is.
It’s closer to one of the Police Academy 4: Citizens on Patrol sub-plotlines for one of the characters :)
I forget which character. I might have mostly blocked out the entire movie even.
It was mentioned by the author in at least one of his blogs. I have known about it for a very long time, so he probably mentioned it in the early days. The other time it was likely to have been mentioned again was when they were discussing Marble Maiden and other vigilantes. Should you wish to track down the specific mentions.
Archon are willing to get pardons for those who have committed vigilante behaviour, if the individual will make a good ‘poacher turned gamekeeper’. And assuming that their prior behaviour was not so bad as to make their position as a cop untenable. So Vehemence is unlikely to ever get an invite to join the team (in an official capacity anyhow).
Cooter might though (provided Wyrmil can get a pardon for his offences).
I know that they offer this opportunity to vigilantes. It’s Achilles, Amorphous and Heatwave being former vigilantes of which I have no memory.
But I didn’t read the blogs (if by that you mean the short text below each comic) when I caught up with Grrl Power, so, if it was mentioned there… :-)
(I just checked when Marble Maiden is presented, and I did not see anything about those three in this comic or those around it).
And, anyway, the point is, even if they are former vigilantes, they were not drafted, since they had the choice of going back to civilian life – and Pander said it perfectly well about the “not being useful anymore” part…
Remember that, usually, vigilantes appear when the law does not provide the answer to extreme crime rates or special threats. Batman and Daredevil are only necessary when the cops cannot, for any reason, act against the criminals. So far, in the Grrl Power universe, there is no such situation. There is no Gotham and its ridiculous corruption and violent crime rate (it’s far worse than Chicago during the Prohibition), no Kingpin and his shell of lawyers and legitimate businesses and proxies (though Deus could be on the way to become one), so, once the authorities set something like Arc-SWAT, all vigilantes should jump at the opportunity to do the same work with support, better equipment, and a (huge) salary. (it was also part of the point behind Civil War, but the prejudice against mutants is a factor against their joining the authorities)
IGetStronger is able to be reasoned with, as proven by his decision to stop struggling at the end of his conflict with Archon. He stated that he wasn’t into killing, and he could have easily have killed Sydney if he was a homicidal maniac. Killing Sydney was the easiest route to achieving his goals, since that would have unblocked his aggro-field, and he didn’t even consider it. While he did attempt to kill Maxima, it was a form of rational self-preservation which pushed him into that decision, since he was convinced that Maxima would simply murder him if they ever met again and he wasn’t powered up enough to prevent that from happening.
Cooter, on the other hand, is demented and delusional. He believes in ‘monsters’ and styles himself a ‘monser hunter.’ We have zero evidence that he has any rational reason for this belief (such as a ‘slip’ in The Veil or sommat). He carries a shotgun, which cannot be used to subdue anyone. And he is otherwise a generally maladjusted individual, as evidenced by his reference to “Ahabs” (or whatever) when he probably meant to indicate a follower of Islam, and by the persona Dabbler assumed to interrogate him which was taken from his mental image of how an idealized female should act.
Given a choice between the two, I’d work with IGetStronger over Cooter any day of the week, and twice on Sundays.
“IGetStronger is able to be reasoned with, as proven by his decision to stop struggling at the end of his conflict with Archon.”
Not really THAT reasonable. He had to be threatened with immediate death while being choked and drowned by the entire ARC-SWAT, which was still taking a long time, in order to finally surrender. :)
“He stated that he wasn’t into killing, and he could have easily have killed Sydney if he was a homicidal maniac.”
Well… he’s at least a little homicidal, since he was planning on killing Maxima. Which would have been a homicide :) And he’s definitely a maniac.
“Killing Sydney was the easiest route to achieving his goals, since that would have unblocked his aggro-field, and he didn’t even consider it.”
He had a soft spot for her I guess :)
“While he did attempt to kill Maxima, it was a form of rational self-preservation which pushed him into that decision, since he was convinced that Maxima would simply murder him if they ever met again and he wasn’t powered up enough to prevent that from happening.”
I’ll grant you that his maniacal rampage, which he caused and planned, escalated to wanting to murder Maxima because he knew he wouldn’t be able to do it again. But that doesn’t exactly sound like a ringing defense of Vehemence even so :).
“Cooter, on the other hand, is demented and delusional.”
Hey now! Cooter is neither. He’s just stupid. And that’s his American god-given right, bless his hillbilly heart.
“He believes in ‘monsters’”
That do happen to exist, and happen to know about him, so it lends some credence to the idea that he might have killed at least a few monsters, and that his claim about monsters killing his family might be true. There could be all sorts of reasons – the veil might have failed when his family was killed, the direct attack and multiple eye-witness accounts (assuming there were any) might have been too much for the Veil’s programming on a single individual, there might be something particularly special about Cooter’s mind which let him see through the veil when his family was killed, but normally DOES work on him like every other human (who knows, maybe he’s too stupid for the Veil to totally affect him when he’s seeing something blatant happen right in front of him – maybe that’s why it’s hillbillies who most often talk about being abducted by aliens:) ), maybe the Veil underwent a patch update after what happened to Cooter so that it NOW works on him, but didnt work on him before but he still has the memories of what happened. All sorts of possible reasons. Obviously the Veil isn’t foolproof and hasnt been foolproof historically, or there wouldn’t be all these myths ABOUT different types of monsters throughout history.
He’s clearly not demented though, at least as far as not knowing the truth is concerned.
“and styles himself a ‘monster hunter.”
Well… he does hunt monsters, so there’s that. He also might have confused certain supers AS monsters, and supers are not covered by the Veil.
“We have zero evidence that he has any rational reason for this belief (such as a ‘slip’ in The Veil or sommat).”
See above.
“He carries a shotgun, which cannot be used to subdue anyone.”
Pretty sure a shotgun can be used to subdue quite a few people. Even some monsters.
“And he is otherwise a generally maladjusted individual,”
I’ll grant you that he is a tad mal-adjusted :)
“as evidenced by his reference to “Ahabs” (or whatever) when he probably meant to indicate a follower of Islam,”
Probably also because that super’s headgear looks sort of like a…. what’s it called. The thing BETWEEN a hijab and a burqa. It’s not one but no one said Cooter was smart.
“and by the persona Dabbler assumed to interrogate him which was taken from his mental image of how an idealized female should act.”
Well… quite a few guys probably have fantasies about sex with bimbo-type girls :) Doesn’t make him delusional or demented though. Also it’s not an idealized female, it’s an sexually idealized female for him. He likes ’em blonde, dumb, and stacked. Undoubtedly not the first man to like his womenfolk to be like that.
“Given a choice between the two, I’d work with IGetStronger over Cooter any day of the week, and twice on Sundays.”
Meh, I’d prefer working with Cooter – he seems pretty loyal to the people he’s working with. I know where I stand with him, while Vehemence would likely turn on me if it suits his purposes of starting a violent fight.
I agree on whom I would prefer to work with, out of the two. The reasoning behind my post though was not to do with their respective personalities but the simple fact that Vehemence purposely started a riot aimed at attacking an off-duty police unit, and clearly was attempting to murder their leader. All of which was actively being filmed and watched live on TV.
So politically there is a cat-in-Hell’s chance of getting him a pardon. Unless there happens to an apocalyptic event which can only be averted by spontaneously creating a pair of pants out of nothing. Even Iron Cloth would not be able to do that! They would have to call on MrICanKerpants.
Cooter, on the other paw, does not even need a pardon as we have no evidence of him committing any crimes. Wyrmil though was complicit in Cooter’s murder, hence why he would need a pardon. Or, of course, Cooter could simply not tell anyone that he had died. What with him still walking around it is not lkely that folks would believe him anyhow.
And it is probably more socially acceptable to explain his wormy side as being a super power, rather than a fused monster. Especially if he wants to join Archon, but knows that he would be required to keep the Secret (of the Veil).
Quite unlikely that he would like that idea. Rather I could see him working to expose it, so that he can openly avenge his lost loved one, and prevent it happening to others. However he may decide that (having been badly beaten twice already) that if he wants first hand revenge he will need help, and Archon would be an obvious way to go.
All very unlikely, of course. But possible.
“Wyrmil though was complicit in Cooter’s murder, hence why he would need a pardon.”
Technically Wyrmil didn’t commit murder (or any other crime that we know of) either, although you’re right that a person could argue conspiracy to commit murder regarding Cooter, even if he did not know what Sciona was going to do. 50/50 chance on that. Wyrmil seems like the least evil person on Sciona’s team so far. Plus yeah, I’d like to see Cooter join Archon, but he has a thing for killing monsters, and would have to be kept in the dark about the Council, which could lead to problems with how darned-tootin much he wants to kill monsters. :)
Which is why he could make a good man to put on teams hunting rogue supernaturals. We know that the Twilight Council are quite happy to kill those who endanger the Secret. Or at least once upon a time that they did.
Assuming that they still have that policy, then Cooter could get all the monster killing he wants. With Archon and the Twilight Council having the benefit that he is not off hunting nice sociable monsters, just the bad ones.
Hiro was also confirmed to be in the military prior to the formation of ARCHON in the press conference.
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/970
Yeah, you don’t become a major instantly :)
It’s posible she came in via a high school ROTC program, that might explain her age and rank. joining the Airforce afterwords could have just been her way of seeing the world after growing up on a farm.
Talking about Harem. Let’s be honest, while dad joined the Airforce and initially Air Police And ended up in Whiteman ridding shotgun on minutemen , then transitioned to computers, the Airforce can be even more Civilians in uniform than The USGS at times.
Actualy several came from the military, Also, The original recruits with Sidney in the recruit group had all enlisted prior to the creation of ACR-SWAT, I suspect a couple were tranfers from other services when the US goverment decided to De Militarize it’s persons of mass destruction. . The reason she was shown off was because lil mis malpractice decided to take a First day and your a superstar superhero with us approach. Granted I suspect within an hour of Sidney showing up at Archon you had Lil miss bleeeeeeep mouth on every news program on the planet.
I think Dave needs to recon the policy a bit. Let’s face it, someone whose Super powers are bulletproof, fire proof, able to leap tall staton wagons in a single bound, and more powerful than a 10 hp riding
lawnmower while bairly qualifying on the pistol range….while probably great as a first responder as Police or Fireman. No so much for archon
Peggy has no super powers at all. Yet has shown that she can take out Concretia. One of the most formidable opponents we have seen, outside of the top tier villains. In a perfectly realistic way.
Dave knows what he is doing.
My point was more about the “if you have superpowers and want to work in law enforcement you can only work for us” Issue.
Either this is a misunderstanding, or this is potentially a problem, as the US does have a variety of what are functionaly Special Contables. In many cases they are also armed.
Dave has already indicated that a cop who is bullet proof would probably get an exemption, if they wanted to remain in local law enforcement. Likewise anybody who has powers that Archon deem would not compromise their role.
For example a telepath would not be granted such exemption, as it would compromise everybody’s right not to say anything.
The way it has been presented in the comic is wholly the right way to go. Because it leaves the control in Archon’s hands. Those who do want exemptions will have to get vetted by Archon. Any who do not want to be subject to such scrutiny would have to get a job outside of law enforcement, or work for Archon.
Ok that’s better
A telepath could certainly be used/useful in police activities without compromising anyone’s right to avoid self-incrimination.. One way would be in witness interviews. With the witness’ permission, the telepath could read their memories of the event to get an independent (and trained) perspective on the events. They could also be used if a witness is unable to communicate to police due to injury or other condition. (Doubt they could be used in court as it would be hearthink.) They could probably be used the say way as a polygraph is used now, a person could volunteer to be examined by a telepath to rule themselves out as a perpetrator, but couldn’t be compelled to submit, nor could refusal be used against them in court.
Your points though are why they should NOT be in law enforcement. Every single point you made reinforces the fact that the telepath should be independent of law enforcement, so that their testimony can be seen not to have a bias. That way the evidence can be used by either the prosecution or the defence as may be appropriate.
The sex tape might break the internet; the making thereof might break the infrastructure. Two high-end FISS? “I think the Earth moved” might be literal.
Heh. Now i’m wondering about a PS238/Grrl Power crossover.
Made me laugh.
IIRC it’s canon in at least one DC universe, that may or may not exist any more, that when Superman and Wonder Woman did the nasty, they broke Mount Everest.
Juggernaut and an Alternate version of She-Hulk did it once too in Marvel Comics as well.
there’s even a specific TVTropes page for this, https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DestructoNookie
The TVTropes page Pendrake linked mentions the Smallville example, which was the first one I thought of.
But not the excellent Interviewing Leather, a short story series about a reporter abducted to interview a supervillainess who wants to talk about her background and motivations; I think many readers of Grrl Power would enjoy the series, come to think of it. Specific to this discussion, chapter 7 discusses some of the logistical issues involved in super-powered relationships.
She Hulk’s been with… a lot of guys.
At least according to the comic – under oath in court
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/4/40015/1121288-picture_1.png
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/4/40015/1121289-picture_2.png
Iron Man (to be fair though, Tony Stark probably has as many notches on his headboard as Deus)
Wyatt Wingfoot
John Jameson (JJ’s son)
Luke Cage
Juggernaut
Hercules
Sunman
Juggernaut
Starfox (not the video game character)
Hawkeye
Clay Quartermain
Some Swedish underwear model named Mika
Definitely not all of them – there were reaaaaaams of paper afterwards by the court stenographer.
Then it turns out that, contrary to any canon evidence to the contrary, her previous ‘origin story’ was fabricated to cover up the fact that she has such a huge libido that only the Hulk could satisfy her. And that she caught Hulkism off him, as a STD!
Which, with a really long incubation period going from female to male (thus explaining why it had not been observed publicly yet), would mean that all of those guys would start Hulking out too! And it may have spread throughout the super groupie world and beyond, in a global pandemic!
Most importantly though, would even Iron Man be able to make a suit which could adapt to Hulking out AND survive the kind of abuse that Hulk rage would inflict on it!
“Then it turns out that, contrary to any canon evidence to the contrary, her previous ‘origin story’ was fabricated to cover up the fact that she has such a huge libido that only the Hulk could satisfy her. And that she caught Hulkism off him, as a STD!”
Actually there as a canon story where the Hulk was horny and wanting to mate with She-Hulk and she turned him down because they’re cousins, so Hulk leaped off into the distance holding back manly tears.
I am not making this up.
No really, I’m not making ANY of this up. Not even the manly tears part.
I must post these pictures so people see that I’m not joking. My only regret is I can’t find the LAST page, where Hulk is crying with his arm covering his eyes as he leaps off
This is goddam canon.
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s–vHlBttB_–/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/17jz8opxisw2ojpg.jpg
https://alternativemindz.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/HULKWANT.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/7dPKtsG.jpg
there’s also a universe in which Hulk and She-hulk did the deed and she had the kids, but I can’t find the graphic novel anymore, I think someone may have stolen it from our town Library
Check under your bed. You might have a big fine for an overdue return!
Yeah, Hillbilly Hulk.
Again, I’m not joking. The alternate universe where that happened was ‘Old Man Logan.’
Don’t think that’s canon. It’s Nebezial, who IS a current DC artist (I think DC), but when he drew that one, it was pure fan. He likes his Wonder woman a little more Amazonian than they’d let him get away with.
That’s not canon actually. That’s an artist called Nebezial (real name – Stjepan Sejic) – and what you’re referring to is on his deviantart page – He made a comic book called Twitch, and a few others I think, and his art is incredible. His pictures of Wonder Woman, Supergirl, Harley Quinn, Superman, Power Girl, She-Ra, Big Barda, and Red Sonja are all amazing.
This is the picture to which you are referring.
https://i.imgur.com/YKzgzzu.jpg
He also has an ongoing comic called “Sunstone” (NSFW) that examines the BDSM world (currently have 3 or 4 of them, how ever many have been produced so far)
That’s the one with the angels and demons right?
No, this is just a normal world setting exploring the BDSM with someone new to the scene, a quick search will find it for you
and in one anime series *well its not official, legal reasons, and dates back to the eighties so less concern on cross overs*
Project A-Ko, the main character of A-ko is the daughter of Superman and Wonder Woman, who have a house in Japan. its a crazy universe, its also implied her rival B-ko is the daughter of Iron-Man.
its a comedy, and best not to be thought about too deeply when watching.
According to TVtropes, that’s a slight exaggeration of the events in The Dark Knight Strikes Again, where their sex resulted in earthquakes, tidal waves, and alterations of weather patterns.
So Krypton might have tried branching out into tourism and flying in several coach loads of 18-30 holidaymakers. Only to find that humans on Krypton all gain Super Man-like powers. With the apocalyptic result we all know about!
Max and Hiro crack me up. One of my favorite ships! But Hiro’s face in the 5th panel is a little creepy looking. I don’t know why. Maybe his lips are too thin?
I think it is the chin even for a ‘square jawed HERO’ that jawline is verging into Habsburg territory. But I really can’t draw for shit so take any criticism by me on drawing with a grain of salt (or maybe a whole shaker).
Mouth is too wide (when you consider we’re not seeing all of it), gives him a weird look.
Known as the ‘Flip-top head’, or ‘Muppet mouth’
Watching Hiro & Max get busy is kind of like watching a massive fireworks display. It’s really good provided you remember the important three words, “minimum safe distance”. :-)
“Silly hat at a Christmas party”….
Is that a Blackadder reference? Specifically, Blackadder III, Sense and Sensibility:
” Every year at the Guild of Butlers’ Christmas Party, _I’m_ the one
who has to wear the red nose and the pointy hat for winning the
‘Who’s got the Stupidest Master’ competition.
— Edmund : “Sense and Sensibility”
Sciona got away,the rest of the team is helping with the bridge repairs….
What’s left for ARCSWAT???
Filing the paperwork an finding out who was truly responsible for all of this mess (big gold clue: … )
try big glowy-winged clue. your arguement that it was Max’s fault was so full of holes it coulda been used as a sieve.
In regards to the bridge… sorry, Max was still negligent. (Of course, that’s a civil tort, not a criminal one. It could have been criminal if anyone had died, but we all knew that Dave wasn’t gonna let that happen.)
And before you say anything… for the umpteenth time, “I didn’t know Sciona could deflect my plasma bolt” is NOT a valid defense. We, the readers, know that when Sciona changed her flight path towards the bridge that she didn’t have anything good in mind. The people on that bridge had no such knowledge… and they’re the ones that would’ve been called to testify. Beware the trap of assuming that the characters would know what the readers know.
For the umpteenth time, negligence carries a “reasonable person” test, which requires that a reasonable person could have foreseen the danger. Since no one was aware that it could be deflected, no reasonable person would conclude that it was dangerous to the bridge to fire in that direction (as opposed to firing at Sciona with the bridge behind her, which carries an obvious risk of missing and hitting the bridge).
Also what does the knowledge of the people on the bridge have to do with whether or not it was negligence?
Simple. Did they know how dangerous Sciona was? Did they even know what Max was shooting at? Assuming that anyone even saw them pass by at that speed, Sciona would have been protected by the Veil. So they’re going to wonder what the hell she was shooting at that would justify that much firepower.
(I will concede that they might not have seen Max either, so the source of the exploding ball of plasma that destroyed the bridge support might’ve been a mystery too. If this were a real-world situation, I can envision all sorts of conspiracy theories springing up as a result, mostly involving UFOs, experimental aircraft, experimental weapons, terrorism, and so on.)
Even if they did see the real Sciona (instead of whatever the Veil makes her look like), they don’t know what she did or what she’s capable of… that’s knowledge that only Arc-SWAT, the Council, and of course the readers, would know. You are surely not ignorant of the times in the last two or three months that police have shot and killed an unarmed man, and the debate over whether or not that was “reasonable force”.
So, the question becomes “would a reasonable person believe that Maxima used reasonable force against whatever it is that they saw?” Because if she was shooting at a hummingbird, an armor-piercing explosive ball of plasma is serious overkill…
Also, you are mistaking “reasonable person” for “proximate causation”. “Reasonable person” is asking “would a reasonable person (as defined by a judge or jury), under the same circumstances, have done what the defendant did?”* It has nothing to do with whether or not a reasonable person knew it was possible for the plasma to be deflected.
Whether or not her plasma bolt could be deflected would be one of the factors considered under “proximate causation”. That is to say, is Maxima at fault because she was the one who fired it, or is Sciona at fault because she’s the one who deflected it?
* Ignoring the fact that it is highly likely that nobody except Maxima could have done what she did
I’m still failing to see how it’s at all relevant what the people on the bridge saw as far as a negligence case is concerned.
It doesn’t matter if THEY knew how dangerous Sciona was, because they weren’t the ones that fired the plasma ball, and they aren’t the ones deciding the case.
And of course knowledge of the ability to deflect the plasma ball is relevant for “reasonable person”. Without the knowledge that it could be deflected, a reasonable person would act in such a manner because it presented the least danger to the surroundings (after all, tackling wouldn’t be very likely to prevent damage to the bridge) and is the most likely course of action to neutralize the threat. With the knowledge that it could be deflected, a reasonable person would much more likely conclude that a different course of action is appropriate, due to the risks presented by the potential for deflection.
Yea. Apparently though if an expert gets involved then it gets to be judged by an omniscient being, rather than an average reasonable person.
Clearly a law in need of reform.
If introducing a new product to a market, or there are health suspicions around an existing product, then a reasonable expert should investigate any danger to the public.
However it if is known that no matter how extensive the research is conducted, that AT THAT TIME, it could not possibly have uncovered the truth, then I still very strongly feel that it would be unjust to find the expert negligent. If it does then we return to the urgent need for the law to be referred to legislators for review.
I really don’t want to go through having to repeat anything for the third page in a row, k?
Hey, I felt the need to grumble! Way down in the jungle. No wait, stop, I must not slip into some kind of retro song!
Yorp just likes to chase the ball back and forth.
Not that I want to do this for a third page in a row where I basically repeat the same thing over and over, but it’s relevant as far as a negligence case is concerned because those are the elements used in a negligence case. You keep missing what the standard is (Yorp seems to get it now, although he clearly doesn’t like it – but it’s actually a good standard which is why it’s also used in cases like the DDT cases and asbestos cases, and quite a few medical malpractice cases as well). Some people might not like it until you’re on the receiving side of the damages caused by a plaintiff.
Okay, I’m totally stopping now. I’ve posted waaaaaay too much so far, when most of it was repeating the same thing and trying to simplify to people who were arguing would understand. So far at least a few do understand, even if they don’t like the way the law works, and I’m content to hang my hat on that :).
You have done well, your rest is deserved.
Especially as, now that I know that aspect of the law, I will be sure to mention it, at pertinent times. Even if I diss it when I do. ;-)
So I have your back covered (to some degree – kind of like something lacy) should you get busy with case work.
Danke. (I wrote this post at 2am – I’ve been reading some of the most phenomenally boring briefs – they should not be called briefs if one is 213 pages long – since 7am :))
*yorpie snax for you*
*munch munch munch*
I will see if I can source some underwear with super hero comics printed on them. So that you can have interesting briefs to read.
You’re missing the point on this one. Whether the people on the bridge knew the danger Sciona presented isn’t relevant, because they weren’t the ones making the decision to fire. I don’t see why MSpears is bringing it up.
Also I really don’t see why you keep bringing up DDT and asbestos considering the industry knew the dangers of them LONG before litigation occurred.
The almighty Wiki corroborates this.
Lo, we must all bow down before it, and tremble in its mighty presence!
*genuflects in front of the internet (located at the top of Big Ben)*
Again, asbestos had been used for hundreds of years, same with tobacco
Yorpie, of course, that’s where it gets the best reception. :D
[Thanks for reminding me of one of the best episodes of IT Crowd, need to rewatch!]
hes being an idiot,
Basically,
1)she was shooting at a target over water. a shot that hit at the angle she was shooting would have gone into the water unless its ridiculously light and slow
2) Historically her shots tend to either plow through a target (Tank Ballistics Jell and even that pillar) Melt there way into the target (Tank which basically Liquidized and Vaporized the tank in the demo ) or detonate on impact,(Both Sydney’s and Discount Halo’s shield) Or Detonated AFTER Liquefying-Vaporizing the tank in the demo)
3) Given that Even US Airforce PJ and Police Dispatchers are Issued body cams nowadays I suspect they have some kind of video showing something of what happened up to that point.(the things you find out when you do FOI filling)
Given the above I suspect the more intelligent response by the media will be a “oh crap someone exists that is functionally immune to Maxima!
Guesticus: And asbestos and tobacco liability claims didn’t surface until LONG after they were aware of the danger (and frankly, the biggest reason anything even happened was because the industry KNEW the danger and conspired to cover it up)
Not only that, but Scona’s a dangerous enough individual that the risk of a few civilian casualties would likely be deemed justified anyway vs leaving her on the loose.
I specifically asked Pander about this, with multiple hypotheticals and a couple of real life examples…
After I finally, *finally* managed to pin her down (truly, arguing with a lawyer resembles nothing as much as wrestling an eel) I could get her to admit… That she was right all along.
No, seriously, she repeatedly dodged questions whose answer was essentially “if I assume what you said is true, my conclusion is even more correct”.
One of the points she adamantly refused to concede was that Max couldn’t possibly have known that using the plasma beam this way would be dangerous. She souldn’t even allow it as a hypothetical.
With a rope around her neck, she finally grudgingly admitted that, IRL, “I couldn’t possibly have known that using X in that was dangerous, nobody knew, nobody could possibly have known” was…
Not a sufficient defense for an expert.
I brought up the DDT lawsuits as an example, and she confirmed that the defendants tried to argue exactly that.
All of the lawsuits were *lost* by the same defendants, as were the asbestos ones (these were brought up by Pander herself. I can only guess that there were an apology for refusing to claim her own correctness? IDK, I can only thank her for clarifying the matter even more).
Max didn’t know using her plasma beam that way was dangerous, and she couldn’t possibly have known..IRL. that does not matter for the “expert” standard of care. I don’t see why it would matter now.
The standard experts are held to is, very literally, incredibly high – as in, it strains credulity. Alas, reality doesn’t have to be realistic.
The only way Max could possibly be innocent is if, somehow, you could *lower* the standard to a “reasonable person” one – instead of an “expert” one.
Unfortunately for her, Max is the person who knows the most about her powers, which makes her an expert in her own powers, and possibly the only one (believe it or not, Pander argued against this, too, even though, again, it makes *more* right, not less).
Even if you can discount that, she is still a military officer and/or a law enforcement officer, which makes her an expert in a different way.
She is well and truly boned, at least on the civil side of the lawsuit. Thankfully there is no criminal liability.
And Pander, I don’t mean to pick on you, but seriously, refusing to even entertain hypotheticals that effectively *prove your point* is… Well, I don’t know that I have a word for it.
I guess it’s a lawyer thing :P
Is this really a question?
Sciona has already killed a member of Arc-Swat (if not permanently due to Super Weirdness). She JUST got done murdering the hell out of Coot (if, again, not permanently due to more Super Weirdness). She’s a confirmed terroristic threat and a manufacturer of blatantly illegal weapons, if admittedly not in the public eye because Veil. Allowing her to escape without making every reasonable effort to apprehend her would be itself criminal. Maxima explicitly shot down; the deflection was Sciona’s.
I feel like modern IRL legal code, if this is really what it would say concerning this incident, would not survive intact with the advent of supers. Even remembering that the readers are more well-informed than most investigators would be, all of Maxima’s superiors (who are in on the Twilight Council secret and would thus be fully briefed on the threat Sciona poses) would back her actions. The public hue and cry would be one thing, and frankly no one can ever predict how that goes, but the actual legal fallout?
Not a chance in ninety-nine hells that Maxima actually suffers criminal charges. Her superiors would do SOMETHING to get her off the hook considering that she was, in fact, doing her job as she understood it to the best of her ability.
shot downwards*, as in against the acceptable backdrop of a river, not “I shot at something with innocent kittens behind it”. Damnit system, y u no edit…
There is an add-on to WordPress that allows editing, but Dave refuses to try it on the grounds that he’s afraid of erasing all the old threads by accident.
I’m sure it would survive the advent of supers :). There’s about 70 years of comic books where they try to deal with legal ramifications of superpowers :).
“Not a chance in ninety-nine hells that Maxima actually suffers criminal charges.”
Wouldn’t be a criminal charge, it would be a civil charge.
And that’s the last I’ll say about that because I’m not going to do another strip of legal commentary in a row. Would rather enjoy the arc and Sydney’s antics for a while. :)
There won’t be any bloody “charge” The simple fact Sciona’s involved and that this is fallout from a Twilight Council conflict means the whole thing will go under the cloak of National Security and the lawyers can go fuck themselves. Because the government is not entertaining legal proceedings that would instantly unravel the veil/broadly announce the presence and lethal violence being carried out by aliens.
Ammo for conspiracy groups and growing pressure for some independent watchdogging of Achon? Sure. Absolutely anyone who can tell gravity to ‘piss off’ making sworn statements in a courtroom? Not. Happening.
And… the difference between the Good Guys and the Bad Guys is… what? The Good Guys have Government backing? o_O
Bad guy = the person who set out to steal a couple of room-fulls of mystical weapons of mass destruction. And tried to kill cops and other people.
Good guys = those who are trying to stop the use or further distribution of said items. And who are trying to protect the people at immediate risk, as well.
Those with government backing can do the former (see the Nazis in the Indiana Jones and Hellboy documentaries as examples) or the latter. It is a matter of what they are doing, not who is backing them, that determines the morality of a situation.
A Nazi party member, who helped Jews or other persecuted individuals escape being murdered, was being a good person in doing that act. They were acting unethically mind (if their job included helping the round up and murder) however they were acting morally (in saving innocent people from such a fate).
I should add that the ‘unethically’ was as perceived at that time. However the Nuremberg trials clearly established that it is ethical to refuse to do an illegal order.
From which it is reasonable to state that covertly opposing such an order, where doing so openly might endanger your own life, is also ethical.
Just ensure that it is some other regime which gets to judge that, as the one you are working for is unlikely to agree with that argument! Given that they are already comfortable with issuing illegal orders and have created an environment where fear of death, for speaking openly, is paramount.
“Because the government is not entertaining legal proceedings that would instantly unravel the veil/broadly announce the presence and lethal violence being carried out by aliens.”
Actually, the fact that the government has to keep the veil covered up makes it even more likely that they’ll do a quick and VERY generous settlement so that no one ever investigates it closer.
Massive settlements on ludicrously easy to win cases are even more suspicious than shoving “national security” down their throat. The government throws “national security” at it if someone farts in an elevator.
I don’t know about the US, but the UK has laws which specifically allow them to gag people who try to reveal national secrets. The ones I am most familiar with are the ones used on the press. Because they grumble about them from time to time.
However there are other options available. Most typically (and there is a high profile case involving these in the US) includes making a payment contingent on signing a non-disclosure agreement.
So if you want your ‘suspiciously high’ payment, you need to sign on the dotted line.
If you do not you may just get run over by a bus. Or have an elephant drop on you.
OK maybe not the latter. Unless you really piss Maxima off. ;-)
Can’t write too much because I already made one semi-long post, was reading god-awfully boring stuff for almost 16 hours, and about to go to sleep, but in the US, a massive settlement is usually combined with a non-disclosure agreement (NDA) to not talk about the settlement or anything related to the lawsuit.
In fact, if you want people to get suspicious, start yelling ‘national security’ and don’t give the people who are suing anything. It’ll make every newsfeed.
But by the logic of Max being the only expert on her powers, how could she be an expert on *Sciona’s* powers? Max’s shots *do not* ricochet/bounce, so that had to to be something Sciona did (and we saw Sciona do the bouncing).
(Plus, as we saw at the Diner, there’s already rules for how super hero battles are guaranteed to break things.)
“No, seriously, she repeatedly dodged questions whose answer was essentially “if I assume what you said is true, my conclusion is even more correct”.”
I didn’t dodge any questions.
“All of the lawsuits were *lost* by the same defendants, as were the asbestos ones (these were brought up by Pander herself. I can only guess that there were an apology for refusing to claim her own correctness? IDK, I can only thank her for clarifying the matter even more).”
I brought up asbestos because it’s similar to the DDT example you brought up. :)
“The only way Max could possibly be innocent is if, somehow, you could *lower* the standard to a “reasonable person” one – instead of an “expert” one.”
Yep.
“Pander argued against this, too, even though, again, it makes *more* right, not less.”
Yep. The more of an expert you are, the more you could have known, with perfect prudence, that what you did would have gone FUBAR.
“She is well and truly boned, at least on the civil side of the lawsuit. Thankfully there is no criminal liability.”
Yep.
“And Pander, I don’t mean to pick on you,”
It’s cool.
“but seriously, refusing to even entertain hypotheticals that effectively *prove your point* is… Well, I don’t know that I have a word for it.”
Hypotheticals using flawed data will only give you a flawed conclusion. :)
”
I guess it’s a lawyer thing :P”
On the first day of law school, the dean of the law school had all of the entering class in the auditorium and said ‘When you come into this school, you think like normal laypeople. When you leave, you will think like lawyers. Your family is never going to understand what happened to you.’ :):)
She was a wise, wise woman.
And all ya’all are forgetting, Max wouldn’t be tried by a Civil OR a Criminal court- she’d be tried by a court martial, which means being judged by other officers who have experience with the sort of firepower she’s throwing around.
Actually, at least as far as I know, court martials are only for criminal charges, using the Uniform Code of Military Justice for misdemeanors and felonies. People sometimes get confused about that because they call both civilian civil and criminal courts ‘civilian courts’ – but one’s civilian is split into civilian civil (monetary damages, injunctions, and specific performance), and civilian criminal (jail time or fine but for a crime instead of a civil charge).
Argh…. every time I think I’m out, they pull me back in.
No…. no.
I’m not going to let myself get into another legal thing. I’m just going to ooh and ahh at Sydney’s use of the lighthook :)
Barberiaaaaaaaans!
Hello darkness my old friend.
:-D
I’ve come to talk with you again, because a vision softly punning, left its seeds while I was sleeping. And the vision that was planted in my brain, still remains, within the puns of smartass.
I must have kicked nuns and orphans in a previous life or something. It’s the only reason why this could be happening to me in this life.
He he he. Lol.
Wait!
Poor nuns and orphans!
*sniffle*
I wouldn’t if you hadn’t said not to.
If the forensics team is at all competent, it’ll be very clear who put the hole in the bridge. If there is any log kept of team communications it will be equally clear who saw the imminent danger she had just placed every civilian on that bridge in. And then any unbiased person reviewing the facts of the matter will clearly conclude exactly who decided to apply an uncertain band-aid to a situation of her own creation rather than eliminate the danger she had just caused.
The facts of the matter will bear witness to the fact that Sciona did not threaten the bridge or the people on it in any way, except in the mind of Maxima. She took no action against the bridge or any civilian, and was simply fleeing pursuit. Her sole aggressive action was to fight back after being tackled. For which she could be charged with resisting arrest. But the bridge? That was 100% Maxima.
Said civilian being a homicidal maniac believed to be in possession of one or more weapons of mass destruction, and who had markedly diverted towards the nearest civilian population density (said bridge).
Maxima was well within her rights, within the rules of engagement of the United States armed forces, to engage such a hostile target with extreme prejudice. Further she can give a full, truthful, report and detail why she made that conclusion, and be vindicated by the terms of engagement.
I put aside any discussion of any negligence claim, as that has already been talked to death. However, in terms of Maxima having the right to attack, both morally and legally, she is in the clear. Choosing to do so in a manner which she, for very good reason, believed would be perfectly safe, to the people on the bridge also puts her in a solid moral position.
Reiterating that this is setting aside the insane impossible to meet standard that has been previously argued for US negligence laws.
Yes, an fairly sure that even Pander will agree, Maxi was in the right to engage, what she wasn’t in the right about was how she engaged and with what
Hmm, if she gives a “full, truthful, report”, then she will have to explain why she told her team that it was Sci who attacked and damaged the bridge…
Because it’s functionally Sciona’s attack, since she deflected it in that direction?
Seriously? Maxi fired the plasma bolt, butt it now becomes Sci’s attack? o_O
As the most recent person significantly responsible for the path of the attack, yes.
Was Stalwart grabbing Maxima through Opal’s portal his attack or Opal’s? Obviously Opal’s, because she was the one that directed it there.
Nice rebuttal.
Needless to say, this is regarding your rebuttal, as the most recent person to deflect the course of the argument. As opposed to referring to the protest, which Guesticus launched at you.
That would only be the case if Sciona had been currently committing a felony. Then Maxima hitting her with a plasma blast and Sciona deflecting it would be her fault. As is, she was engaged in self-defense during no current felony (her last felony was hours ago) and so it’s Maxima’s fault instead.
Technically I only mentioned this because it was NOT part of the negligence debate, which I am no longer bothering to get into since I’ve written a novel on it so far.
She’s a fugitive in possession of a dangerous weapon who, upon realization she was being pursued, displayed an apparent intent to cause imminent harm to innocent bystanders and public property.
No self-defense in sight.
Whilst I accept that you have your misgivings over the mystical WMD, if it is taken that Maxima has declared her a hostile target, under the relevant rules of engagement, she is entitled to attack regardless of Sciona appearing to make a hostile move or whether weapons are visible.
I do concede, in advance, that Maxima’s statement was informal, but that matches the style of the comic (and Dave would not know the terminology, rules of engagement etc, so it is best us not getting him to waste time trying to research stuff like that).
As a military officer, acting to protect national security, she is well within her right to do just that however.
Even without that I would still say that a police officer, having good reason to believe someone is in possession of a WMD and is manoeuvring to deploy it, is likewise duty bound to act.
Here I must respect your right to believe that Maxima had plenty of time to saunter up and bop her on the nose. However that is a point which we shall continue to disagree on.
As such I will continue to maintain that a cop who does not believe there is time to issue a warning, or make use of non-lethal options, would likewise be justified in using lethal measures.
So, under your interpretations, where Sciona is only acting in self defence, your comment stands in its own right, and I would agree with it.
However in the opposing body of opinion (it not just being me arguing along similar lines) Sciona was believed to be a terrorist conducting a felony.
So no need to argue over the points that we know we do not agree on. But I would be interested in your opinion if we take it as being how I interpret the situation.
IF the court agrees that the cop had good reason to believe that the suspect had a WMD, AND that her past behaviour was indicative that she intended to deploy it here (whilst noting that you do disagree with that too, of course, and asking that you ignore that, too). Would those changed circumstances alter your opinion.
Note this is not me trying to whittle down your argument, by building a strawman. Do note that I have accepted your conclusions, based on your interpretation of the comic. I am just genuinely interested on your opinion should we interpret it the other way.
“No self-defense in sight.”
Wish I had the energy or time to explain why defending yourself from something being shot at you is self-defense, but too tired. Gnight all :)
What I mean is that no self-defense case exists, seeing as the attack against her was to prevent her from going through with the felonies she was attempting to commit.
“What I mean is that no self-defense case exists, seeing as the attack against her was to prevent her from going through with the felonies she was attempting to commit.”
A self-defense case absolutely exists. Well… technically there’s no such thing as a self-defense ‘case’ – there’s a self-defense DEFENSE STRATEGY. But in any case,
self-defense exists – self defense simply means ‘use of reasonable force to protect oneself from the attack of or bodily harm from an aggressor.’ – in which case.. .yeah, it’s self defense. Maxima’s the aggressor, at least against Sciona. There’s a threat of bodily harm obviously. And blocking an attack would be considered reasonable force. That the attack on her is to prevent what Maxima believes to be a future crime is not going to change that Sciona is acting in self-defense. It doesn’t change anything about Sciona’s past crimes, though. Not that this would ever wind up in a human court anyway, plus Maxima would have sovereign immunity from any criminal charge about her attacking Sciona in this particular situation in the first place.
Please, list the felonies Sci was attempting to commit, along with the proof
You forgot the key provision that self-defense must be against an unprovoked attack. Otherwise, a police officer trying to apprehend someone at gunpoint could be legally shot in self-defense. A known murderer with powers like Sciona heading towards an occupied structure would invoke the fleeing felon law, giving Maxima the right to use deadly force against her.
Under the current rules of engagement of the United States armed forces, proof is not required. It simply requires the belief of the relevant officer making the call, that a target poses a credible threat.
In this case that Sciona intends to use a WMD. Which is actually way more than is necessary, as the rules were framed with a terrorist using a civilian vehicle as a weapon. Most obvious of which, given 911, would be an airliner. However that is not stipulated so even a regular car would be enough.
These R.O.E. are intended for precisely the kind of situation you are concerned about. Namely that someone is not appearing to make an attack or committing any dangerous felony. However with intelligence giving strong suspicion that the individual is actually preparing to launch an attack.
In this case Maxima has ample cause to justify those suspicions, already listed in numerous posts. Please feel free to read a few. However those are not needed. Maxima need merely declare Sciona a hostile target and blast away!
Nice invention of facts to try to fit your theory. Do you and Maxima collaborate?
Sciona was only “displaying an intent” in Maxima’s mind. This imagined “intent” is exactly how cops defend themselves on the rare occasions they are charged for egregious violations of the law such as shooting dead unarmed persons who are not committing a crime. On the rare occasion that the prosecution even bothers to find that there is enough cause to file a change, that is.
And that imagined intent was realized as a fiction by the following 5 minutes which, in case you need reminding, involved no attack by Sciona against the bridge, and only involved Sciona defending herself against Maxima’s shot at her back and then teleporting away.
When you’re running away you aren’t supposed to get shot in the back. Unless you’re black. If you are black then that is apparently just fine and dandy in these here United States.
You need to have faith in your own goofball: Sydney would know to be on her betterest behaviour if she ended up being sent to a JSOC unit
At the very least she’d be more shy/reserved around people she doesn’t know.
In the exact same way that she was on her betterest behavior immediately after being introduced to The Council(™)? Tell me another joke, you’re a funny person!
hmm, when will orange balls ability be revealed btw? after this arc?
also to add, wonder about upgrades for rest of balls …
molestorb likely can get strength and length of tentacle and amount of tentacles , fireball obviously can get more modes like beam,missile etc, airball likely can generate wind,maybe even make tornadoes, bubble maybe gets targetable bubble (easy to trap or suffocate enemies or shield allies), fly one likely gets more height and speed, sight ball may get multi copies and aura of true sight (so everyone can see ) …of ability selects orange maybe then is enchantment (could be useful especially if it can hand out aura type enchantments), portal,storage, universal key or maybe reality hack
and in lack of edit button now to remember …orange most likely is enchant because sydney had tested all of em and two she didnt figure out, air because you can’t see air generation out of water and enchant if it was example body durability only way to spot it would been to get hit
I do not think the com ball will have a multi scry technique since it also has a teleport function. While an obviously useful ability to teleport to any one spot. The reduced controls make it unlikely.
well, it could work much like harems ability in sense that sydney would be able to choose to which teleport
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1166
I refer you to the “skill tree”.
While you bring up excellent ideas, I’m very curious about the, for lack of a better term, combo powers.
What about the direct links between each orb? Does the skill between Flight orb and Shield orb mean Auto-Shield-while-in-flight power?
Then what the hell are the powers of the inner circle, some of which are already lit up,?
Then the line of the flight power where she has 4 out of 5, and then she can start investing in the new line of skills? Is that more speed? or a whole new level of speed (i.e. going from Miles Per Hour to Astronomical Units).
As much as I love this comic and cringe at criticizing it unfairly, I’m afraid I’ll die an old, old man before we have all the answers.
Given that the link is a “tube” or double line, I suspect that may mean that two linked nodes may mean either that this orb when not used boosts the orb that it is linked to, or alternately , if the two orbs are linked and both are in use then both get a power boost.
You should have Sydney spend some time with the guys without a female babysitter. That way you can cover the lack-of-Sydney problem the comic’s had at the same time.
Wait, they have a stretchy guy?
Yup. Amorphous. He’s one of the two that ‘robbed’ the bank near the start. Specifically, he’s the one that Sydney judo-flipped after getting a grip on his tongue.
Yeah, Mr Amorpho (or something, just call him ‘Morph’), he is Heatwave’s boyfriend (the things he can do with his tongue… ), and, along with his Pest Bud Achilles (aka ‘Les’) formed a vigilante trio before Archon gave them the choice to join, or spend the next forever in Super Jail
Whoah, where was that mentioned?
About his tongue? It wasn’t. These things are simply implied.
Actually, it was shown what he can do with his tongue during the Bank Bust
Yep, Mr Amorphous specifically says (paraphrasing) “I had to remember that my tongue is not meant to be stretchy”.
So clearly, when not impersonating a mundane human, he can stretch his tongue (and likely the more kinky part) just as readily as we see him using his arm here.
Second Lieutenant Amorphous.
Wait, when did he become a 2LT? o_O
That is what he appears on the cast list as.
We should take the cast list ranks with a pinch of salt mind, as they represent the original ranks, before they got retconned. I do not recall Mister Amorphous being adjusted, but that was long enough ago that I only have sketchy memories, other than for the key individuals.
Didn’t realise Morph was so highly ranked, that puts him at the same level as Anvil doesn’t it? o_O
Higher actually. Anvil is one of the retcons. In the cast list she is a lieutenant, but the other day (when she was bossing Sydney around in the briefing) Dave mentioned her as being a sergeant in his blog.
Which I assume is just a case of him remembering the retcon, or having it written out somewhere, as I had forgotten due to that all being so long ago. However it is unlikely to be an error as her behaviour was spot on to what a sergeant would do.
Likewise when she was in charge of Sydney picking out her utility belt. That is the kind of thing that an NCO would be tasked with.
Dave may not be military, but he has been paying attention to the many comments about such matters, which have been made over the years.
Was sure Anvil was initially introduced as a Lt (not back when neither she nor Mai were named in the pre-flashback, butt when she was introduced to Sydney while sitting down on a couch)
Sydney skipped formal introductions. Instead she elected to go straight to putting her face in Anvil’s pubic triangle!
A feewww pages on, and we can see Morph in matching Purples with Hiro with LT Bar on his shoulder
Dang, fast promotion from that then. Not that I could find the scene you mention. But if you carry on until we see Hiro and Math in the locker room, he is sporting his major’s insignia.
Amorphous in purples is on this page https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/939 panel 8.
Also can’t really see what color his bar is in the low-res comic, but it looks like it’s probably gold, which is 2LT in the army (which is weird, considering 1LT is silver. Most people would expect it to be the other way around)
Thanks. Ahh, and I just read the part saying “Hiro with a Lt bar on his shoulder”, forgetting that this thread had been focusing on Mr Amorphous’s rank.
Yea, his shows clearly there. I had skipped Hiro, on that page, as his insignia was just a blob. So not being clear enough to match what I took to be the statement.
It is easier to think of the bars as being copper, rather than gold. That way you can correctly associate 2nd Lieutenant as being junior to lieutenant. Which is also consistent when you get to major being junior to lieutenant commander.
Oddly although the navy use the same basic insignia (the metal bits anyhow), and there are standardised rank codes across the services, they use the names do not match. For very good historical reasons mind. Even if it can be confusing for civilians at multi-service social functions.
So a naval lieutenant (two silver bars) is actually senior to the army & air force ranks of the same name. Likewise, more well known, with captains (the army and air force only equating to naval lieutenants).
The reason for silver representing higher ranks than gold is that the higher ranks were created first. The first officer ranks were lieutenant and captain. For centuries they remained the only naval ranks, with the positions we now associate with O-1, O-2, and O-3 all simply called lieutenant and O-4, O-5, and O-6 all called captain. When they eventually divided them, O-3 remained lieutenant and O-6 remained captain.
When permanent armies grew large enough to feel the need for an officer to be in charge of a group of captains (previously it would be a member of the nobility placed above the captains rather than a professional) they established the colonel (column commander). Just as the captain had an assistant called a lieutenant, the colonel had a lieutenant colonel as second-in-command. In the US, the colonel’s device was the silver eagle and the Lt. Col. was a silver oak leaf.
The ranks of Major and 2nd Lt came much later and since silver was already used, they chose gold insignia to distinguish them from the existing (and higher) ranks.
gimmethegepgun:- yeah, that was the page was referring to
Sorry Yorpie, didn’t make it very clear and can see why you thought was saying that Hiro had the LT Bar (wonder if that tastes as good as a Yorkie or Milky Bar? o_O ) :(
It reminds me of two parents flirting and their teen kids messing around in the background.
Yeah I constantly get a sibling vibe for Syd and Dabs.
I’ve said it before. Dabbles has a thing for Sydney. Granted, she has a thing for everyone, but she tends to get Anime eyes when Sydney makes incedental physical contact and show other signs of being smitten. Dabbler can have her pick of willing and insanely attractive partners, but Sydney is smart, funny (be able to make some laugh is huge) and has consistently surprised her along with everyone else. And the fact that Sydney has rebuffed Dabbles sexual advances creates a “you always want what you can’t have” situation to boot and I think Dabbler has actually got a pretty good crush for Sydney going. Not that she would let on, unless it was to her advantage.
It would be fun to see dabbler try dating without the sex.
Heh, yea.
As for Dabbler and Sydney, we should always bear in mind the scene in the steak house bathroom. Where Sydney got entranced by Dabbler’s hypnoboobs. Dabbler purposefully turned Sydney’s head, to break the hypnotic spell. Without that she could easily have taken advantage of Sydney (importantly the opposite of what you described, so this is aspect is of more relevance to the previous comment in the thread).
Not that I am disputing that Dabbler may have a thing for Sydney. It may just be that she likes Sydney, as a friend mind. But it is reasonable to argue that it runs deeper. Running with that assumption, Dabbler is very experienced (she is well over a hundred years old), so will have easily been able to pick up Sydney’s inexperience and extreme shyness.
So it could be that she is playing a long game, and trying to build up things gradually. With the occasional teasing, to probe how far along Sydney has progressed, on these fronts (the sexual, the romantic and, pretty importantly, her orientation).
Dabbler has, after all, used her porno sense and detected Sydney having sexual urges to her.
Which we know was accompanied with thinking “not a lesbian, not a lesbian”, but which Dabbler does not (she was picking up on General Faulk’s fantasies, so was not using that ability on Sydney, so could not get any clues that way).
As such it makes sense that, if she is particularly interested in Sydney, she would want to explore her reactions more, on an individual basis. Which we have seen in more than one conversation, along with pushing things too far with the spell that warmed Sydney in inappropriately intimate areas.
it could also mean, that if Dabbles wants to get into a relationship with Sydney, she wants Sydney to enter it with a (relatively) free-of-influence mind
Super rescues can be super fun to watch, but think of the costs (and the kitties!). The main support to a major bridge has been shattered. This will mean the rebuilding of major parts of the structure at a cost of 10’s if not 100’s of millions of dollars. And the fact that probably the only river crossing for miles will be out of commission for up to a year or more.
Plus, maybe they could build it right this time. Instead of one continuous cable holding up the bridge deck they had two separate cables bolted to opposite sides of a concrete pillar, in TENSION on a material that is only strong in COMPRESSION.
This rant has been brought to you by Reality (c). Making things less fun since some guy named Icarus tried to fly by gluing feathers to his arms.
[O.B.Juan]: Yes, I can see that…
…Perhaps Arianna might have the team do some rebuilding, of a more solid nature, later-on, once the current crisis is over? They’ll be able to get it finished far sooner than any conventional crew might manage. Not only is it good ‘PR’…
(…”Yeah, them Supers break stuff, but at-least they clean-up after themselves!”…)
…, but it also ‘reads’ (to the Public-At-Large) as a very visible disciplining…
(…”Bad Supers! You Break it — You Fix It! Serves You Right!!!”…)
…Combine this with the (presumed) lack of fatalities, perhaps even (contrite/concerned) Max & (bloody-faced) Hiro apologizing to the motorists who were frightened, & this might not generate as much negative press as some might otherwise fear…?
But are they Union members?
^_^
So…you are saying that mutants need to be registered in some way? Because that always ends well.
Simreeve is probably saying that construction tends to be unionized, and unions are very territorial about their work.
I was attempting to make a hidden reference to the Marvel Universe ‘Civil War’ Arc, and their superhero registration act. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Registration_Acts_(comics)
Apparently I hid it a little too well.
Yaknow….every time I read through some of their “Plot Point Legal Specials” I want to call the Marvel Offices just so I can demand they hire a Lawyer, Physicist, and Military Historian as consultants just so they could stop being dumba**.(I also want a “Continuity Guru”…but their job would ultimately be reading comics….sooo yeah not sure I can sell that…8-P)
They should hire Pander for two roles in the one job!
Not that this should be read as me trying to make Pander too busy to comment here. She is a wonderful person and her presence here enriches the community.
Whispering: Most of the time.
I love you too Yorpie.
Most of the time :)
He he.
*blushes*
Aww, thanks.
*paw drawing circles on the ground*
Yeah, no.
Suspension bridges work by having bundles of hundreds of continuous cables running the length of the span. The pillars are there to lift the cables up and the cables support the weight of the span in the same way that a shelf supports the weight of the things on the shelf, but the supports only hold the shelf up. You don’t have sections of shelving attached to the sides of the supports, you have a continuous shelf on top of the supports.
Plus, unlike shelving, which is stiff, cables are flexible, and they absorb the vibrations caused by the vehicles moving over the bridge and from the wind. With a long continuous cable, the fundemental frequency is very low, and the vibrations are damped out. With shorter, separate sections of cable, the fundemental frequencies would be much higher and the vibrations would have a greater potential to reverberate over the bridge, resulting in potentially disastrous resonance.
I think Juan was trying to say that they built it wrong (ie. Dave drew it wrong) the first time. We can see that the current construction is cable bolted to the side of the supports.
I think I’ve figured it out: DaveB conflated suspension bridges with cable-stayed bridges. A suspension bridge (as RBZ rightly points out) is a long continuous cable with dozens of thinner vertical suspension cables of varying length hanging down from the main cable to support the immense weight of the deck and the loads it carries.
However, a big drawback of suspension bridges is that they need to be anchored to the ground on either side. That’s not always possible if there isn’t room for the cables or appropriate bedrock to anchor them into. That’s where cable-stayed bridges come in. A cable-stayed bridge balances two sets of suspension cables on either side of each pier, which supports the load.
On the downside, a cable-stayed bridge is seldom longer than 3,000 feet, whereas a suspension bridge can be much longer; the world’s longest, the Akashi Kaikyō in Japan, is more than 12,600 feet long.
(P.S., although people always notice the cables in a suspension bridge, they often fail to spot the girders and trusses reinforcing the deck underneath. This is a subtle and quite important point: most bridges are actually composites of two or more of the basic bridge types.)
Everyone’s probably seen a picture of a suspension bridge, but for reference, here’s a picture of the Arthur Ravenel Bridge (cable-stayed) in South Carolina, as seen from the water:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Arthur_Ravenel_Bridge_%28from_water%29.jpg
One of my favorite all time bridges is a cable-stayed monster over 8000 feet long: The Millau Viaduct in southwest France. That thing is unreal.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millau_Viaduct
And the way they built the Millau Viaduct is absolutely nuts.
Heh. With him talking about ‘launching’ the bridge, I had visions of a big catapult!
My research did not inform me of that one. I admit to being impressed. Just… wow.
A minor quibble…
In Panel_2: Hiro’s line:
“I don’t want this to shift until Dabbler’s patch sets.”
—
“…until…”?
(I wouldn’t want it to shift at ALL!)
Wouldn’t you rather say “before”, instead of “until”…?
It has to shift. The whole point of suspension bridges is to have enough “give” to deal with movement, wind etc,
Even if it is a patch job meant to secure dangers, you want it to still have enough give where it wont’ just “snap”
its the same reason why cement structures (buildings, these towers, etc) all typically have Rebar in them.
Cement is crazy solid and can’t compress badly. but. they can’t shift twist or bend without snapping like candy glass.
Concrete, not cement.
Sorry, grandfather worked in construction and that was drilled into us.
Always good to reinforce the difference
Was that a pun? I feel like that was a pun.
It was set like it might be one. I think your suspicion is a holey good one.
Not every day an engineer has a good set up for a concrete joke, couldn’t let it float past. Hope it didn’t aggregate anyone.
…sorry I can’t help myself, but you started it. :D
I did?
“drilled” doesn’t SEEM like a concrete pun. Maybe a construction pun I guess?
i’d say that drilled would be a very concrete pun
I love how this thread is structured. An aggregate of concepts, reinforced by a strong theme and set into a useful social edifice.
We are building an enduring monument!
Suspension bridges aren’t rigid. They move around somewhat (which makes them poor for railroads).
Dabblers father is a lawyer. They call him ‘The Quibbler’.
Sure that is not Pander‘s wrestling name? o_O
LOL. ROFL. Falls off edge of world and notices that it really is flat!
Would then fall off chair, in amazement, but it is rolling in another direction.
Okay, that was funny :)
…and now, I will forever imagine that Pander looks like Luna Lovegood. Well played, sir.
Ahh, so maybe you also think that Pander has an interest in magizoology? Cryptozoology to those of us wot speak English.
The lochness monster and sasquatch both exist, dangit.
One of them owes me $3.50.
Aw, now you’ll never get rid of him!
Probably Nessie, she’s touchy about people spotting her like that.
If it was Satch though, you’re out of luck – no one’s seen him in years. I think he finally just moved to the retirement community in Connecticut.
Interesting premise.
Of course nobody has seen Sassy. He is a master at hiding!
LOL
A couple of things which occurred to me while reading this page:
– Is Amorphous just providing a place for Hiro to put his feet while holding the cable together, or is he strong enough to be contributing to the effort? If the latter, I think this is the first time we’ve seen him display that level of exceptional strength.
– I’m a little surprised that Dabbler doesn’t have a jet pack or antirgrav belt or enchanted boots of wind-walking ready to hand (well, “port-gate enabled cyber-hand”) for this kind of situation. She’s probably designing one in her head right now, actually.
I too am wondering about his apparent use of super-strength.
Actually, because my first post was pre-coffee, I only now recalled that *since Hiro can fly*, he doesn’t need anybody to hold him up. So yeah, I guess Amorphous has summa dat supa-strength. And if he’s contributing in any significant way to stabilizing the main cable on a suspension bridge, he’s no slouch in the raw power department, either.
I don’t think heh as super strength. Hiiro is doing almost all the work. Amorphy is just being the “structure” and hiiro is providing the force.
Very cool use of the Lighthookl.
.
Wiki
Oops. Intended as a reply to Joe’s question above.
Thankee kindly! Guess I should refer to the published info more often.
AUGH.
Listen, it’s your comic and you can do what you like, but I’m gonna go off on a bit of a tear as to why this would have been a terrible idea.
1) “Quid pro quo” sexual harassment: This is a big one. Maxima, as both a superheroine and a rather strident feminist, would be well aware of just how big of a problem this is, and, as a heroine, would be aware of just how hypocritical it would be to fight against this sort of thing from men but think it’s perfectly okay for her. You’re the writer, and she’s your character, so I can’t sit here on the internet and say “MAXIMA WOULDN’T DO THAT RAR RAR RAR RAR RAR” but I will say tread very carefully before portraying the group’s most well-known feminist as a hypocrite in a webcomic that is consistently in the top three (currently #1) on TWC.
2) Even bigger: Even the appearance of this kind of impropriety is career-endingly bad for a military officer. Especially considering that as a Colonel, and as the CO for a highly public, highly publicized military force that is already on shaky ground legally and publicly. If just one complaint is made, and believe me, a complaint would be made by someone, Max would find herself in front of an extremely public Congressional Hearing. She would be publicly censured at best and at absolute worst, not only would she be cashiered, but the entirety of Archon would be disbanded, its members transferred to other branches.
Leaving aside the in-universe stuff, on a personal level, I want my heroines and heroes to be heroic. It’s okay for them to be flawed — even extremely flawed. But in the end, if they’re not heroes, why would I read about them?
Well, a big thing would probably be is whether such thoughts are idle musings in the back of her brain she won’t act on because she knows are wrong or deliberate. If the first, there’s not really any harm, so long as she self-regulates. If the second, year, an issue.
*deliberate, conscious thoughts she’s considering.
**yeah, an issue.
Why no edit function? :(
No amount of illegal prevents people from attempting to think about how to work around the problem.
Also, as I understand it, she’s not thinking quid pro quo sexual harassment. Hiro has expressed interest in her. She’s interested in him, but can’t take advantage of his interest due to their positions. It’s only quid pro quo sexual harassment if it’s an unwelcome sexual advance, because it’s only sexual harassment if it’s unwanted. That’s also not saying that your point two is not completely valid. But that just means that her plan must get somebody else to decide Hiro needs to be promoted and take the steps to make it happen… without letting them know she had any interest in that happening.
I suspect that she could also get around the issue by having him transferred to someone else’s command, but that would still have some issues. But all of her dating options have huge issues. For her, there’s no getting around that.
I am soooo not getting involved in THIS legal argument :)
Bee-berry-ants!
Okay.
Well, it seems I was wrong about what Barbarians do. I have changed professions and become Khan of the Herpderpian Horde. Beware my banana-sword Slipeth.
*pats your head*
Mind the horns, they’re sharp.
Watch out for horny guys on the internet. Gotcha. Good advice.
Ahh, looks like somebody else is sharp too.
LOL.
Yea, totally agreed.
Mind you ParchmentScroll is perfectly correct that they are skating on thin ice and should pay attention to avoiding the impression of impropriety. Not that they have actually done anything inappropriate in this scene, beyond giving that impression.
Your point though that Maxima and Hiro both have very limited potential dating pools does give mitigation here. In a very literal sense. The government has chosen to concentrate all of their supers under a single command. Essentially that is taking most of Maxima’s potential partners (everyone else being too squishy) and putting them under one roof. With rules that prohibit her dating them!
So leeway should be given for an option like promoting Hiro to lead the East or West coast teams, when they get set up. Thus making Hiro a peer, rather than a subordinate.
In the meanwhile Faulk, as a reasonable commander, could turn a blind eye to any sexual tension. That is an unavoidable side effect of the situation described, after all. So long as it does not progress to any form of a relationship (beyond their military one) or become apparent to anyone who might leak it to the press, or otherwise exploit that observation to the detriment of the unit.
So discretion is wise. But Maxima runs this unit more like a close-knit family than a traditional military unit. Which is not uncommon amongst elite special forces units. It is a closer bond than one imposed purely by military discipline. So can work in the smaller units, where interpersonal relations can be individually monitored and made to ensure that any laxness is not compromising the unit.
Tricky, and not per the mainstream rule book, but doable.
[Yorp]: Your point, re: “potential dating partners” raised a red-flag in my mind…
…what if this was DELIBERATE???!?
Rather than get her hackles up by saying, “We don’t want Supers to breed.”, they’ve just created a set-up where all of her potential choices are prohibited by the existing command structure.
If you look into the “Behind The Scenes”-features of the “Incredibles”-DVD, you’ll find that this is a plot point that PIXAR considered (& dropped) early-on in their storyboarding phase of development.
Much like it is in the Marvel Universe, there might be people (somewhere in this story’s “positions of power”) who fear that the story of “Supers-Vs-Humans” might become a re-telling of the old “Humans-Vs-Neanderthals” scenario.
:)
Well put forwards. But I think, as with most conspiracy theories* the pressing need to counter super villains and hostile governments with supers would easily take precedence. However that does not discount the odd individual who would be pleased with the side effect listed.
Nor would it preclude that someone might have biased the selection for the purposes you state. Assuming that the initial lists were prepared by some faceless bureaucrat or politician who may have had such an axe to grind.
If, for example, it turns out that the gender ratio for strong super powers is not actually female heavy in the US, then you may be on to something.
Or it may turn out that big corporations offered more money to male supers than female ones, thus leaving the females to the lower paying but more socially responsible role in Archon.
Which, given just the two options, I would easily favour the latter.
* Admittedly in super settings conspiracy theories websites/magazines can turn out to be informed investigative journalism. And MIB ran with that gag.
“the pressing need ” —–>
“the more obvious pressing needs, such as “
@ParchmentScroll: Yes, it is a career-ending move to be caught fraternizing with an officer in the same chain of command. But there is a big difference between actually doing it and just thinking about it. I don’t recall that the military has any Thought Police yet.
Having said that: No, the entirety of Archon would not be disbanded, because she is not in command of the whole thing. That would be General Faulk. Maxima is only in command of ARC-SWAT, and not any of the other divisions.
Furthermore, Maxima only commands them in combat ops. She’s more of a squadron commander than anything else.
Hiro is one paygrade below Max. In a conventional military Maxima would be commanding a Battalion. But ARCSWAT is essentially a Special Forces unit, so the normal TOE (Table of Organization and Equipment) for a conventional infantry unit goes right out the window. Keeping in mind that the actual composition of units in the field hardly ever adhere to the TOE, the smallest infrantry unit is a fire team consisting of four men with a Corporal in charge of three privates. Two fire teams make up a squad which is commanded by a seargent or staff seargent (E5 or E6) . Four to five squads make up a platoon with an Second or First lieutenant in charge (O1 or O2) with an Seargent First Class (E7) as second in command. This is the first level of command for commissioned office. And while the green as Grass lieutenant is either fresh out of the academy or has six months to a year under his belt, he’s paired with an NCO, his platoon Seargent,vwho has at least ten years of experience, if not more. The idea here is for the neophyte officer to learn from his platoon Seargent who acts as a mentor. Good officers listen to those NCOs. It take four Platoons, more or less, to make a company commanded by a captain (O3) and a First Seargent (E7) with a first lieutenant acting as the XO (executive officer/second in command). The next level up is a Battalion, made up of several companies, usually four, commanded by a Lieutenant Colonel (O5, Maxima’s rank) with a Major (O4, Hiro’s rank) as the XO and a crusty old Seargent Major or Command Seargent Major (E9) with at least 20 years in the service and probably closer to thirty, as the senior NCO. Beyond this are regiment made up of at least four battalions commanded by a full Colonel (O6) and Command Seargent Major (E9) a brigade made up of four or more regiments commanded by a Brigadier general (O7, general Faulk’s rank) and a CSM. With real world Special Forces you tend to have small units of very high ranking personel for the unit size because special forces draw from the best of the regular forces. So, where in a conventional infantry unit Maxima would be commanding a Battalion of between 300 and 800, she’s commanding what amounts to an abbreviated company. The rank structure is further thrown out of whack by the fact that there are people like Maxima who are veterans drawn from the other services and people like Sydney who are raw recruits. Harem is corporal which means she hasn’t been with ARC for more than a couple of years at most. Add to the fact that power and experience aren’t paired in the same individuals, and the conventional command structure goes right out the window. Sydney may tick off and conventional or Special Forces commanders that have to deal with her, but she basically brings so much power to the table that putting up with her shennanigans is in their best interest. I think Max understands this and also understands that the traditional military discipline necessary to keep a green infantry private in line in not necessary with Sydney and would actually be counter productive. Treat her harshly enough, and she might leave. As to relationships with subordinates, the best way for Hiro and Max to have a legit relationship is to expand ARCSWAT to the point that there is a reason to split the team in two, promote Hiro, and give him command of the second team so he’s no longer in the chain of command under Maxima. One thing to note is that even the highest ranking NCOs, Command Seargent Majors (E9), is technically outranked by the lowest commissioned officer, Second Lieutenant (O1). However, those high ranking NCOs hold a lot of real power and are backed up by the commissioned officer directly over them. On one FTX when I was stationed in Colorado we had a newly assigned platoon leader, a Second Lieutenant. Three days into the exercise he was frazzled. He had been running around micromanaging everyone in his platoon and hadn’t sleepy much at all. Finally, our platoon Seargent, who had apparently been trying to get him to go to sleep told him,
“Sir, please go to bed.” To which the LT said something like,
“But Seargent, it’s my job to command these men. I can’t do it if I’m asleep.” Our company commander apparently overheard and popped out of a nearby foxhole and asked,
“Lieutenant, did Seargent Pettit tell you to go to bed?”
“Yessir.”
“Then go to bed.”
Good explanation! You win one Internet. ;-)
The reason I called Maxima a “Squadron Commander” is because she’s formerly from the USAF. As a former Captain in the USAF, I think I can reasonably assure you that the Air Force does not have battalions. They have squadrons (usually led by an O-5 like Maxima), groups (usually led by an O-6), and wings (usually led by an O-7).
I was going with experience as an Army enlisted. Most army units, and assume Marine units, use the TOE I listed for infantry with modifications. Artillery units call their company level units a “battery” while Army Aviation uses the company/battalion/brigade nomenclature. I think Cavalry units may use “squadron,” but I’m not sure, and in modern times there’s armored Cav (ground armored units) and Air Cav (helicopter units). Getting a bit nerdy, but I suppose ARCSWAT could use a kind of Air Force or Armored unit model, where officers and senior ranking NCOs go into battle and the mid level and lower enlisted server as support personel. Except that you have Sydney and Harem who are both very powerful but inexperienced. That also brings up Warrant Officers who are somewhat out side the chain of command and are usually in a specialist feild. They outrank enlisted but are technically outranked by all commissioned officers though no 1st Lt with more than two functional brain cells will attempt to order a Warrant officer around. Warrant are Warrant officer (W1) and Chief Warrant officer 2-5 (CW2 – CW5). IFf she weren’t already a Lieutenant, Peggy would have made a perfect Chief Warrant Officer. They tend to operate outside the command structure answering directly to a single commissioned officer and aquire a wide array of skills that most enlisted or commissioned personal don’t have the opportunity to pick up. Being a former CW2 or CW3 who got “promoted into the direct command structure could explain why Peggy is both a sniper and an Osprey pilot. A simple way to confirm this in story would be for Max to slip up and call her “Chief” in a stressful moment.
Very logical and well-reasoned. I totally agree with you in regards to Peggy. In fact, I think I’ll make that my new headcanon.
Thanks. I also keep forgetting Max is former Air Force. I would say General Faulk’s blue uniform would mark him as a former Air Force officer as well. It would make sense if he were Max’s commanding officer in the Air Force as he would have experience with both commanding supers and commanding relitively small units with powerful individual assets.
My point about ARCHON being disbanded was that a scandal of that nature would taint the whole org right at the outset. She’s the CO for ARC-SWAT, which is the entirety of the fieldable personnel for ARCHON.
A major scandal at the Flag Officer level in an organization that is skating on VERY thin ice legally to begin with? It would sink not just ARC-SWAT but the entire branch.
As David K. Storrs points out: If he can get promoted, they can make him the CO of his own unit (we know they have more than one team). That puts him out of her chain of command, thus rendering the fraternization problem moot. The tricky bit is figuring out how to promote him without making it look like it’s something she wanted.
Though what would definitely make the fraternization point moot is for her to have an affair with someone in another branch of Archon, or someone who doesn’t even work for them.
‘Career Endingly Bad’ isn’t a thing for these people. The notion of firing them is ridiculous. Their careers will end when they quit or die in battle.
I read it as “…get him promoted so he’s equal rank to me and out of my unit, and therefore it’s okay for us to get together.” Which doesn’t seem terribly immoral to me…she’s not offering him a promotion in exchange for sex, she’s arranging for him to be promoted beforehand so that the possibility of sex exists without being illegal or immoral, but not compelling him.
I’m sorry, but if the motivation for finding a reason to promote someone is wanting to have a relationship with them, physical or otherwise, even if the recipient of the promotion doesn’t know this and it’s not any sort of condition, then that’s amazingly unfair to the rest of the unit. It’s not harassment of Hiro, but it’s still skeevy as hell, and I hope it never moves any close to textual than it already it is.
It’s kind of a wash. Hiro is already second in command of ARCSWAT, presumably on his own merits. If the organization grows, he’ll get promoted and get a command of his own soon and as a major has already commanded at both the platoon and company level.
What makes it worse is she’s ex Air Force as is her CO. Last I checked they still have a three-ranks rule to determin when frarenisation was no longer a problem among officers. Meaning that at best the lowest ranking commanding officer over Max and Hiro would need to be a O8, or Major General.
Clarification, the lowest ranking officers in their chain of command Over both Max and Hiro would have to be a 08. NOT MAX.
If Hiro would probably be safe if he was dating a captain in ARCDARK or ARKLIGHT for example.
She’s might be the male with the most panel-time, but I think Math is the one with the most development and comedy.
Auto-correct. Zeus might be the male with the most Panel Time…
Auto-correct again. I think you mean Deus might be the male with the most Panel Time.
Don’t sweat it. Whenever I have to type on my phone, Autocorrect gets me too. My phone seems to have an especially bad problem with paint colors…
Zeus was very well known for his sexual proclivity. And the names are only one character different, yet has successfully disguised his true identity all this time. AnonymousGX may be on to something!
“Gonna have to figure out hot to get him promoted.” Did Dave just Freudian slip, or did Max?
Dabbler is more than pulling her weight yet again :)
it is a good thing Hiro tanked that cable. snapping bridge cable woulda cut a normal person clean in half.
More like turn him into a splotch of paste.
Historically Pendrake is correct. As I would expect from anyone from someone with a name having such West Country associations. It is well known, in naval and fishing circles, what happens if a cable snaps at sea. Anyone too near gets chopped into two parts.
It does not matter that the force is well in excess of what is needed to do that. It simply means that the next person in line gets the same treatment, and anyone else beyond them too, provided the cable reaches them.
This is no different to cutting a sausage with your knife. It does not get turned to paste, it just gets severed.
Depends on the size of the cable, and where slash how it connects to the meat-sack
Not in the vast majority of situations. Cables are made of metal, wrapped around in bundles. For them to be used in shipboard situations they have a minimum size to be able to hold a ship in place. In order for them to get under sufficient load to snap, they will do so with considerable force.
Human flesh is just not up to resisting steel being flung with that kind of force. Whatever is hit will be severed. If it happens to only hit an ear, the ear will be lost. Anywhere else it strikes there will be one part of the body going in one direction and another in the other.
Possibly there may be small cables for things like buoys, or lobster pots. But those are far less likely to get in a situation where they will snap, as they are securing very small things. Only if they first get snagged on something, will it be likely for them to violently snap, and then only if it is the ship or something equally heavy causing that.
With the same result, as a thin metal cable will tear a person apart just as easily as a thick one.
Wasn’t just referring to shipboard situations, and neither was Roborat, look at the size of the cables used in this bridge for prime example
Presumably it was one of the support cables that Hiro blocked, not the main cable – these would be no more than a couple inches / centimeters… Do we prefer metric here? At most the width of your hand, but probably more like 2 fingers. Not wide enough for squishing an entire human to goo, that is – though easily fatal in a very messy way nonetheless.
Hiro’s wound sounds/looks like an actual cut from the sharp edge of the broken cable end, or possibly split skin from the impact force of the side of the whip end.
Oops, yea, if someone got hit by a cable bigger than they are … liquefaction.
In most military like organizations, it would have to be more than just a promotion for Hiro and Max to be able to have a relationships, he would have to be transfered to another department or team so that he is not one of her direct subordanites. Its not so much about rank, but chain of command.
In my 2nd enlistment, there were 2 sergents in my unit that were married. One was in first platoon (my platoon) the other was the platoon leader for 2nd platoon as he was a higher rank. His wife was not in his platoon so not under him along the chain of command.
My assumption would be that if he was promoted to be her rank he would also be transferred to a different unit — perhaps a newly-formed-for-the-purpose platoon or such.
Yes, Dave’s comment was an abbreviation of what Krahazik describes above. As such has been discussed in detail in previous blogs and/or comments that Dave has responded to.
By the way there is an exception to the rule. If the relationship was a pre-existing one. So for instance if a husband and wife get posted to the same base or ship. Ideally they should serve in separate departments, but sometimes their operational role may not allow that.
I have actually been in that same situation myself, in a civilian setting. It would have been against company policy, barring the fact that we were hired knowing that. And there had been a company-wide reorganisation which ended up putting us in the same department, despite being hired to work in separate ones initially.
Mind you we were on separate sides of the internal barriers which are set up to prevent fraud and embezzlement. So it is only through the sake of our good characters that they were safe. If not I could easily have generated fraudulent money transfers, and any checks would have passed cleanly, without anybody else in the company getting involved!
Given the fact that we routinely handled seven or eight figure sums, it would not have seemed out of place to anyone peripherally involved to see one more amongst many. So that could have been catastrophic for the company!
And if Sciona gets that blood too, that’ll be a nasty blood magic golem indeed.
I think she’s past the point of blood golems.
Well presently she has to retreat from Maxima. But with an army of golems, including ones with Maxima’s powers, and others that can steal any super powers (with a blood sample), she would not have to retreat from anybody!
So now we know what it takes to draw blood from Hiro (sort of, I can’t do that math).
At a rough guess, I am going to figure the business end of a snapping bridge cable is traveling at roughly Mach 1 and is slightly heavier than a 50 caliber bullet (I don’t think we worry about the weight of the entire cable)?
Is that all the data we need, or do we also need to figure in where Hiro sits on the Mohs hardness scale (I’m going to guess just below steel, or he’d only be bruised)?
In any case, that seems to put his toughness just barely on a ‘military’ scale. Infantry probably could not handle him; you’d need at least armored vehicles, but a few tanks might be able to match him?
He also tanked that explosion from the Golem.
And he “absorbed” a sound-attack during the riot fight.
We’re definitely missing something about Hiro’s durability.
It may be at least partly based on a force field, like Maxima’s. Maybe he has ‘touch telekinesis’?
The actual details are probably fairly well known…here’s a training video I had to watch while I was in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGH_GUbdTeQ
Snapback is a B*tch.
I love Max and Hiro in the last panel, with their annoyed “We’re
standingright here, you guys, we can hear you.” expressions.Also I feel like their banging would cause shock waves and break various things
Hiro might be able to absorb the shock waves. Only doubt is because sometimes powers aren’t self feeding. As in you can’t benefit from stuff you are direct cause of.
Dabbler may be the weirdo, but it it Sydney’s tentacle fondling Dabber’s leg!
Check closer Yorp. It’s not even touching it’s forming a coiled perimeter around her leg. Most likely in case Dabbler falls off & so that Halo can grab her by the leg to catch,
Yes, that is a very plausible excuse. ;-)
You realize your making Maxima hypocritical as fuck, yes? She gives Math tons of shit for his antics.
No, she’s not being hypocritical. It has been shown that they both have an interest in each other. If he wasn’t under her commend, and the proper regulations were being followed, then a relationship could be pursued.
Difference being, Math doesn’t keep it in his head, and he acts on it
+1 to both replies.
They both have feelings for each other. But have made it clear that they cannot pursue any relationship whilst in their current positions. That does not stop them having such feelings. So there is nothing hypocritical about Maxima’s behaviour here. She has been open and honest about the situation, to those in a need to know.
And it is this which will allow a solution to be found, when an opportunity becomes available. In the meanwhile they just have to live with it. And hopefully pay attention to being more discreet, in situations where it might compromise the unit.
Yeah, they totally need to change their position to that of horizontal :P
I LIKE not seeing any “romance” involved, especially when you have female protagonists involved. So often having a female protagonist devolves into doing whatever they’re doing “for love”. Male protagonists get to be motivated by honor, duty, guilt, etc. . . . Female protagonists? She has got to be motivated by the hornies for some guy.
LET Max be aloof. She’s allowed to be. Not all women HAVE to be motivated by sex.
Actually, PLEASE allow her to be aloof. I’m really, really, really tired of seeing sex/sexual relationships enter the picture whenever a female protagonist is involved. Please let her be different. Max is supposed to be the super feminist, right? Extend that to the story and give her something other than relationships for once.
I don’t think it’s romance she’s thinking of, per se. Sex, yeah. Which I DO like seeing – she actually does have a healthy sex drive, and she’s also a heterosexual woman (and since all too often feminists are portrayed as not just lesbian, but also misandrists, this is a refreshing change – she’s pro woman, but also interested in men).
Also, it’s not hypocritical – she’s having tempting THOUGHTS. Thoughts are not actions. She’s attracted to Hiro. EVERYONE’S attracted to Hiro – every straight or bi female and every bi or gay male, plus any intersexed individuals (and we have no idea how many of those exist in the comic, given all the various creatures and superbeings in it) is attracted to Hiro. But there’s a difference between feeling attraction and acting on it. If anything, this makes her seem more impressive – she’s holding herself up to her own standards, and setting a good example.
A lot of people like sex, and like to be in relationships. Max apparently likes men, and is faced with the quandary that just about any men (or women, for that matter) that are anywhere near her class are directly under her command. And the humorless Ice Queen commanding officer is a trope that has been done to death.
This comic though is already heavily exploring sexual matters. Dabbler most obviously, along with Harem and Math on the guy’s side. Plus Sydney (and Maxima herself), at the other end of the scale.
As such I feel it would leave the comic in an unpleasant situation if it only ever explored the sexual side of things, but not balancing that with the romantic aspects we would also expect to see in a normal, healthy, environment. I.e. outside of a porn movie.
The world wide scientific and engineering community would like to thank Dabbler for handing them a new type of polymer to play with.
Unless her ‘non-interference’ Prime Directive has her goop act like Spider-man’s webbing and dissolve after a few hours. :)
(In which case they better sped up the rest of the repairs)
Don’t worry about it. “Poly-myomer ceramic” is really just a combination of technologies that we almost have already.
(1) Myomer … using vanadium dioxide, scientists at the Lawrence-Berkeley National Laboratory were able to create a new kind of robotic muscle that they claim is up to 1,000 times stronger than normal human muscle. We’re still decades away from applications of such things, but the prototype exists.
(2) Electroactive polymers… EAPs are polymers that exhibit a change in size or shape when stimulated by an electric field. The most common applications of this type of material are in actuators and sensors. Some EAPs can exhibit up to a 380% strain, which is much more than any ceramic actuator.
(3) Piezoelectric ceramic actuators… Exactly What It Says On The Tin. We’ve been using these for a very long time. The problem, compared to myomer, is that it is practically impossible to reach significant stroke without displacement amplification.
So, basically, what Dabbler’s using is three different types of artificial muscle, all of which humans can replicate. The real genius is that she’s made it possible to apply them with a spray applicator. The mystery to me is where the electric current is coming from, unless she’s reversed the usual behavior of myomers… normally, they contract when a current is applied. In this case, maybe contraction is their normal state and they relax when a current is applied. I dunno.
Point is that it isn’t as alien as it sounds. Individually, these technologies exist. (Except for the “applying them with a spray gun” part.)
Dabbler has a super-high-density power source for her railgun, no stretch (ha) to think she’s using it for lots of other applications that would otherwise be impossible.
When you want the muscle to contract or release, you do what works in every other Sci Fi story, movie, or TV show to solve a problem. You ‘Reverse the Polarity’!
I have been designing an artificial heart that uses electroreactive polymers of varying conductivity and a miniaturized EKG machine. I hope to release it without copyright.
Awesome! Let us know how it goes.
I’m assuming Dabbler has some way of ensuring the compound doesn’t fall into regular schmoe hands. Elsewise every projectile she fires, every shred of clothing she loses when taking damage, or hell – even her blood splashes from being cut – are all potential breaches of her noninterference clause.
Frankly, her mere existence on the planet is a huge breach. Nine tenths of engineering is simply trying to figure out if something is possible. A video clip of Dabbler firing a handheld mass driver informs engineers that handheld mass drivers are possible; they just need to figure out _how_, and the shape of Dabbler’s device is a big start point. The fact that she has a free and easy teleportation system that can move her gear around also proves that such systems are possible. Every piece of technology she demonstrates, even if she never actually gives away samples of it or sits down with a design guy to Spill Beans, is a vital clue to Things That Can Be Done.
Supers themselves are a big one as well. SCIENCE, IRL, holds that nothing is supernatural – if you can observe and measure it, that means it’s a natural phenomenon that’s possible within reality because _it happened_. A thousand years from now, there’s no real reason SCIENCE wouldn’t have analyzed every common and most uncommon superpowers, figured out how they work – what laws of reality they tweak and what mechanism they use to do the tweaking – and thus worked out how to replicate or even improve upon the effects.
Progress, as they say, marches ever onward. If Dabbler thinks she’s not advancing the pace of human science simply by existing on the planet and showing off Cool Toys on Youtube, she’s not remotely as intelligent as she claims to be.
Have we been shown that there’s an outside rule about non-interference? I thought that was simply her personal attitude.
Agreed. As far as I know, that’s just her personal attitude. She is aware of the risks of interfering with a race’s social and technological development… maybe from personal experience, or maybe even just from watching our TV shows!
There are plenty of examples in our own science fiction to make her wary, including not less than two episodes of Star Trek: TOS. Remember the gangster planet? All because a landing party had left behind a book about the gangs of the 40s, and the Iotians modeled their society after it. There’s also the Ekosians (the Nazi planet), and that one was the direct result of interference by a Federation cultural observer named John Gill.
Oh, and in Star Trek IV, Chekov very nearly interfered with the timeline because when he got captured, the military confiscated his phaser and communicator, and he never retrieved it. This was addressed in one of the Eugenics Wars novels: Gary Seven (remember him?) stole Chekov’s gear from the military before any harm was done.
A more recent example would be in Mass Effect. Anyone who’s played the series knows this, but for the benefit of those who haven’t, here’s the short version: The salarians uplifted the krogan to fight the rachni, but failed to account for the rapid birth rate of the krogan once removed from their homeworld (where everything is trying to kill you). Once the rachni were defeated, the krogan became a threat to the galaxy (the Krogan Rebellions), forcing the turians to deploy a Depopulation Bomb that caused 99.9% of their children to be stillborn.
Point is, if Dabbler didn’t know the risks of interference beforehand, she could have read enough of our own literature to be wary of it.
Sorta doesn’t matter. Whether it’s a galactic law she’s only technically upholding or her own somewhat-lax adherence to a personal decision, simply using Advanced Alien Technology as visibly as she has/does is a nice leg up for human engineers.
ADMITTEDLY, Super Gadgeteers, i.e. people with a superpower that grants them increased intelligence or intuitive understanding of technological systems (the Gadgeteer Whateley trait, for anyone else as shamefully deviant as I am) are a much bigger force for disruptive tech development. One Super Nikolas Tesla could jump human tech forward ten years for every one he’s active, if not better, and be a much greater source of disruption than Dabbler is.
But ol’ Dabbs there is NOT being as noninterventionist as she thinks she is, either way.
You seem to forget that Dabbles is working with Archon’s version of Gadget on various projects
I don’t think that Dabbler ever says she was a non-interventionist – just that she won’t SHARE her technology. She didn’t say anything about USING her technology.
Correct. She was quite happy showing it off, to the press. But would not even answer basic questions over it. And was clearly totally unimpressed at being offered billions of bits of coloured paper produced by primitive monkeys and used in lieu of beads.
They are both weirdoes. Luckily mostly in a charming way. Got to admit Dabbler have a point though.
I never cease to be amazed at the innovative ways that Sydney uses her lighthook.
I have to agree with you. That is rather clever.
Likewise.
Plus entirely feasible, given both the demonstrated incredible dexterity Halo has with it, combined with its 16 ton load bearing capacity.
She did essentially the same thing back here https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/2618 when she protected Decollette from falling golem bits.
Maxima indeed just uncovered her ear points in case it’s having an effect, lol.
Well, in panel four she’s touching/brushing her hair back, which is an unconscious preening/flirting action. She definitely likes the guy.
Regarding strength levels, of the ones defined so far in the old icons from the cast page:
Zero = Halo, Peggy, Jiggawatt, Heatwave, and Dabbler
One = Math and Achilles
Two = Harem (who has the strength of 16 women when she reduces down to one body)
Three = Amorphous and Anvil
Four = SuperHiro and Stalwart
Five = Maxima
Dabbler’s probably at the high end of the non-super range, since she threw a table across a room from a sitting position, causing Heavenly Sword (Keyhole) to internally note that she was surprisingly strong.
In my head it’s a linear progression, with Achilles as strong as 4 people, Harem as strong as 16, Amorphous at 64, Hiro as strong as 256 people and Maxima as strong as at least 1,000 people (up to the next level at 4,000 people). That would put Max at the “overhead press 100 tons” range at a minimum.
By comparison, Math/Achilles strength would be equivalent to Captain America, Harem about the same as Black Panther, Amorphous between the Beast and Spiderman, Hiro anywhere from 25 to 100 ton and so including Asgardians or a calm Hulk, and Maxima at least as strong as Titania (100 tons) who is a challenge for She-Hulk.
In other words:
0 = Max Press 500 lbs
1 = 1 ton
2 = 5 tons
3 = 20 tons
4 = 100 tons
5 = 500 tons or greater
?
I was thinking: Zero = up to 800 lbs, One = 800 to 3200lbs, Two = 1.6 to 6.4 tons, Three = 6.4 to 25 tons, Four = 25 to 100 tons and Five = 100 to 400 tons.
This would work for speed, too (distance travel, not sprint). Superhuman level One would be 10 to 40 mph, Two = 40 to 160 mph, Three = 160 to 640 mph (SuperHiro), Four would be Mach 1 to Mach 4 (Halo) and Five would be excess of Mach 4 (Maxima).
Technicaly, Halo can actually lift up to 16 tons with the lighthook, which would put her above Harem, I’d think, unless 16 women together can lift 16 tons.
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1302 Dabbler’s Science Corner #2 says that when there’s 1 Harem she’s about on par with Anvil (though that’s probably Anvil without absorbing a bunch of energy)
Aw, I miss Professor Dabbler’s Science Corner.
You have a point, but I’m not the one that gave Harem two flexing bicep icons and three of them to Anvil and then said in the comic they were about equivalent strengths. :-D
The 3 biceps probably relate more to when she’s charged up, then.
It does work out actually. The ratings are an overall figure, not an absolute. Kind of like an average, but weighted for usefulness in typical operating conditions. For example Dabbler’s shield is about the same strength as Sydney’s, but it lacks the range of options which Halo’s has. It only creates a small shield, as opposed to a complete dome (/sphere). It does not stop teleporters. It cannot adjust size. And so on. As such it gets a far far lower rating than Halo’s.
In Harem’s case she hates using just the one body. Her stated reason being because it compromises her senses. We can only cover up one ear, one eye, one nostril but that does not come close to simulating the effect for her. As we are unable to place our senses at a remote location, or to use them to study one situation from different angles simultaneously.
Likewise there are the tactical losses in not being able to engage the enemy in a crossfire, not being able to infallibly help coordinate different teams, nor make full use of her martial arts style (which requires multiple bodies), nor most obviously to do different things in separate locations.
As such Harem would very very rarely be seen using her full strength. So it is entirely appropriate to give her a lower (average) rating. Most of the time she would actually not have ANY super strength (when she has all five bodies out) or be just one star, with less.
However the fact that she can easily boost herself up to two star, whilst still retaining some of the above options,* justifies that rating. If she needs to smash down a reinforced steel door, she can do so, then that body and the other body, which remained, can summon more bodies and they can disperse to wherever they are needed. Be that on foot or teleporting to locations within their line of sight.
* Importantly still allowing an easy escape for any one that gets into trouble, by means of unsummoning them. Note that even with one body she can teleport back home, or to base (whilst within the extended but not infinite range that she can perform that at). However that would put her out of the action, until she can return to the action by mundane transport means. Potentially being hours, if that is how far away the fight is from any of her very few familiar locations.
So there is a marked difference between reducing herself to just one body, as opposed to the relatively slight losses in just dropping by one body.
One thing I should point out though, which I had forgotten, and I do not recall folks mentioning at all, is that it is not just Harem’s strength that increases. It is also her toughness! Per Dabbler’s Science Corner #2.
As such that is an omission on the cast list, as DaveB should have listed that, to give us an indicator of Harem’s defence rating. If we assume that it exactly parallels the star rating of the strength, that would put her at a two star defence.
Identical to Dabbler, and appropriately so, as Harem would only invoke that when needed (and most of the time could just teleport away, so does not have to risk taking a hit if she does not need to). So this is the same as Dabbler being able to summon her shield, but not using it most of the time, as she has other options at her disposal.
Adorableness level in panel 3 is clearly over nine thousand.
Heh.
I love it when Sydney engages her cuteness aura. It is way more powerful than Vehemence’s aggro aura. Demonstrably so!