Grrl Power #391 – Melodramatic fanatic
Well. This seems evil. But maybe Deus just has a flourish for the dramatic. Or at least dramatic lighting.
You think supervillains have a bunch of sweet one liners ready to fire off depending on what set up line the hero give them? I would. If you can afford to build a death ray, you can hire some writers.
There’s a Mitchell and Webb sketch that sort of plays on this but I couldn’t find it on youtube. Here’s a link to it on VideoBash? Never heard of them so no guarantees you’ll be able to view it wherever you are. Basically just watch all of That Mitchell and Webb Look, cause it’s the best.
Not too much else to say about this page other than we’re almost done with this scene, so hang in there if it’s not punching your goofy nerd woman-child card.
I have a draft of what I’m thinking about using for the cover for the book posted over at Patreon. I mean it’ll probably be the cover, I don’t have a lot of time to do a bunch of alternates, though ones that mimic some other classic styles or a Liefeld-esque one with lots of cross hatching and pouches and foil embossed would be pretty funny I think. No idea what that would cost to actually print but it could make an amusing stretch goal.
Speaking of the book, I have all the comics laid out in it, but I have to figure out what to do about some of the double pages. Some break across facing pages, which is ideal, but some wind up back to back. It’s not a big deal in most of those cases since it’s just action spread across multiple pages, but there’s one or two pages that it’s pretty critical they face each other. The only way to nudge them is to insert something before them that breaks up the story, like a pin up or a title page, but that’s not ideal. It may be the only option though. I’ll figure it out I suppose.
I still need to scan some old art and write up goodies for bonus material. I’d really like to have finished books ready in time for A-kon this year which is in June, but honestly I don’t know how realistic that is. Kickstarters take 30 days to run and I’ve no idea how long it takes to print up proofs of a book then do a whole run. I’m sure it depends entirely on the printer you use and the size of the run.
Here’s the link to the new comments highlighter for chrome, and the GitHub link which you can use to install on FireFox via Greasemonkey.
SuperheroThey're super, thanks for asking!
Meatspace ComicSeriously these are awesome. Check 'em out!
Not UpdatingNo longer updating or only updates sporadically, but definitely worth reading.
SeriouslySeriously you guys. If you like Grrl Power the check these out.
"Mature"Mature subject matter and occasionally something explicit but usually safe. Can't guarantee the ads are safe though.
Dongs Ahoy!Full frontal and backal. Lots of skin, sex on some or all pages, explicit or otherwise.
Wait, that means he doesn’t love God? o_O
Or simply that he doesn’t love “too much”
Little bit. Not enough to be tossed out.
Just enough to be all part of his plan.
well, no need to love that jesus fella he had a good run, it’s just Deus simply loves himself enough for the two of them. And he doesn’t love himself TOO much, he is very good at keeping it real, and give himself JUST the right amount of love…
and if that includes gifting himself with a country, bottle of champagne, caviar, 2 supermodels and a week in his new palace, so be it.
Do you think the majority of supervillains love God?
Yes, they do. They love themselves, which in their minds amounts to the same thing.
Yes, a lot of them actually believe they are doing God’s work
Also, a weird misread of it. Satan wanted to be on the same rank as God
Essentially, Satan loved himself too much and decided that he should be above his very Creator. With a name like Deus, I think we might be looking at the same problem.
Depends on tradition and reading i think.
I’ve read stories where Lucifer was first ordered to bow to none but God, and later was told to bow to man.
So with 2 conflicting orders, he decided to keep the “bow to none but God” one.
Christian tradition is that Satan was cast out for the sin of Pride–he tried to make himself an equal to God. Muslims teach that he was cast out for disobedience–usually because he was given two conflicting commands (one would think he would just follow the more recent order, as the other angels did…) I don’t know what the Jews teach.
There’s another version that suggests sexual immorality, but that seems unlikely for someone who doesn’t have a corporeal body.
Jewish people don’t believe in Satan. We don’t really have a Satan, or a hell.
Really? I was under the impression that Jews and Christians have the same Old Testament and that Christians adopted the new one when Christ came and fulfilled all the prophecies predicted by Jeremiah and the other prophets. That would mean that we both believe in the Biblical account of Satan being cast out.
I’m not even jewish but even I know the Rabbi would take issue with you over that. Strictly speaking “satan” – “adversary” in hebrew – is a catch-all of any force in the old testament/torah who opposed the tribe of israel.
There is also an angel falling under that epithet. The one who stood up after God proclaimed the laws and said that humanity would never follow those laws. Whereon he was given the job of tempting humans into breaking them. In judaism the “Devil” is still an official and loyal employee of JHWH. And the concept of purgatory (gehonnim) certainly exists.
The old testament is identical for both, yes, but the issue is that the christian version is translated a few times further and hevily commented on, thus diverting from the jewish version.
The original version of the OT doesn’t mention a satan being cast from heaven. It does mention one angel doubting humans could follow God’s law and being cast down with the mission of testing them.
In the christian version this has turned into the fallen angel becoming an antithesis to God rather than remaining an employee of heaven.
My take was Lucifer loved God but refused to bow to humans and quite a few angels agreed with him.
My take on the whole subject is that Lucifer loves Man more than he loves God…That he wants us to give up on the various religions that Man created for themselves because we got it so badly mucked up.
That’s the take of the Lucifer comic series by Vertigo, which in turn is the spawn of the “Good Guy Lucifer” meme, some of which are quite good.
So, all told, common origins:
1: Lucifer wanted the Throne for himself.
2: Lucifer refused to accept the special role of Humanity in Creation, but continuing to exalt God.
3: Lucifer took the side of Humanity, wanting them to be free and raise themselves up.
Deus appears to ascribe to option 2.
The TV series based on that comic just aired their first episode I believe, haven’t checked it out yet, but I plan to.
The movie The Prophecy ascribes motive number 2 to the angel Gabriel, who was defeated in the film by Lucifer (Viggo Mortensen), though apparently he pissed Lucifer off enough to get kicked out of Hell for the second film, where his punishment was being made into that which he hated most, Human.
One should take some time out to read “Paradise Lost” if one is to understand the contemporary mythology surrounding “The Devil”.
But that’s only one source of the mythology. C.S. Lewis’ Screwtape Letters takes the “disagreed about raising up Humanity” version, for instance. And as noted, Vertigo’s Lucifer comics paint him as a protector of mankind against an unreasonable and tyrannical deity.
I don’t love God, but that could be because I am a horrible person.
Yes… yes you are. :P
I, personally, grew up with the understanding that Lucifer was filled with pride at being the greatest and most beautiful of God’s angels, and became filled with hubris to the point he, and it varies slightly on who tells it, wanted to be equal to God, or wanted to usurp God.
Either way, we see the same thing here. Deus CLEARLY has his fill of hubris.
It’s more acceptable to not love God because he is a horrible person. And he is, if only 10% of the horrible things in his Big Book of Myths are actually true.
You mean like cleansing the Earth of people who thought only evil continually? I think I can understand where he’s coming from with that. Or maybe the Sodom and Gomorrah episode, where He said He would spare the cities if He was presented with only ten decent people. They couldn’t even manage that! In two entire city! When He sent His angels to evacuate Lot and his family from the Sodom, the men of the city gathered around his house to RAPE THE ANGELS. Yeah, raping the messengers of God. Good call guys. How is it extreme to remove a society like that? I wouldn’t want them in my country…or planet.
So what’s the secret to a good villain? Money? Power? No, just ham it up (and dramatic lightning. And good lines).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehc2x4BleQI
It’s all about presentation
Is it wrong that I just read that out loud to myself in his voice, yet haven’t even clicked that link yet?
No, that means it’s working.
It means ‘mission accomplished’.
More similarities between Deus and Maxima….. the use of dramatic lighting.
Especially when you have a super on payroll who may be able to “manipulate photons” in such a fashion as to render objects (people) invisible. Or better yet the reverse, placing the dramatic lighting on a individual when demanded. :)
Told that this was why he wanted that Lightning Clicker :D
Well.. i kinda thought that little sketch with Vale setting the light was the funniest part :P
Sorry to be that guy, but it’s “CUE dramatic lightning”.
Depends on if he wants a line of Dramatic Lightning, or just have a single DL waiting to be activated
Deus doesn’t strike me as a guy to queue for anything. Or to repeat himself.
Pity that a certain recurring nigh-omnipotent entity from Star Trek:TNG didn’t have Deus’ flair, then it would be Q DRAMATIC LIGHTNING!
The way I just read your post, was for Deus saying “Q, Dramatic Lightning” as if asking (polite demanding) for Dramatic Lightning…
Which after these last few pages, I wouldn’t put it past Deus to have Q on the payroll
Q’d probably get a kick out of the idea, and set it up so that whoever asked is from then on permanently Dramatically Lit, no matter where they are or what they’re doing.
Since Deus hasn’t yet invented his on-call lightning/thunder, he should call JJ Abrams for a lens flare effect.
Deus is a megalomaniac(soft-of), he’s not that evil…. No one deserves JJA Lens flare
¿Qué? iluminación espectacular
,,, I always thought he volunteered to run Hell.
Anyways, this page has great dramatic tension, and I think the shadow on Deus’ face is artificially induced like you jokingly showed in the write up.
Nope, he was kicked out. I believe the original myths are that Lucifer was one of god’s top angels, but he wanted to be equal to god, so started a rebellion. It failed, and he got thrown in hell as punishment
Also in those stories, he doesn’t run hell. He’s imprisoned there, just like everyone else
Another of the ‘myths’ is that he ‘invented’ death, and another that he was jealous of the hyu-mons and their new place as “God’s favourite children”
I thought death was introduced after adam and eve at the apple.
Which, to be fair, was because of the snake, who is said to be an analogy to the devil (though that’s never actually mentioned in the bible)
That snake used to be depicted as female, which makes Lilith a more likely suspect than Lucifer.
Actually in some accounts Lilith is Adam’s second wife.
No, Lilith was his first wife, created in the same fashion and thus, his equal, that’s why Eve was created using one of Adam’s Ribs: to ensure that she would always be less than him because she was made from him
Well that didn’t work.
(Insert appropriate comment on female oppression by the patriarchy here.)
You are correct. It’s SUCH a relief to hear someone who knows the Lilith story properly. She was kicked out of the garden before Adam & Eve were (before Eve was made, actually) for refusing to obey Adam as YHWH (God) ordered her to. It’s unclear whether she felt that she was equal to Adam, or felt that she was better than Adam, but she disobeyed YHWH and was kicked out, then YHWH made Eve from one of Adam’s ribs.
Considering the power most women have over men, their greater average longevity and other statistical “superiorities”, I’m personally inclined to believe that women are descended from Lilith. Not sure how that works, but then, not sure how humanity continued after Cain killed Abel and was…whatever happened to him.
Maybe Adam cheated on Eve with Lilith. It would explain a lot.
From what I have read and researched, the book of Genesis is identical in the Bible, Torah, and Qoran. According to Genesis, after killing Abel and being marked by God as a killer Cain fled East to “The Land of Nod” where he married and had children, among people who were already there, one of Cain’s descendants is noted to later repeat his crime of murder.
Yes, but, if Adam and Lilith and Eve were the first, and no mention of God creating others, where did the Noddy’s come from? o_O
For some reason can’t directly reply to Guesticus here but w/e.
@Guesticus: Because the bible was written by and for the Hebrew people, YHWH’s (God’s) chosen people, and genesis talks about how their god made them. The Old Testament is basically a bunch of Jewish myth/history. That’s why the Messiah is such a big deal, Jesus basically said, “Hey everyone can worship this Jewish god now!” And thus Christianity was born. Then Europeans who didn’t understand any of it mixed it into their own belief systems because Rome was losing a bunch of battles and then they prayed to Christ and suddenly they won a battle. Never mind the fact the invaders were getting tired and a shooting star scared them.
One of the stories about Adam and Eve is that they had THREE sons: Cain, Abel and Seth. No one remembers Seth because he wasn’t the world’s first murder/murder victim so his brothers got all the press. All Seth did was go off and found his own nation.
Actually Seth was the third son, but not the last of their children, in the King James Bible, as well as all other versions I have been able to read, after Seth’s birth Adam and Eve lived for many more years begetting sons and daughters. As for where the inhabitants of Nod come from, obviously they were the Homo Erectus and Neandrathal peoples who crossbred with the Homo Sapiens represented by the line of Adam. (partially factious but it has been genetically proven that Erectus and Neandrathal were not direct ancestors but did have limited interbreeding with us).
Rob, please state the book, chapter, and verse that Lucifer was “kicked out.” Because I’ve yet had anyone actually verify that as Biblical canon.
Meanwhile, a casual grasp of The Book of Job will reveal that The Devil has access to Heaven whenever he damn well pleases.
Revelation 12:7-12, also Luke 10:18 (in the King James version anyway).
Comic related comment follows:
The sketch of Vale providing Dues with dramatic back-lighting made me laugh out loud, it’s just so perfect (and fitting)! When the book is published are we going to lose gems like that, because it’d be a real waste.
It is unfortunate but the pages are comic book sized, so there’s no room for the extra stuff. But it’s not like the book won’t make the website go away.
What about as an appendix/footnotes section?
Wait, don’t you mean “It’s not like the book will make the website go away.” don’t you?
Using “won’t” implies that the website will stop :eek:
Yes, some books have an additional ‘extra art’ section at the back, usually showing any alternate covers or other artwork
Luke 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
Doesn’t really sound like he was forced out of heaven and banished :-/
The verse from Revelations seems a bit more definitive, but… it’s in contradiction with The Book of Job :-/
Are you saying that a gigantic collection of 2000+ year old stories, that has been modified over and over and over and over again during said years, can be contradictory? Who would have thought
The Lucifer thing is a Catholic epic (the type not saying its awesome though it is) poem called Paradise Falls. Its not in the bible just like a lot of Catholic and hebrew stories because well in the 1200s or the pope threw a bunch of priests in a room and said, “You can’t leave till you consolidate the Bible from 12 million pages to something we can actually use!”
You know how a super popular book gets a lot of spin offs? Now imagine that book is literally THE Book. Ya lots of fan fiction.
You sure you’re not thinking of Milton’s ‘Paradise Lost’?
Lucifer and the devil aren’t even the same entity in the bible, and the devil is hardly present there anyway.
I’m not talking about the bible, I’m talking about general mythological stories
Not to mention, the stories that he didn’t fall to Earth until 1914 (or 1918, something to do with the First World War, either the start or the end)
Isaiah 14:12-15 covers the fall of Lucifer
It depends on the story.
I seem to remember one mythology said that he didn’t volunteer to run Hell so much as betting God that humans were worthless and weak, offering to tempt them out of their souls to prove his point.
He doesn’t run hell. From someone who has studied a little christian theology-
Satan’s eventually going to be thrown in there as punishment for his rebellion against God, along with humans who haven’t sought forgiveness from Jesus. He doesn’t want to be there anymore than anyone else does.
The version I’m familiar with, and honestly, with so many versions and translations of the bible, there’s probably no one single correct version, is that when God made humans he ordered the angels to bow down to them, but Lucifer loved God so much he couldn’t bring himself to bow to anyone but him, and for that he was cast from heaven, which was kind of a dick move on God’s part. It’s not clear from my recollection how he came to rule hell from that point. Maybe that was part of the package deal of getting cast out.
Looking it up, apparently that’s the Muslim version.
Actually it’s the Christian version, NOT Islam.
In Islam, the devil is basically a type of Jinn. Satan in Islam is not the same as Satan in the Bible. In Islam, Satan (Iblis) was a Jinn who was raised and lived with the Angels, and was treated LIKE an angel, then Iblis broke Allah’s commandments and turned into Satan and was expelled from Paradise.
al-Araf 11-13: “And We indeed created you, then We fashioned you, then We said to the angels: Make submission to Adam. So they submitted, except Iblis; he was not of those who submitted. He said: What hindered thee that thou didst not submit when I commanded thee? He said: I am better than he; Thou hast created me of fire, while him Thou didst create of dust. He said: Then get forth from this (state), for it is not for thee to behave proudly therein. Go forth, therefore, surely thou art of the abject ones.”
And in islam it describes three beings. the ones made from smokeless fire (angel), the ones made from smoking fire (jinn), and the human, made of clay.
Iblis is a jinn.
Old testament god was a gigantic dick
Most gods are.
Sure, but most of them are just drunken assholes sitting on top a mountain and occasionally throw lightning.
actually, if you read the Iliad, Zeus was pretty much constantly dicking around with humans. hell the entire pantheon was. there’s nearly as much infighting and interference the Olympians in that book than there is fighting between the Trojans and Greeks.
Often, literally dicking around with humans. Isn’t the origin of most greek mythological monsters “Zeus couldn’t keep it in his pants”?
I don’t know about the monsters, but he certainly fathered many of the heroes.
Hercules was so OP because he got more than half his genes from Zeus. His mom was the granddaughter of Perseus, and Zeus was the father of both Perseus and Hercules.
The entire plot of the Percy Jackson novels is predicated on the idea that the gods bone down with humans so much that they can fill a camp of like 300 kids every summer.
The one semi-exception being Hades. Out of all the Olympians, he was the least dickish, as far as I’m aware. Aside from the kidnapping of Persephone to be his wife and queen (and maybe the death of Aesculapius, who later became a god anyway), Hades was often portrayed as passive rather than evil; his role was often maintaining relative balance. He was seen more as a “jailor” than any other role; however he was depicted as cold, stern, and gave all his subjects equal treatment in regards to his laws.
Hades had (has?) a thankless job. He rules over the underworld, which is a sucky place. His brothers got the sky and the ocean, which are arguably way better. Hades got shafted
Since the gates to Tartarus are in the underworld, Hades is also the one responsible for the continued imprisonment of the Titans.
Not only that. Reading through every greek myth it comes out that Hades is the one and only guy among the greek gods who sticks with his job instead of pissing on mortals and the other gods nonstop.
Go figure why the greeks put Poseidon and Zeus in chief roles of myth. Nothing to write about where Hades was concerned.
the old testament is a collection of deick moves from God. like a guide for young gangster.
As someone who’s done a little theological study, it disappoints me that the christian understanding of satan is poorly shown here.
I have ever never heard the idea that satan loved God too much. When googling, most links about that seem to be about the show Supernatural, which makes me wonder.
Satan’s fall was due to him basically wanting to be God, and rebelling. A large number of the angels sided with him, and fell also, becoming the demons.
Satan doesn’t rule Hell, that’s not correct. He is the ruler of the demons.
Satan’s eventually going to be thrown in Hell as punishment for his rebellion. He doesn’t want to be there anymore than anyone else does.
There is one true single correct version- the original greek. We’ve got thousands of copies of the books and letters contained within the new testament, all dated to within a few decades of the originals, with pretty low variation between them.
(Can’t remember the details about the Old testament’s documents, sorry. They’re in Aramaic, pretty sure. )
So if you want to read the originals, best learn the Greek, and Aramaic.
In the Torah as well as the Old Testament, Lucifer had the job of being “The Satan”; it was a title, a role, not his name. His job was to act as the contrarian.
Sort of – an angel has the role of “the Satan,” but the identification of that angel with Lucifer comes from Jewish mysticism regarding a passage of Isaiah that, to a plain reading, can best be summarized as “Babylon, you’re just the morning star, and dawn’s coming for your ass.” (Is. 14:12)
Yeah, i bet Vale is on the background holding a mirror to get the lighting just right.
Still looking very unimpressed, and definitely thinking (correctly) that she is not being paid enough for this shit.
It’s moments like that which give me a Drakken and Shego vibe from those two. The rest of the time Deus seems way to competent to compare them with the Disney villains.
Even Drakken had his moments, and we have seen Deus have his own ‘Drakken’ moments (remember that scene when he was testing out the Lightning Clicker, or pawing the image of Maxi?)
That’s what I meant. Moments like those kind of remind me of Drakken, while the way he handled Indinge reveals that he’s much more competent than those earlier scenes might have suggested.
I need to watch more Kimpossible.
Call it a guilty pleasure of mine. Here are a couple of compilations of Drakken and Shego to show how nutty they were.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=em7EN0STs4A
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alWdz88mXo4
I agree on the Drakken/Shego vibe from these two, except it hasn’t slipped to the late Season Three to Season Four point.
One of the things I love about Kim Possible is the writing, and how it evolves the relationship of those two. At the beginning of the series, Shego is snarky, but he’s still in charge and she respects him to a certain degree, even getting scared of him in one episode. But as his schemes keep failing, her respect level keeps dropping to the point where by the later episodes she becomes more of a partner then just a minion.
Maybe Deus and Vale just haven’t gotten to that stage of the relationship yet. It’s only the second day of the comic, after all.
Or perhaps about ten years before the second day . . .
About the book: I don’t know what pages you are exactly talking about that need to face each other, but remember that you don’t need to put the extra page that would ensure they face each other right before said double page.
I’m sure there are some scene changes where you could safely insert a break, and that would still help to force double pages to face each other
That would really depend on the double-page spread and what happened immediately prior to it
Oh, right, insert the extra page elsewhere to ensure the double-page works, yes, that could work
Exactly. The only problem would be based on how close the 2 double pages are together
If DaveB really needs to slip in an extra page or two to make things even out right, he could always insert an ad for Sea Monkeys or X-Ray Specs or something. :D
And one page comics where Vehemence is defeated due to the good taste of hostess fruit pies!
…This would be funny, really.
V: “What is violence compared to this great taste? Light tender crust, real fruit filling!”
“Curses Maxima, you are as smart as you are strong!”
Maxima: “Why bother with violence when you can enjoy the goodness of Hostess Fruit Pies!”
:-)
“NOOOO Not Justice Fruit Pies, the tasty snack you’d have to be crazy not to love? D’ohh, I give up!”
…OH MY GOD, THAT WAS TOM KENNY AS A PROTO ICE-KING!
I JUST REALIZED THIS!
AHHHHHHHHH
I ran a character in an RPG that saved everyone, then the IRS got him for back taxes and he was stuck doing promotions for a pie company like those old skits. By the time he was called back to save the world, he was jaded, angry, and sick of the whole thing, but still protected everyone because he was still a good person at heart. Just don’t mention those fruit pies to him.
Marvel had an old WW2 veteran-turned-professional-mercenary-after-the-war, named Dominic Fortune, who also stumped ads for Furdley’s Milk…
Reporter for a radio station caught Dominic out in public & asked for a few words:
“Drink Furdley’s Milk, it… …keeps your teeth from falling out?”
Nearly all of the double pages (maybe all?) happen during the fight at the restaurant, so if I put in a chapter title page before than, then it will bump all of them. The only one I think it’s critical is on facing pages is Sydney’s ADHD fueled plan: https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1569/ There are a few others it would nice if they were facing but I’d be willing to shift them all to get the plan facing up.
There’s the question of the two Dabbler’s Science Corners, but I think I’ll put them after the story pages.
The other option, which would be a significant undertaking on your part, would be a full-size splash page wherever needed to make the pages align properly. Basically, a dramatic close-up of one of the characters in the current scene, no script necessary unless you want to give a thought bubble. Since it would not entail depicting much more action-as-such, you wouldn’t need to rescript; it’d just be a big-ass pic of one of the characters in hero mode.
Extra pages to make significant pages face the right way would be a great place to generate ad revenue.
You could always use the vote incentives as filler.
Also, you should totally keep the mini-comics at the bottom (the talking heads). The comic would not be the same without them. All you have to do is shrink the pages a little bit and give them a border, which I think would be a neat departure from the normal comic book format. You could even put page numbers in the border.
…although, now that I imagine it, reading a comic and suddenly running into a one-page photo disconnected with the story would be weird. Dabbler’s Science Corners would work much better. Use them to position your double pages instead of putting them at the end of the book.
There’s physically no room to include them, unless I maybe shrink the whole page and cut out the gutters, but like I said that stuff will always live on the webpage.
If the books are a success there’s always the thought of a “The art and world of Grrl Power” or something, an extra book of artwork and random background information and facts. Plenty or series have optional extra art and information books on the shelves after all.
Should there be enough demand for it and that be a direction you want to go anyway.
Reprint the full version of the comic later as a special ‘director’s cut’ edition (at highly inflated prices of course). Just try to resist putting a lot of extra CGI buildings and animals in the background of the desert firing range. And remember, in the scene of Dabbler vs. the tank Dabbler shot first!
I must say Veckter did an excellent job of directing the crown to JR.
And would someone please give us a 3 count.
I do believe dad is down for the count.
He’s not being pinned, thus it requires a 10 count.
And at the same time, tricking the new king into bowing before Deus
May be, really depends on how much fine control Vektor has (remember, he is still holding up nearly a dozen firearms, all with a bullet ‘in the chamber’)
I consider that effect to be more like the serendipitous-rolling-crown-going-to-the-heir effect, rather than anyone there actually controlling it somehow.
It took a little while, but at least Sydney figured out how to evoke the serendipitous-tumbleweed effect, but this rolling-crown effect does happen to be an oft-used dramatic trope too.
Yeah, was thinking that as well, makes more sense than Vektor ‘teasing’ Junior like that
I love this guy. He’s my idol
Who, Indignant Junior? o_O
“You think supervillains have a bunch of sweet one liners ready to fire off depending on what set up line the hero give them? I would.”
Deus certainly seems the type!
Dr. Doom as well (he doesn’t rely on outside writers). Lex Luthor. Apocalypse. Magneto’s a manifesto sort, so he’d probably have a ton written out in advance.
Well, if supervillains are anything like me, they do have a bunch of one-liners ready to go. We think them up while trying to process other thoughts and plans. I have a ton of one-liners memorized based on multiple cliche set-ups, both on the hero and villain side. I like to be prepared.
Prepared?
How?
Breaded, marinated, stuffed, peeled?
Don’t forget the cheese sauce. Cheesiness is a required part of this recipe.
There was an episode of Duck Dodgers where Dodgers accidentally picked up Hal Jordan’s laundry from the Dry Cleaner and had to help the Green Lantern Corps defeat Sinestro. At one point Sinestro started in on a “sway the hero to join me” speech and was thrown off when Dodgers accepted after his first couple lines. He then admitted to having prepared a speech.
No need to add extra pages, DaveB. Just modify some existing pages by enlarging some panels/sections so that they take two pages instead of one. Maybe a splash layout or an action scene can take up an extra page and still be continuous story. After all you do have a whole lot of 10+ panel pages. And your dpi is fairly hefty judging by the 20 MB page a while back, so they shouldn’t look too bad enlarged.
Hmm, that’s not a bad idea. Stephan Seijic seems to sometimes draw his comic in strips, then cuts the strips down to fit on pages.
One panel that I’m thinking about that would look good as a double-page is when Maxima & Vehemence are facing off, as Sydney’s serendipitous-tumbleweed rolls by. that would look awesome & emphasize the drama of the moment.
Howard Tayler of Schlock Mercenary puts in art sketches in his books. Of course, his webcomic format isn’t a whole-page (usually), so he has room to make these adjustments, but one of the other things he does is add in “explanation” text boxes, which fill in background details that the readers might want to know about the workings of the Schlock universe. (These can be serious, humorous, and/or apocryphal, but are always entertaining to some degree.)
You can do something similar to help the pages line up properly. Put up some art, put in some text boxes filled with explanations, and basically call it “bonus material!” This is particularly good if you put in new information as well as pertinent bits of the older stuff already on the website, and then advertise it as such so we’ll be suckered (quite happily) into buying the paper version just so we can get our grubby little reader hands on exclusive content only found in the graphic novel compilations.
Hey, if it works for fans of Schlock (and it does, that tricksy Tayler has gotten me to buy a dozen of his books so far), it’ll definitely work for fans of Grrl Power! (*flaps her grubby little reader hands eagerly, wanting the book versions now Now NOW, pretty please!*)
…I question his theological interpretation, but it does at least sound dramatic.
Which interpretation? And just remember that it is just that, an ‘interpretation’
Well, considering he had a dramatic lightning machine built, I fully expect him to have a book of one-liners for all manner of situations.
Congratulations Dave. Deus is now ranking on my personal scale along the lines of David Xanatos, Lex Luthor, and Dr. Doom.
(Golf clap intensifies.)
Where’s David Xanatos from?
Disney’s Gargoyles
Nerd cred: -10 points
David Xanatos is also where the term Xanatos Gambit comes from.
he even has his own riff on a Chuck Norris quote: “Behind David Xanatos’s beard, there is no chin, there is only another plan.”
My favorite line of Xanatos’:
This is my first real attempt at cliche cartoon villainy. How am I doing?
Xanatos was also voiced by Jonathan Frakes, Star Trek: TNG’s Commander Riker, (he also played Boss Hogg’s nephew in the season 4 premiere of Dukes of Hazzard). Several other voices on Gargoyles were done by TNG cast members.
I think the only major players from TNG that weren’t in Gargoyles was Patrick Stewart and Wil Wheaton. Not sure why in Patrick’s case, though I was pretty sure that Wil had washed his hands completely by that point and wanted to just avoid the situation entirely.
It’s actually rather odd that Wheaton isn’t in Gargoyles, he has a lot of voice work in his filmography, including multiple DC comics characters, a major villain in the Ben 10 franchise, video games, etc. He even did voice work for the 2009 Star Trek reboot film.
I also just found out that Wheaton was a background character in The Last Starfighter, thanks for giving me an urge to look up his imdb.
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000696/?ref_=nv_sr_1
You’re welcome. He truly is an interesting actor and I’ve enjoyed Tabletop.
Hmm, had we all decided if Deus was a Magnificent Bastard or not yet? Just curious, according to TV Tropes thats the type of villain most likely to use a Xanatos Gambit.
“You are the devil!” says Indinge Junior.
I wonder how many people would have said the same about his Warlord Dad . . . or about Junior himself.
Meanwhile, it looks like Indinge Senior’s beard grew back just in time for him to keel over. It was in hiding on the last page.
I think it tells me something that the son is trying to grab the crown instead of trying to save the father…
I think he’s just petrified by the situation. Remember that every gun in the room is pointed at him by Vekter. He’s smart enough to realize he can’t do anything.
Meanwhile, he did actually want to rush to his father https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1964
Haha, I can’t watch that video because my browser doesn’t support that (flash?) video player.
Yeah I figured it was iffy but I should link it anyway.
Damn…that’s a good line.
Best I came up with if someone were to call me the Devil was to smile evilly and go “When I get serious, I make the Devil look like a child playing pranks on his friends.”
Also have responses for “you’re evil” – “Evil? No, I’m not just evil. I’m evil incarnate with a side of nasty.”
And “you’ll never get away with this” – “It’s funny, because whenever the hero says that they walk off laughing content in that they will, only for the hero to break free and stop their plan. You know how you prevent that?” *shoots them point blank in the head* “Like that.” *walks away laughing maniacally*
“You’re the Devil” – “Your Majesty, you wound me. If you think I want to be EQUAL to God, you seriously underestimate my ambitions.
“You’re evil” – “If you think removing despots are evil… well, I guess what’s coming next would make me Cthulhu.”
“You’ll never get away with this” – … I actually like yours better than mine. so well done.
He’s not evil, he’s just drawn that way. (with apologies to Roger Rabbit)
You should try aiming that apology to Jessica, not Roger…
“This kingdom shall fall. And from the ashes shall arise a new order, that will shake the very foundations of the world.”
No king rules forever…
I think you just solved the riddle of his name. His full name is Ozzy Mann Deus.
Oswald could be a good first name for him. Then Manfred for a middle name, maybe.
Yeah, the guy’s evil. Might as well have a big neon arrow pointing to him with the word Evil.
Where’s the comments section for the incentive?
Not been added yet
but why
DaveB simply hasn’t gotten around to adding it yet? o_O
“Satan was cast down from heaven for loving God too much”
Doesn’t that make God the villain in the story?
Congratulations. You’ve just asked the first question on your path to understanding how contradictory most religious texts are and why they shouldn’t be taken literally.
It would only be contradictory if there were actually a religious text that said that Satan fell for that reason (or, at least one that is part of the Jewish/Christian canon).
interesting fact: Islam, Judaism and Christianity are the three closest related religions….. probably why we fight so damn much. sibling rivalry.
also insteresting fact: between the Crusades, there was fairly constant trade between Muslims and Christians. the vast majority of stained glass in churches in Europe was actually made in Persia.
I’m familiar with the tradition that Inbetweenaction mentions that the devil wanted to be equal to God and the one that Darth Litarius mentions that Satan loved himself too much and decided that he should be above his very Creator. This is the first time I’ve heard an interpretation that he got booted out because he loved God too much… Any idea where that one came from?
I heard it from Supernatural.
https://youtu.be/iN653Yru-NY?t=1m39s
There was a comment above that suggested it came from the Muslim version of the tales.
It’s not from Islam. It’s from Christianity, not Islam. In Islam, Satan was a powerful Jinn (a powerful creature of fire) that was raised to the height of being an Angel, then fell for breaking God’s Commandments. In Christianity, Morningstar was the first and most loved of all Angels who fell largely because he refused to bow down to humans since he could only bow to God (since he loved God more than all others), and rebelled, and God had Michael throw Lucifer out of heaven for that reason
If that were true, then love means the opposite of what I thought. If I served a king and he told me to act as a servant to or respect or do whatever for or to someone of lesser standing than I, I would do it. Otherwise, this “love” is really a word for willing to disobey. However, I do not accept the idea that any angel was told to worship humanity. In any interaction among humans and man in the bible, I find that the angels have always worshipped God, including, “Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God Almighty, who was and is and is to come.” Furthermore, in the last chapter of Revelation, an angel rebukes John the Apostle and tells him, “Worship only God!” So all of creation is to submit and serve and respect God.
I’ve even heard stories that it was Man that he loved too much…that he was saddened that God was denying them knowledge of Good and Evil(via the fruit of the one tree in Eden forbidden to them) and he sent the serpent to tempt them into that as an act of love, in defiance of God’s will on the matter. And remember, Lucifer Morningglory was not the only angel cast out, merely the greatest of them…some stories have a full third of heaven’s host siding with him and Falling with him because of it.
And depending on how you take the story…God could certainly be seen as a villain in the story of Job
I know the story that Lucifer was jealous that god loved man more than his angels, sparking Lucifer to lead try a rebellion.
All angels that followed him were cast out to hell.
Though as I know it, they didn’t get to rule hell. They were imprisoned there, just like everyone else
I’d suggest reading Anne Rice’s 5th book of the Vampire Chronicles series, “Memnoch the Devil.” She’s evidently done some in-depth research on religion & has an interesting interpretation of it.
Welp, I guess that ends the discussion about ‘we don’t know that the dude is actually dead.’
No no, he’s just pining for the fjords!
(Sorry couldn’t help myself)
Pining for the Fjords!?! What kind of talk is that?
Then why did he fall flat on his face the moment we got him home?
Must. Not. Start. Quoting. Parrot. Sketch.
And now for something not entirely different.. Not the nine o’ clock news sketch about the life of Brian “controversy”.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asUyK6JWt9U
Ha – awesome! :D
Not yet, collapsing face first doesn’t mean he’s dead
No, I’m confident he’s been croaked. Indinge’s eyes wide open as he crashes down and not even a wince on his face as he hits tell me that he’s dead now.
Again, you can’t abdicate if you are dead, and depending on what Lia did to him, he may not be able to wince
I admit that I could be wrong, but I suspect you’re putting too much stock in the word “abdicate.” My feeling is that it was just a clever turn of phrase for murder rather than a statement that Deus was actually going to compel Indinge to give up his throne. A Bond One-Liner, if you will.
I can only wait now for DaveB to reveal whether or not I’m right.
“Satan was cast down from heaven for loving God too much”
Is this something people actually say? I’ve actually read the Bible cover to cover, and Paradise Lost, and Dante’s Inferno. (Sadly, I have yet to get to Purgatorio and Paradiso) Anyway, I don’t say any of that to brag, but merely to say that I have no clue where this “loving God too much” idea is coming from.
Yeah, it’s more like “Loved the idea of being equal to God too much”.
Maybe this is a quote from the soon to be released addition to the bible, the Book of Deus?
I’m no biblical scholar, and you seem better read on the subject than I am. But I think there is a school of thought where the devil loves God and feels that God loves man too much. Therefore his rebellion is more about his jealousy and frustration at unrequited love than any sort of power-play. So in this interpretation, it could be said that he loved God too much.
There are a lot of stories about the devil and how he came to be, plenty of them didn’t end up in the bible.
The one I know is that he was jealous of how god loved man more than the angels, which sparked his rebellion.
DaveB’s story (somewhere higher up in the comments) is that Lucifer refused to bow to man, because he didn’t want to bow to anyone else, and got thrown out for that. Keeping in mind how much of a dick god is in the older stories, not a bad story
In panel 2, the crown seems to be at almost a right angle to the direction that the speed line suggests it is rolling.
More likely that the blue line is wrong
Or Vekter couldn’t/didn’t bother to make it look like the movement of the crown had anything to do with physics.
I’m pretty sure minds have now been made up.
Dave, Regarding printing and kickstarters, I would suggest talking to fellow artists that have already successfully been down that route such as Howard Taylor and Phil & Kaja Foglio, I am sure they would be willing to share their experiences and advice.
Once this guy dies and arrives at his final destination, someone will probably want to have Words with him…
Guys, he doesn’t need Vale setting the lighting, he obviously has a super with light-manipulation powers who can make his goons invisible. He probably hired the guy on the fact that he can do dramatic lighting (and shadow!) on cue.
Hiding Geatish Ninjas, etc. was probably just an afterthought.
Dramatic lighting is is super power!
Now wait a second guys, lets actually take a good hard look at this from another direction. Is Deus really the traditional villain? He is looking out for the people of the region, isn’t he? Not exactly your normal spin for a villain, he actually cares about the well being of the area, of course that is mainly because in the their well being will effect how he is seen by the rest of the world. Now even after having said this some of the things he said do have a major point around them. He is dealing with a dictator and a warlord of a definite evil leaning. Also the area is surrounded by other evil warlords bent on conquering the entire region. Now this means his actions would fall almost solidly in the camp of the antihero more than the camp of the villain. Looking at it from this route Deus as the antihero instead of Deus as a villain, we have an entirely new dynamic. It would also explain why he is willing to help fund Archon and set them up as heroes. He may actually join them, doubtful and not all together a good idea true, But even better, if he really is an all out villain you have something both unexpected and beyond twisted at the same time. Lets say he is an all out villain. He just helped put together the organization of heroes that he plans to suborn and roll to his purposes which in the end may be coming after him in the future and being in on the ground floor how many of them might actually be plants to do his biding?
If anything, it’s starting to look like pragmatic villainy. He knows that going in, strip mining the region, using the people and tossing aside the corpses will give him less money in the long run. This is a little in, a lot out. At least if he truly does improve the region. We’ll need to see what he does ultimately with the region. We know he seems to have taken care of the country as he is still a respected business man with government contracts. But that doesn’t quite mean he really did take care of the nation. There are a few famous nations with a good public front but underneath are hell holes.
I still say it’s too early to say what breed of a villain he is, but I think he went past Anti-Hero with that speech. Though keep in mind, sometimes, to do the most good, you need a villain to do it. I’m really digging Deus and think he gets the best lines.
except your forgetting he has a really funky sense of humor as shown by the mood lightening machine earier on. Not only that but his claim of the current leader being a warmonger puts a decided Punisher type of spin and Punisher is the definition of the antihero, at least in some ways, especially being a hero which purposely kills off villains. Plus with the way he said that whole bit to the prince like he said it, just seems like a joke with his twisted sense of humor taken into account.
Deus is an egomaniac. He doesn’t perceive his flaws as being such. He likely thinks that he’s above any and all other beings in existence or at least that’s the vibe I’m getting from him. Kevin was/is a hedonist. He fought with our heroes because it challenged him, gave him more power and because it felt good. Deus is likely going to fight our heroes because he can’t stand the thought of someone being above him.
No, I don’t think so.
Deus is very smart. He’s probably smart enough to know his limits. He won’t take a risk unless he really needs to, and if he needs to he’ll spend ages planning the right approach, and seeing how he could minimize the risks
and therein lie the seeds of his destruction… Sydney…. he could not possibly have planned for her to enter into the Super-Hero scene… her chaos is like Kryptonite to his planning…
The makes her the equivalent of the ‘Mule’ in Asimov’s Foundation series.
I don’t totally agree, yeah I agree with parts, but not all. He helped set up archon with the materials and other things they needed to begin the project. He is literally in on the ground floor of Arch-swat. He has put himself in a position where they most likely even know everything about him as well. They may actually know about this hostile takeover of the country and their not standing in his way for some reason. If this is all true then maybe, just maybe he really isn’t a villain. If he is doing evil things, but isn’t a villain, then he has some grander purpose in mind. Now if he has some grand purpose, and their aware of it. They also haven’t stopped him, this means he may be more along the lines of the classic Antihero, like Elric. To those who have no idea who Elric is, you better do some heavy reading as he was the first Antihero ever created in the entire hero genre. Their were no antiheroes before Elric came along. He was prePunisher. and the earmark when creating the antihero.
Deus doesnt seem like the type of person who ‘fights’ heroes … he only goes into something if he has about 25 other backup plans for every single contingency, and even then he’s going to make sure he has plausible deniability the entire time
Seriously the guy does remind me of David Xanatos.
There are basically four traditions regarding Satan.
The first is that he never fell, he’s just a proverbial devil’s advocate with regards to testing the righteousness of people who God likes.
The second is that he was cast out of heaven when God ordered all the angels to worship Adam and Satan rightfully pointed out that would violate the rules God had already set down. God, being a fickle being who can change his mind on a whim, gave Satan the boot. This story is popular among some Islamic traditions (and Supernatural, apparently).
The third is that Satan isn’t an angel at all. He’s a djinn. And kind of a jerk of a djinn. This is another Islamic tradition.
The fourth is that Satan doesn’t believe that God is, in fact, God in the omnipotent sense. That God isn’t infinite, just very powerful, and thus there must be some way to attain power like God’s. So Satan rebelled in his quest to become like God. This one is a Christian tradition.
Very nicely said, thank you.
Personally I know a combination of the second and forth one. Lucifer rebelled, because he was jealous of how much god loved man more than the angels (his first creation)
I’d heard that Djinn were created during the fall. with a third of the angels who sided with God staying angels, those who sided with Lucifer becoming Demons, and those who refused to choose becoming Djinn and being forever trapped between as punishment. of course, I may also be confusing this for a Fae origin story as well.
That’s one of the many, many, fairy origins out there. Buy djinn are pretty close to fae, so you get half credit.
Half credit is better than none
The Jinn being used is part of Islamic lore, not Christianity, because in Islam, Satan was originally the most powerful of the Jinn who was raised as an Angel. Sort of had a real ‘Loki the half-frost giant’ feel to it :)
Shut up and take my country!
One suggestion for adding a page or two for spacing purposes.
Remember those old comic book adds for Hostess Fruit Pies, x-ray specs, sales club schemes, and Charles Atlas fitness?
Do something like that. It’d be a neat little extra.
Yes, do that.
With Math sponsoring the X-ray specs, sold in Syney’s Comic shop, (Event Horizon Comics?)
Sydney’s*
Damn it.
Two things:
first , props to Dave for working in an actual sense for the old line “the devil you say” :-}
secondly…. nowhere in the bible does it say God ever told angels to worship humanity. nor does it fit in with the general principles. So that story is right out, from a biblical perspective.
Yes I know some …people… claim that. I figure it’s a story made up by satanists just to try to make lucifer more appealing to potential members.
And funnily enough, the same principles would surely apply to this Deus dude. So of course that’s the version he would go with :-}
Doesn’t the devil hardly even exist in the bible? I recall that, at least in the old testament, he’s responsible for 6 deaths (god’s count being in the millions)
I always thought most stories about the Devil started during the renaissance
No, the devil is in the bible. Probably the most famous of his appearances is his temptation of Christ in the new testament. So, long before the renaissance.
Where things get a bit vague is the connection between Satan and hell, which seems to not exist in the bible proper but which has been adopted by most Christian religions as canon. Hell is a semi-invention based on a few different passages which describe sinners as being destroyed or burned like “chaff”, which is the outer husk of grains discarded as being inedible. In other words, judged as being worthless. And then there is the “throw them into the furnace of fire where there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth” passage. But neither of these refer at all to Satan, and especially not as a place he rules to torment people forever who are not judged to be worth of going to heaven.
Right, maybe it’s that link of Satan ruling over hell that started during the renaissance. It’s been awhile since I read the relevant stories
The devil is ALL OVER THE PLACE in the Bible. I think you’re confusing it with the Torah, in which the Devil only is mentioned by name 3 times, and the term ‘devil’ as a descriptor is only mentioned about 22 times.
Really, this is all just part of his “Condition” and they’re humoring him…
Does removing a despot make you a devil in the eyes of anyone but the closest family of said despot? I can imagine an Uganda without Amin, Central African Republic without Bokassa, Congo without Seko, Nigeria without Sani Abacha, Liberia without Taylor and so on. I do not think they would have been sorely missed. Of course Deus is (partly) in it for the money, but as long as he brings the people in this (fictionus) country with him for the ride, what is the problem? When the cake gets bigger, even a small piece will be good.
So Deus is what you get is what you get when you cross Dick Dastardly, Xanthos and the hooded claw?
I’m pretty sure that if you tried crossing Dick Dastardly and David Xanthos, the resulting competent/incompetent reaction would kill you.
Xanatos. Sorry I had to correct that. OCD made me.