Grrl Power #288 – Hearts and mind fingers
Those of you who are not huge fans of Arianna will find this page cathartic. I’m not sure how much of the comic will be dedicated to the PR and political side of things. I suspect very little. Just the occasional reminder than it’s a thing.
A quick googling tells me it’s probably not a big deal getting properly loaded modern ammo wet. Long term storage? I assume it’s not ideal. Sure if you put it in something that’s water tight first, which if you’re going to store ammo in a well for some reason is probably how you’d do it. Sydney is less of an expert on the matter than I am, and it’s also possible she’s thinking about black powder charges or something.
Arianna isn’t about to turn to the press and lead in with the worst case version of events, she’s mostly just venting for a moment. She probably already has a plan of attack, and hopefully it’s something more nuanced than the oft-relied-upon-by-politicians flat out denial of facts.
I thing the font I used for Max’s gravelly voice might not be the best for the size it appears in the comic. Hopefully it’s legible enough, and it will only be around for a few more pages.
Here’s the link to the new comments highlighter for chrome, and the GitHub link which you can use to install on FireFox via Greasemonkey.
SuperheroThey're super, thanks for asking!
Meatspace ComicSeriously these are awesome. Check 'em out!
Not UpdatingNo longer updating or only updates sporadically, but definitely worth reading.
SeriouslySeriously you guys. If you like Grrl Power the check these out.
"Mature"Mature subject matter and occasionally something explicit but usually safe. Can't guarantee the ads are safe though.
Dongs Ahoy!Full frontal and backal. Lots of skin, sex on some or all pages, explicit or otherwise.
Klingon kisses! Love it!
And my brain went immediately to Klingon lesbians. Bad brain bad!
In that way all Klingons are bisexual.
very bad LOL
According to what I’ve heard Worf say, those weren’t merely Klingon kisses…In his exact words, “This IS sex.”
Arianna episodes are fine by me. She’s one my fave characters.
She’s one of those kinds of characters it’s good to see them get some comeuppance occasionally.
The fine print on her contract covers comic relief duties.
Nice wind-down. Keep up the good work, man.
If “Very little” of the day went how she wanted, does that mean at least one thing went how she wanted? I’m struggling to remember much that did!
Maxima went to the bank. Supers were ‘accidentally’ “revealed” to be working for the military, and there was a press conference.
Admittedly, even the particulars of those events weren’t entirely to plan.
And they got Sydney as a bonus.
Arianna seemed to really like the video “somebody” put together from the bank’s security cameras and posted on some unknown on-line video sharing site.
Oh and Arianna seemed to like it when Max and Sydney were arguing outside the bank.
And she clearly forgot the the merchandising for Halo’s Orbs.
Watching Arianna get taken to the cleaners is always entertaining.
…… and s-o-o-o well-deserved.
Time to use Super-Spin. The silver-age power that does everything – suck thing in, blow them out, save Arianna’s bacon…
Well, hopefully that last one, but maybe not…
You also have to mention molecules and vibration. Between vibration and molecules and spinning or flying really fast you can do anything. Or at least that’s what superfriends taught me.
Ah, politics. As someone who joined the comic last fall, I’m curious to see how the comic’s “regular” side will be at non-binge pace.
Welcome to the community
I predict a two week grace before somebody starts complaining that the pace is too slow, and demanding we get back to the action.
We will then bitch-slap and mock them mercilessly.
Just as was done with the people who complained about other things. Sure, it can be said to be feeding the trolls, but it is satisfying at times.
I should clarify, for those who might not know me, that my turn of phrase was for comedic effect. It is far better to disarm troll behaviour, with a comic deflection or polite rebuke. They are are indeed looking to get a rise otherwise. We have more than a few ex-trolls (or trolls who are not too disruptive) who have been happily welcomed into the community, as a result.
Presumably, finding that they can get their kicks through productive debate, rather than just pointless provocation. It is probably a welcome change, from other less enlightened parts of the internet. I just hope we are able to keep this great community spirit, for a long time to come!
I do hesitate to make remarks like that, for fear of poking the trolls. But so long as they are polite trolls, we don’t mind the odd provocative statement, that stirs up an interesting debate. Come on, give us a hug!
*holds paws wide for a troll group-hug*
Do your good deed for the day, Hug a troll. (Just remember, they regenerate. You presumably don’t.)
*Stands next to Yorp, arms wide, waiting for the Hug*
*clenches teeth, tightens sphincter, squeezes eyes shut, crosses claws and forces tail to wag as friendly as possible*
*accepts hug*
Well.
“Gives Yorp a hug”
*Joins in the group hug*
*After wiping a manly tear from the corner of an eye*
..And for those of you who couldn’t bear the sight of that, I’m offering a bulk discount on Brain Bleach™ for a limited time only.
*Joins in the hug*
Don’t worry, I’ve pre-dosed myself… I’m glad there are no side-effects, and even happier that there are only 17 days to the next update!
Don’t say that, not even in jest! It is 12 hours 38 minutes, as at your time stamped comment, until the next update.
And only 12 hours 32 minutes, from when mine is likely to hit the server.
*carries on hugging*
“I predict a two week grace before somebody starts complaining…”
Hmmm…two weeks…4 comic pages…Yep, that sounds about right for a comic that’s not showing super-action (interspersed with the faked bank robbery, some minor tomfoolery action in Archon HQ, & so forth). It only took about 6 weeks for someone to start complaining when there WAS some super action super-action, and a super-battle royale, no less.
;)
And so the comment war about the supers being responsible for their attack or not spills over into the comic. Most of which depends on how Vehemence convinced them to show up.
Heh. I give DaveB more credit than that. He has had the aggro aura planned out from before the fight even started. And will have thought through the consequences long ago. The hairdresser and his behaviour were clear indicators of forward planning.
What I do grant is that he may have brought forwards the timing of it. But he was clearly expecting to do it as at the previous page, at the very least. Given that Hiro’s comment at the end of that was foreshadowing this dilemma (albeit in Dave’s usual unpredictable fashion).
Thank goodness he had not stumbled across Peggy’s body, crushed by a vengeful Concretia!
Hex was also evidence early on that there might be mind control stuff. She was asking herself why she was even there.
To me that was more her rethinking her actions that had led up to her being shot down into a tree. Just because you regret doing something after the fact does not mean you were forced into doing it. Most often it is just a bad judgement call or not thinking at all.
I agree that the turn of phrase can be taken either way. Although she did go on to also say “Who thought that attacking an elite group of super heroes was…” But a similar argument can be deployed for that. Both as you suggest and as Walter does.
What I find interesting is that this happened immediately after Hex flew away from the battle, to evade Maxima’s attack. This is the point at which, if there were an aggro aura, she would presumably have passed beyond it’s area of effect.
Now take that in conjunction with the behaviour of the people who had the aggro aura cut off by Halo’s force field. An immediate reversion to normal behaviour and (at the first moment not involved in combat) confirmation that they agreed with Halo’s statement that they had been forced to fight somehow.
In isolation Hex’s comments can be argued either way. Taken in conjunction with the strikingly similar situation of reverting to normal, non-aggressive behaviour (in her case deciding to stop fighting and go home, in their case to go help the cops) the instant that the aggro field is likely to have stopped affecting them, is rather more telling.
Another good question – where was Sydney (and more importantly, her shield) relative to Vehemence and the Barberian when said Barberian asked if he was allowed to surrender, and expressed confusion about why he was even there?
“This is the point at which, if there were an aggro aura, she would presumably have passed beyond it’s area of effect.”
Or maybe even, if Hex was aggravated by V’s aura at that time, she might have ignored Max’s blast & kept attacking.
“This is the point at which, if there were an aggro aura, she would presumably have passed beyond it’s area of effect.”
She was just outside the parking lot, just like the news crew and they were still within range. Vehemence would have to deploy quite a wide range if he wanted to ensnare all supers and still hang back where he didn’t stand out.
This was also right after she was one-shotted by Maxima, hammering in just how bad of an idea this was and a good moment to rethink her actions.
I’ll agree though that her thoughts and actions could be interpreted either way, but till we have seen confirmation that Vehemence also was able to use a subtle more controlled version of the aura I will stay convinced that it was their own choice to fight and not a form of mind control.
In fact, I just realised, Nose Boop was behaving exactly the same way as Hex, and intending to slip away, until he was goaded by Halo. So that makes the similarities seven more significant!
Do you think that Mr. Nose Boop & Budget Halo have been shipping with each other even before this comic started? Considering his muscles, how has she survived this long?
;)
It is also similar in the way that he was one-shotted and had it hammered in, more litteral in his case, that he was way out of his league. He had been shown he was not as tough as he thought he was and saw a good chance to split instead of staying around and get arrested, possibly taking another beating in the process.
Course, while it didn’t always result in a comment war (did that happen?), people have been talking about the various ramifications of V’s “mind control” for a long time now, even back when it was just a hypothetical extension of his powers (we were so innocent then of how far his powers could really streeeetch!), so DaveB has had some time to make some tweaks to his plans based on things said by fans or some outside inspiration for that matter. Its pretty clear we influence things. Well, maybe not me but you know the sharper of us when we butt heads.
Yeah not really control but definitely manipulation. V definitely influenced them into thinking going into violent confrontation with a team designed to was a good idea. The Hair dresser has the best defense options having surrendered peaceably and giving ArcSWAT (but not the readers) that the first solid clue there might be outside influence. Shadow Boxer and the Periwinkle Butt Sniffer have the least defense considering the former was in a shield that protected him from any potential aura at the time he assaulted Sydney and the PBS’s nemesis power would’ve likely protected him from the Aura so long as no other power was used against him and yet he never seem to not want to back off from the fight even when not being attacked.
Oh and Opal & Vektor will probably end up in jail regardless, if only due to finally answering to previous charges and/or parole violations.
Yeah…. They’ll have a lot of trouble keeping opal in prison. Even if she can’t make a portal through a force field, force fields have only appeared as a result of superpowers/super orbs and they aren’t likely to have one on hand.
Even when unconscious, Sydney’s “Aura vision” showed “Dork Toll” to be surrounded by “empty space” when V’s aura was at “Hulk Smash” levels. That may not fly in court, but his “counter whatever gets thrown at me” power is clearly documented.
Yea, I keep forgetting about Death Toll. He will not have been affected by the aggro aura, and therefore all his actions are attributable to his own decisions, and gain no mitigation.
But, here is an interesting thought, that crops up as a result. Death Toll’s power is not the negation of incoming attacks. It counters them. For instance he was able to capture Jiggawatt, rather than gaining immunity to lightning.
Perhaps the reason why Vehemence’s plans went awry was because he was actually having his own power turned against him? Loosing the ability to distinguish friend from foe (turning on his allies when they tried to escape) and making him use more aggressive options, than tactical ones, when fighting.
I see no evidence of an “empty space” around Death Tolls in the aura panel. He is actually laying right on a symbol without altering it except where his body is and the symbols are undisturbed beyond him as they are with Sydney’s shield. So as Yorp suggests he just countered the effect without disturbing the aura around him at all. (countered it by keeping himself unconscious? LOL )
…I’ve never known butt-heads to be very sharp. After all, butts are round & don’t have edges or points…
Except for those jammed in them
…Like Death Tolls?…
But then again, it could be argued that those points & edges were not a natural part of the butt, merely added to it by force.
My bad for not making it more clear I was being sarcastic. I did not mean to imply that Dave only added this page because of the comments. It was more a comment on how that what has been discussed for weeks already now shows up in the comic itself to give us closure on what really will happen.
It is still my opinion though that everyone came here on their own accord and not because of some magic aura-thingy. I think the aggro-aura only started up later when Vehemence needed the fighting to restart..
As for why nice people like hairdresser guy also came, he said he came along with a few of his buddies, so that would be a case of peer pressure.
I agree that everybody likely came here of their own accord (be it by mundane means or with the assistance of the portal creating girl). But assembling is a legal activity, and we have no proof * that they gathered here for any particular purpose, one way or the other. But, even if Vehemence was telling the truth, it is still legal for malcontent and anarchists to gather, if their intent was to protest at the formation of a ‘super police state’. **
Once gathered the aggro aura could push that angry protest, from demonstration to all out attack.
I agree with your assessment of the hairdresser guy. His buddies wanted to go to an anti-government protest, and he went along. Would a peaceful guy like that then, just due to peer pressure, aid and abet the attempted murder of police officers ?
Seriously. Take a look at your own hair dresser (or barber). Hopefully a normal, upright, pillar of the community. Even if they had some anarchist friends who decided to start a riot, they then went on to very clearly use deadly force (fireballs, lightning bolts, massive projectiles and so on). Escalating this into an all out war on the police.
Would your hairdresser decide to kill the cops? Or would he or she only do that, if under some unknown influence that you could not attribute to their normal character?
Now look at it with the explanation of the aggro aura being used, from the moment they assembled. The anomaly is explained.
Hopefully that argument will convince you? If it does not, that is fine. You are entitled to your opinion. And I have no intention of brow beating you into changing it, I have given it my best shot.
But do you consider that it is possible that my explanation is right? Even though, you consider yours to be the more likely. Because so long as you think it is reasonably possible that the alternative explanation could be right, then that meets the legal criteria of plausible doubt.
Which is what is necessary for a court to exonerate them. In the eyes of the law they start innocent, until proven guilty. And, despite attempting to prove their guilt, reasonable doubt remains. Which means that they are declared ‘not guilty’.
* Excluding the testimony of Vehemence, as he was lying just for laughs, so anything he says is worthless as evidence, without some kind of corroboration.
** Note that Arc-light had no record of any of these people. If they had all previously been dangerous anarchists, and serious criminals, that would not be the case. Some or many of them would be on an official watch list. Vehemence was over-stating their threat, or lying outright, for his own aggressive purposes.
Vekter and Opal have prior criminal records, and had warrants for their arrest already. Have to go with “reasonable doubt” with the others
I suppose much depends on what the peers were pressuring the hairdresser to do. If they neglected to mention that a tag-team super showdown was on the agenda, or that it wasn’t a friendly mock-showdown, or that the opposing team were law enforcement, he might have come along. Then, when the truth became evident, he might have felt that he’s already in too deep before Dabbler gave him time to actually consider his situation.
As one of the people who prompted that discussion, I gotta say, I LOVED this page….
Ehh, it’s something for the courts to wrangle over. Nothing we’ll care about.
We only need to see the sausage not how it’s made.
Trust me on this.:
Many, many times it’s really good (bad) to know what kind of process meat you’re eating!
And this applies to all kinds of processed goods (justice and media included).
In reality, absolutely. In a comic with a limited page count and only one person trying to keep it going, let’s cut Dave a break on overdoing detail work. As long as we don’t end up with Grrl Power: XKCD Version.
Maybe she should sell TShirts with that, or make it her catchphrase.
“Very little of this day went how I wanted”
+1
Mainstream marketing and fan appeal. Not that it has a catchy ring to it, but it is oft said nonetheless. So will have resonance to many folks.
Dave should sell those shirts for real. DT after his defeat to illustrate it.
Maybe Arianna standing with the demolished restaurant as a backdrop? That would speak well to both fans and the general public.
And on the back of the t-shirt, a voice bubble coming up from the rubble.
Huh? How did I get that progress-bar type effect?Is that what happens if you do a blockquote, but do not properly put a “/”, in the closing blockquote? I am guessing it is nesting a second quote, but is failing to find any text.
No, that’s Achilles’s Damage Indicator. It’s stuck on zero percent, as always.
+! or +1
You gave me an idea – I wonder…
Ugh, no. Too much indenting.
I don’t see why not. If I might be so bold as to make a prediction, Ari will probably be repeating that phrase fairly often as the comic continues…Especially now that Sydney’s on the team.
:D
From Calvin and Hobbes. Calvin commenting on his teacher, “Ugh! It disgusting how she chugs Maalox straight from the bottle like that.”
Okay, I’m a little concerned about Sydney’s apparent hypercompetence now. It was great and funny when her ubernerdity allowed her to strategise and direct the pro supers, but now she’s apparently schooling Arianna about her job?
Arianna is too focussed on her job – make the supers look good. She’s just forgotten about herself
It’s being ‘Genre Savvy’.
She has an encyclopedic knowledge of comicbook precedences.
Giving your opponion about a situation is not the same as schooling someone
Not really, Sydney’s just basically being the 5-year-old pointing out the flaws in the Evil Overlord’s Master Plan. Rule #12.
^ +1
Never proceed from only one position or perspective. You’ve always got to have an “outsider’s” view to keep your own perspective, in relationship to the rest of the world.
Is that like ‘think outside the box’?
’cause if so, just once in awhile, I’d really appreciate being able to see the bx
Personally I find it very difficult to think outside the box when it is a Tesseract.
Just consult your Hitchiker’s Guide to the Hypercube and you will find good travel tips.
Tesseracts are so four dimensional.
The Tesseract also is one the infinity stones, the purple gem, 1/6th of the essense of an ethereal being long devided, the aspect of space. ;-)
I didn’t take it as schooling her on her job. More as acting as a sounding board. Most of Sydney’s comments are not informative in any way. Also remember despite the one scene with Yorp she is a small business owner, which by default, includes a free lesson in PR from the School of Hard Knocks.
Sometimes that one “free” lesson ain’t so free after all. Experience is a harsh teacher; she gives the test first & the lesson afterwards. If you fail that initial test, there’s usually a price to be paid for it.
;)
And we know that Sydney is an expert in PR: “Buy more comics!” YORP!
*wags tail*
Dave says she is venting now to someone who won’t hold her accountable for what she says. Just spewing out worst case scenarios and all the negativity she can muster out into the cosmos now so she can pull herself together and be Little Miss Sunshine with a Shiner when she has to return to “sell mode”.
Spitting out the most polarized arguments she can make on purpose is of course going to leave her open to reasonably intelligent points from a calmer third party. (I’m not sure when Sydney will decide she should be more concerned about the PR side of things but it looks like with everything else thrust at her today she can’t quite bring herself to care about one more thing. [maybe when/if she decides the groups image is important to HER sales])
She’s the protag, I don’t mind the Wesley Crusher.
On the other hand, she’s also going off her meds. I imagine that’ll catch up in a strip or two.
Wet ammunition storage used to be fairly common practice in post war tanks to prevent fires and explosions.
The practice is even older than that.
Yea but wasn’t that surrounding the ammo with water store tanks? Not directly in water
Well.. Ahem. If the well is bottomless, wouldn’t the ammunition never fall far enough to reach the water?
Was my first thought.
In fact, Syd is right, bottomless refers to the depth of the water, as opposed to having nothing to hold the water in.
Actually, a well could be ‘bottomless’ and still have water in it. Just make a tube all the way through the Earth, open at both ends (it’ll need to be constructed to pass through magma and the Earth’s core, but hey, we’re in Comic Book Country, now). Then fill the middle with water. It has no bottom–even the ‘center’ of the well, in terms of gravity, would probably shift a bit due to rotation of the planet, especially if it didn’t pass through dead-center. Of course, then the well isn’t an infinite depth, which is the usual connotation of ‘bottomless’, and thus Arianna’s mixed metaphor would be even more meaningless, but I’m mainly typing this in hopes that it will fall through a wormhole and be read by her and annoy her with nerdic pedantry.
I don’t hate Arianna, but I love it when she’s annoyed.
Of course you would need to insulate the walls of said pit exceptionally well. Otherwise you will just have a giant kettle effect, at either end. Given the amount of lava that it would be exposed to otherwise. But point well made, nonetheless.
The well would always fill with seawater unless both ends (antipodes) were on land – which is surprisingly rare. But in a sense, it would indeed be bottomless – however falling objects would tend to hit the side rather than falling straight down, due to a version of the Coriolis effect.
“I don’t hate Arianna, but I love it when she’s annoyed.”
I agree. Even in real life, when I encounter people like that, it’s fun to watch when they’re annoyed.
:)
Technically, a well is a hole in the ground. It doesn’t have to have water in it. We have oil wells, for example. Arianna was obviously referring to a well drilled specifically for the purpose of tapping the same underground caches of endless ammunition that many comic book guns draw from.
Whether Vehemence influenced them to fight, the accepted invitations to come and attack federal agents.
Clearly, they are at least chargeable with conspiracy.
And of course, we still have to charge For Whom The Death Tolls, for his butt stupid name.
It depends on how much mind finger snapping was involved in the recruiting. Vehemence had a whole bag of tricks at his disposal; he could have used a less power-hoggery version of the aura.
And that is something the defense has to prove. They cant just say, “Dude, not guilty because of invisible unprovable magic” They have to show some evidence that it happened. Im guessing the majority of these people have some sort of history. Maybe not big enough to get on the intel lists of archon, but back home they are probably well known for their opinions. Just enough to show that yeah, its entirely likely they were easily convinced to join in on a rampage instead of being forced through spooky mind control powers.
I think you’ve got that the wrong way around…
The defense doesn’t have to prove that their clients were under V’s magical influence, they just have to show that it’s possible. The prosecutors however has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that the accused wasn’t under influence or they have to show that it didn’t change the outcome.
The system is slightly lopsided, and it leans towards the defender. If there is any doubt the defense is supposed to win.
Yep, it does have to be shown that they were behaving uncharacteristically. The guy’s comment in panel one, supported by the fact that supposed ‘villains’ were helping to take down Vehemence, once the aggro field had been disrupted, gives us very strong indicators that you might be jumping the gun a bit in assuming:”
Thank goodness Maxima realises that evidence for that has to be found first. But until it is investigated we do not know why they came. We only have Vehemence’s comment to go on, and he was throwing around lies, just for the laughs.
That said though, you are right. If they were conspiring to attack the police, then that is a crime. And it is far more credible to assume that Vehemence could not have been influencing them, if that was happening by phone or social media, from remote places around the country.
But, on the other paw, he may have tricked some, most or all of them to come here under false pretences. So we can speculate about which may be true, but the cops will not be making charges until they have the evidence to support them.
If V. testifies that he simply got a bunch of people into range of his field by inviting them to drinks at Joe’s Plotting Bar, and THEN said, “Hey, let’s f**k up these new super-cops,” especially after a few rounds of drinks, then ARCHON won’t have much choice but to let them go.
If, OTOH, events were more a case of him calling them up and saying, “Hey, I got an idea on how to put these new super-cops in their place, we’re having a meeting at Joe’s Plotting Bar,” then they are more susceptible to criminal prosecution, at least for conspiracy.
Note that having your prosecution hinge on the testimony of a guy who arranges a massive brawl for the lulz is an uncertain tack, at best.
What I want to know is how V rounded up all these individuals, convinced them it’s a good idea to go to a fight, and then teleported them to the fighting spot in the space of about 4 hours. I’m going to assume he also told them all to show up at a specific spot so Opal could teleport them all at once.
At least I’m going to assume he did it all in the space of 4 hours since I’m guessing that’s how long it took for the press conference to end and the eating to begin.
Maybe V’s superpower is effective organization….
Well, Vehemence has already displayed all the prerequisites for acting as a “community organizer” (ie: rabble rouser).
;)
Is there anything to indicate that he had a standing start? We know that there have been Empowered, and previous versions of ARC, for centuries before they came into the light ‘today’, so I’d be surprised if there wasn’t at least a loose network of less-reputable types as well. Not really expecting anything organised or consciously large-scale, more like shady characters each having a few contacts for potential collaborators and the message passing that way.
Supers have probably been looking for others, like themselves, for years. Using the same tools as the rest of normal society. Let us assume that a social media site has allowed them to get in touch. A few of them have even met up, in the real world. And they all confirm that they really do have super powers. It is not just somebody playing a prank.
Then, one day, you turn on the TV and there is Maxima, looking all GRRRR! What is the first thing you do (after phoning your mate and saying ‘turn on the TV!)? You log onto your Facebook superheros assembled page, and see what everyone is saying. Lots of excited posts, but one is standing out:
Portal girl and I are calling a meeting, for us to discuss this situation, and confirm, face to face, with the members of this organisation, what this actually means for us, personally.
If you want to come to the meeting, just log into Skype, turn on your webcam and call PortalGIrl. She will then open a portal, and bring you to our meeting.
The only reason it took four hours, is because some people might have been slow getting home and logging on to the Facebook page (the dinosaurs who do not use a smartphone).
Then they all get zapped with the aggro aura. And the rest is history.
“the dinosaurs who do not use a smartphone”:
Dinosaurs didn’t use smartphones. That’s why they’re extinct…Or had to evolve into birds…Or something…
He used Vekter’s network of Anarchists, rabble rousers, anti-cop, anti-government loons, crooks, cons, and all other forms of criminal contacts and even let Vekter think it was all his idea.
At least processing these supers and digging into any other super contacts they might have had (V suggested they were a group formed MOSTLY out of various anti this or that malcontents or criminals and they still do smell of such even if this one wasn’t entirely their bad but V’s) will get ARCLIGHT back up to something closer to useful information. I wonder if it will be revealed that ARCDARK knew of some of these guys and left ARCLIGHT in the DARK (heh) because they didn’t trust them not to blow their cover or just lack of communication between them for reasons…. Could lead to a little interdepartmental bad feelings since it left ARCLIGHT with their pants down on this one.
I think the very fact that ARCLIGHT was unaware of them means it is likely that these folks were just low level protester type anarchists and/or petty criminals at most. Much more than that and it would mean that ARCLIGHT are wholly incompetent, because they should have been on watchlists already.
ARCLIGHT is the only (well besides maybe some overlap with DARK) investigative authority specializing in keeping tabs on potential super power, mad science, and other metaphenomenon? And they are kind of new right? Maybe they will show more interest in collecting this kind of data once they get their tendrils into everything good and proper than the organizations they drew their starter data on supers threats from?
If they are usually loners (sure fight like loners) who would know for sure that they didn’t just use some explosive or device to get into that secure area unless they were an organization specifically looking for inconclusive reports with clues, or the absence of clues, pointing in that direction.
My point is that the FBI, local law enforcement, the Secret Service and the various other existing organisations would have watch lists for seriously dangerous individuals. They would not know (officially) that super powers even existed. So it is not like they would say “oh don’t track him, that is Arc’s job, he is a super”. If those folks had been serious, active, dangerous, anarchists, the alarm bells would be ringing on any search Archon made.
Obviously this pre-supposes that they have access to mundane law enforcement databases. But this is a super-hero story. Such is a reasonable assumption for the genre. Even if a new organisation in the real world might take a lot longer to integrate their computer systems.
Archon obviously have access to cutting edge (bleeding edge even) technology such as the pip-boy and visors. Not to mention their armoury defences. So I think that is a fair conclusion to draw.
Your final paragraph would be reasonable. If it were not for the sheer numbers involved. If they were loners, what are they doing in such a large group?
And even if there were that many terrorist level anarchists operating already on US soil, without a network or support, their sheer numbers would result in a number of them having been caught in the act at some point (giving them a history). Or, at the very least, have been flagged as suspects. Which should be picked up in an enquiry.
Those arguments would need a lot more explanation before becoming convincing, I am afraid.
OK, I know SOME of them are not inclined enough towards the illegal to show up on databases in any easily searchable way… yet. (though if they were this easily manipulated low V juice or no I bet some of them would have eventually) However some of them come off as having fought before at least as individuals. I think at least a third of them have just never been caught when doing the big stuff or at all and their powers may not have been obvious in the study of the scenes of their crimes (where anybody actually knew something had gone down in order to investigate). If they are willing to kill or maim how would they even be caught? They seem silly when compared to folks like Maxima or Sydney’s invincible shield but to normal cops they would just walk through them (or “surrender then kill them” and then, if they were smart enough to commit crimes away from daylight and the public, they could just take their time destroying tapes, bodies or any other evidence. Then learn from their whoopsie and be more careful next time. (they suck at big flashy super villain brawls or large frontal assaults on trained forces but this is unlikely to have been their normal mode of operation [small groups and loners against norms or just security devices if they could help it]). Assassins, spies and thieves only take on armies in the movies/TV. (you should be happy this increases the likelyhood of early V manipulation). Even guerrilla fighters wouldn’t fight a unit as powerful as Maxima’s all together like that (mostly because of Maxima) but would probably try to get Maxima by herself. (still suicide but at least then they would have a chance)
The only group who might start working up searches through crime/incident files for hidden/unlooked for tell tales of power usage would be the newly formed ARCLIGHT. It will probably take them a while to fine tune how to set that up. So a decent chunk of these folks could have been committing crimes with no way for anyone to ID them ‘cept those they did jobs for or their go betweens. Now they and some of their powers are on the radar to compare to past and future files when ARCLIGHT gets that up and going. This could be a big boost to ARCLIGHT in the game. Clearly these more secretive super folks are more aware of each other than anybody else is. IF some of them can be attached to crimes and then sweated a LOT of names may start showing up in ARCLIGHTS soon to be unique data base. If the “innocent” ones agree to cooperate and be studied then ARCLIGHT gathers a lot of data on what the aftermath of their powers look like on various materials and systems so they can track for tell tales of folk with similar powers.
Vehemence and the ring leaders he dredged up all called a decent portion of them up individually from the sound of it and then those folk dredged up some more. I think when you are this unusual there is a desire to find others like yourself and once you had found a few you would probably only maintain ties with those enough like yourself to at least chat with online. There are clearly a lot more of these folks then previously believed and the bulk of them have thought things through enough to realize, for one reason or another, its best to keep this information to themselves most of the time. I bet none of them regularly hang out together knowingly as supers for any reasons in a group of more than two or three at anyone time. I don’t think most of them live anywhere near most of the rest. They needed Opal to get them all together in a group of any size.
And, just for the sake of argument, lets assume that nobody but Vehemence has any strong criminal leanings. These folks are finding each other across the nation/nations without showing up on the radar enough to be counted even by statisticians (so obviously they aren’t joining up with some website called “superclubusa.org” or whatever that anybody could bump into and pass the word). They are open enough to each other but secretive otherwise. Which is just generally wise not to paint a target on your back when you aren’t really all that invincible. Probably through virtual meeting places and careful probes to people who say the right sorts of things in the right sorts of forums etc… If talking to these folks or having the resident hackers probe their net dealings reveals how this organic network came to be and how it functions then ARCLIGHT will soon be sitting on a wealth of information about how many and what kinds of supers might be out there to compare to potential super crimes. Not to mention signs of malcontent amongst their posts to each other etc… The whole big brother thing may be morally and legally dubious but its pretty clear that the one hacker we know of probably bends or breaks the rules and morality all the time they just wouldn’t be able to use anything he came up with without a warrant. (not that that would be really hard these days)
One way or another I believe this event, if used to the hilt by ARC, can have great rewards for the fledgling ARCLIGHT.
I’d phrase it like explaining how Archon also protects innocent supers, not just innocent normal people (note: use friendly term for normal people).
It may scare the public a little more, but it’ll breed great trust from the super population, which may very well be worth more in the long term
I you were the instructor during Arianna’s Journalism courses about PR, she just might get through this with her job at Archon intact…
She could also play up the fact that Archon did their job. It works. A threat like Vehemence could have easily escalated this, but no fatalities, few seriously injured, and all damage isolated to one restauraunt/parking lot. The Justice League has done worse. Hell Superman’s destroyed entire cities fighting one guy in cartoons, comics, and movies.
Pretty much this. If it were me, I’d face the press and say something along the lines of: “If you take away nothing else from tonight, remember this- the good guys won. Faced with a sneak attack from an unknown force with superior numbers, Archon defeated them with a minimum of damage to people and property. The threats we face in the coming days are real. There are some scary people out there. But what we’ve shown tonight is that when those threats arise, you can count on Archon to be there as your shield.”
One restauraunt, parking lot, and the nearby highway overpass construction…
There is hardly ever a “friendly” label for any group of people. You get around that by not using a label at all.
“Archon’s job is to protect innocent people. And that includes innocent people who happen to have super powers.”
-or-
“Archon’s job is to protect the citizens of this great nation and people around the world. And that includes people who happen to have super powers.”
Or any permutation of that which both incorporates the archon mission statement and also makes it clear that super powers does not equal guilty until proven innocent.
I’m with Max. The legal system is innocent until proven guilty. Being arrested and charged is one thing, it’s the conviction that people worry about. All the NICS forms for purchasing firearms just ask if you’ve been convicted of any felony that would prevent you from owning a firearm. They don’t care if you’ve been arrested and had charges dropped. Arrest them, if they do find that Vehemence’s agro aura is what caused the brawl, then they are released without record. However, I don’t think the agro aura came into play until well into the fight when that wave of energy went by. Unless V has varying degrees of his aura that he can use.
It’s very possible that he used a weak version of the aura to influence the decision to come fight in the first place. That’d explain how the barber went, dispite clearly not wanting to fight
Peer pressure explains that. There’s no indication he used it to get people there, and I think he’s not really the sort of person who would if he’s not already high on violence.
There were more people baffled by why they went with this plan. Budget Halo for example: https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1384. I think the aggro arua(TM) was a likely explanation.
It’s the squirrel’s fault.
Yes! Finally someone else recognises the true mastermind!
What do youmean, “finally someone else?” I recognized that at least a few pages ago…
:/
Aww, you are right. Sorry.
Welcome to the league against evil squirrels! *
Recipes and serving suggestions are welcome.
* Not to be mistaken for the good squirrels, like Grace, from EGS.
When you’ve seen a video clip of a squirrel climb into a candy vending machine, rummage around for about 5 seconds or so before coming out with a stolen candy bar, then you’ll know evil.
;)
Asking oneself why you are there when you realize that you are severely outpowered is not a clear sign of being mind controlled.
In this case I think it’s more that just simple reality set in.
Take another look at that scene. It is more than just that, as she then goes on to say
Then bear in mind the timing. She is saying this just after having rapidly travelled some distance. So her behaviour is wholly consistent with that of the other people, when the aggro aura was cut off by Halo’s force field.
Mind you, I am not disputing your point. It is indeed something someone might say to themselves. Even with the expanded text I put in. But it’s precise timing does match the hypothesis that is under discussion, as do the sentiments expressed. And is supported by the people in panel one above.* So I feel is reasonable to cite as circumstantial evidence.
* Again, timing is important. These folks have not had time to collude, or come up with a matching story** but are behaving in the same way. When circumstantial evidence stacks up with other supporting evidence it’s merits become stronger.
** Unless they did it in advance. But the hairdresser and the guy speaking both helped out the cops the instant the force field came down. So they have very high credibility supporting their case.
IMO, it looks like a normal “What the hell am I doing here?” type reaction as one often gets in adversity, that you are reading WWWWAAAAAAYYYYYYYY too much into.
Psst, don’t tell anybody. This is necessary to establish reasonable doubt!
I do not want to see Texas bring back the death penalty, in a knee-jerk reaction, and execute Heavenly Sword. Not when there is the possibility she is not a police murdering anarchist at heart.
Ok, it is 50/50 as to whether it is a normal, self-reflective, comment. Or the exact thing you would say if freed from the aggro aura*. But, I accept that you are saying, ‘on the balance of probability it is a normal comment.’
All I am asking is, “is it reasonably possible that she is actually behaving that way because she has moved out of range of the aggro aura?”
And, remember, your vote may be the one that sends Heavenly Sword to the electric chair! Are you so certain that the answer can only be a normal response,** that you would see that poor innocent girl die?
* And bear in mind that Nose Boop behaved exactly the same as her, when he was freed from it. His first thought was to slip off and make his escape, before Halo manipulated him into helping the cops. So Hex was mirroring him exactly.
** Plus we also have the undeniably guiltless hairdresser, who clearly was behaving like an innocent pacifist would, if they threw off the shackles of an agro aura.
^ :Nose Boop’s (or as I call him, Gummy) reaction seemed to me more along the lines of “Cheez it, the cops are coming.”
** Hairdresser Guy was there because people he knew invited (?) him along. It doesn’t automatically follow that they were truthful to him about what they were heading into. His reaction seems like a simple “I did’t sign up for THIS” kind of thing.
As someone who has been arrested and released without charges, I can assure you, it is not “without record”. That arrest will haunt them, on every background check (including employment), for the rest of their lives unless a judge expunges the police records.
This is definitely true. Part of my job for several years was running criminal background checks. Depending on how far back various agencies in my state (TX) had updated their online records, arrests showed up as far back as the 40s.
Interestingly enough, you could not have the job in question if you had an ARREST (never mind conviction) for anything greater than a class B misdemeanor, or a class B misdemeanor in the last 10 years. And since criminal record is not a protected clas, it was not deemed discriminatory.
So yeah, arrest records will stay with you forever unless expunged (and even those can stay in places).
It’s worse, nowadays, actually. I work at a newspaper with a website. We get calls every week from yet another guy who was arrested-but-not-convicted back a decade or more. Because media companies (including ours) are aggressive about Search Engine Optimization, it’s very likely that if you’ve been arrested and it made the news websites, it WILL come up, even 12 years later, on a Google search of your name. And I should note–there’s very rarely a follow-up story about how the charges were dropped, so the last word is, “John Soandso of the 900 block of Someplace Ave in Midville was arrested on a charge of Aggravated Mopery last night.”
In the EU, they just recently passed a “Right to Be Forgotten” rule for news sites, actually, while in the U.S., there’s a cottage industry built around companies that will use targeted SEO to ‘bury’ those same stories by pushing them to page 3 or 4 of Google searches.
Yea, I had my doubts about that law (or the way it is implemented and enforced, specifically) given that some perfectly legitimate public interest stuff is likely to be buried too. But there are also a lot of unfair things which make peoples’ lives hell. So it is fair for their to be a legal remedy for it.
Doubtless it will take some time for us to get the balance right. But I think the EU is better as a result of that ruling, rather than worse.
Too many man abs… i want my share of girls in undies.
I’ve found that I can appreciate human beauty in both males & females…It doesn’t mean I’d want to “hook up” with another male.
One specific instance I can recall, even a few decades after the fact, was that there was a male body-builder show on TV: the guy I’m referring to pulled off a pose so perfect that I was literally stunned…There was even a gasp of awe audible from the attending audience. I didn’t feel anything sexual from it & I don’t even remember the contestant’s name, but it was definitely a moment to remember.
“Even if it’s not the sort of house I’d live in, I can respect the architecture.”
Can’t remember who said it.
Now imagine how girls feel 99.99% of the time.
Leave us this one webcomic.
*imagines women kung fu motorboating abs*
How would that work?
I don’t know. Maybe the women can explain.
They are too busy grating cheese on them to motorboat.
I dunno, but loan me Math or Hiro, and I’ll thoroughly study this to find out.
Do post the results of your study when you’re done. I’m sure all women will benefit from your research.
No no no, that will never do. Your sample size is WAY too small with only two of them. You’re going to need at least twenty, plus a control group, to get any USABLE results :)
That’s easy…They open the mouth, place lips firmly on the abs, then forcefully exhale. The “motorboat” sound is the results of what’s called a bilabial fricative. There’s a number of ways to create a bilabial fricative, one of which is when your blow someone a raspberry (Thhhhb!).
It’s also how an audible fart is made…
If it helps, show your female S.O. these pages. I’ve found they appreciate the fact that we know they like eye-candy, too. I usually get at least a smooch out of a well-timed “Hey, look at this.”
I initially read “SO” as “Superior Officer”. That last sentence read very, very oddly.
He he. So did I. But I was thinking “wow, they really have relaxed regulations in the armed forces more than I thought!” *
* I must hasten to say, my mind would not normally go this way, as I have every respect for the armed forces. It was solely because another comment I had read today (posted on the previous comic):
Heck, when I was in the Navy, we had a bunch of jokes like that floating around anyway. Like this one: “You know how submariners are? 150 men go down & 75 couples come back up.” Or even if you happen to see a submarine in dry dock & say: “It’s in for repairs because a gay Sperm Whale bit it open & sucked out all the Seamen.”
You know…Good clean fun.
O.o
There’s a joke in there somewhere… I’ll let you find it.
No, thank you.
I honeslty don’t know what every(any)one’s problem with Ariana is. If she is supposed to be annoying, it totally flew over my head :| And, her concerns are valid. I mean who in their right mind would want X-men type discrimination and paranoia happen?
Also, did the press-fight appear off-screan? I can’t recall it…
Normally she is kind of annoying. She act like Used-Carsalesman Girl. This comic though shows her more reasonable and human side. I really liked it.
Nope, on screen. At least the end of it.
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1572
That whole “fake bank robbery” thing (plus her massive smugness about it immediately afterwards) is the prinary basis for my dislike of Arianna.
She shows a breath-taking level of irresponsibility about the entire incident (basically ‘I’m Teflon. Nothing Sticks To Me‘). So, situations where it doesn’t all go her way, she has to deal with REAL problems and/or she maybe even learns something new, are all more than OK by me.
Arianna did have some…difficulties…with Archon brass about that fake bank robbery. And during the aftermath of the press demonstration too.
It seems that she has missed an important lesson, even up to this point: When “what you want” is in conflict with the real world, the real world will always win.
I think Arianna is interesting. She actually incorporates several roles in the one job. DaveB has lumped together lawyer, public relations, human resources, marketing, financing, political liaison, civilian oversight and management into the one character.
Several of those jobs have negative aspects, and, like many of his characters, Dave has given her negative character traits to round her out. So she actually has a lot of depth and potential to her character. In addition to a lot of scope for folks to dislike her, and some of the things she stands for.
However those roles also have very many important aspects to them too. And the fact that Arianna wears so many hats means that even though Dave is not planning on featuring her much, she will inevitably have to crop up fairly often. Simply because there are dozens of characters in the superheroes, military, espionage and police roles. And just her representing ‘everything else’.
I think that Dave will have to watch out for one thing. Arianna is rather like Cordelia, in Buffy the Vampire Slayer. She is set up as the ‘character that everybody loves to hate’, who is ideal to say the unpleasant things, that either need to be said, or that make a funny contrast to the heroic ideals around her.
However, because she also represented some positive traits, such as always speaking truthfully, with no hypocrisy, there was much to like about her character. And she grew more and more likeable as time went on.
To the point that the producers and writers realised that they had lost their dark character, because everyone liked her too much! So they then had to introduce a new character to fill that gap in the cast.
“…such as always speaking truthfully, with no hypocrisy…”
Bingo!
Arianna is likable because she’s still honest & non-hypocritical, even in a world where those other traits & professions have corrupted so many others.
Anyone who stands to gain from said X-men type discrimination and paranoia. Countries w/o a large supply of supers would certainly want countries that did to lock them down hard. Hypothetical, and less than hypothetical ‘evil organizations’ would want to foster a sense of persecution re supers, as it would make them a viable alternative/safe harbor against totalitarian/draconian measures. And as our system works, EvilCo(tm) could get laws passed by buying politicians to ensure a climate of mistrust.
The whole fighting-on-live-news thing might help them here, actually. That shows that the rage aura had a definite start, so before that, the various badguys weren’t necessarily under Vehemence’s influence. That’s a start, but what’s really needed is for one of Archon’s magic experts to be able to determine if any of the badguys were under magical influence prior to that, and testify as such. That’s if magic even leaves a residue like that, of course.
Then try to get magic to pass as legitimate evidence in a court of law. People are still probably pretty skeptical at least on that count.
Took long enough for a lot of things we now take for granted to be fully accepted by courts, such as fingerprints and DNA. I don’t see “Magic” being accepted in a hurry, especially by some of the more rteligious judges..
Dabbler and fireballs? Or at least she could prove magic exists.
Do not overlook, archon employs human spellcasters as part of its staff. The point could be argued wether it fits under generic super powers or not, but in the end it seems pretty clear to me that the ARC organisation of old probably had codes of conduct, rules and the like to handle magic users and so on.. in a world like this it seems unlikely at best that there was not some legislation in place at least for what kind of magic the CIA or other high tier goverment organisations can and cannot do with such resources.
As for common place laws.. yeah probably not as ironed out though odds are that’s going to change asap (which for courts still means too darn slow)
Remember that Judges start out as lawyers. Let that sink in for a bit. Now ask yourself, how many law students did well in math, science or introductory logic?
It is sad but a very high percentage of Judges do not understand or accept grade school level science or math over the word of Law Enforcement [they used to be called peace keepers at one time]. Scary isn’t it?
Very minor nitpick. While most jurisdictions require their judges to be lawyers, not all do. New York still has many Justice Court judges, many of which are not lawyers. And there are no requirements defined at all for a US Supreme Court Justice.
Whether this is a good thing or not…
Personally I feel that it is. I have worked in an industry which had statutory powers to self-regulate. So they ran what essentially amounted to courts, which tried any transgressors of industry rules. All the members of the panels that oversaw these ‘trials’ (in all but name) were drawn from that industry.
The result of this was that, whilst justice was served to a certain extent, I was appalled at the laxity of punishment for what would, when compared to other crimes, have a considerable jail sentence involved. Likewise, thanks to cronyism and old-boy networks, a lot of cases got swept under the carpet and no true justice was served.
So I think it right that non-lawyers should be amongst the judiciary. They do not have the baggage of being drawn from part of the industry they work in. So there will be less chance for ‘doing a favour for an old mate’.
Further, it is not necessary for a judge to know the legal issues. That is the lawyers job. They must inform the jury (when one is involved) and if the judge does not understand a legal point then it is perfectly right that he speak up and ask clarification. If he did not get it, then you can be sure members of the jury did not either.
And, likewise for cases without a jury. Judging the merit of an argument can be performed by anybody of reputable background, who is open minded enough to listen to the arguments. I can see that a lawyer might well not be able to see the wood from the trees.
Plus, if a lawyer has worked her way up as a prosecutor, she will have an inherent bias that way. Whereas those from the other side of the court have theirs. A lay judge will not have that baggage to deal with.
“Remember that Judges start out as lawyers.”
It should also be pointed out that, in USA Law, a judge is NOT required to be a lawyer first. There is a significant minority of judges on the bench right now that never were lawyers. It has to do with early American history that for the first judges couldn’t become lawyers until America first established its own Bar Association; until that time, the only accredited lawyers were from the British Bar Association, if not a similar organization somewhere else in Europe.
Since the Constitution specifically forbids Federal Officials that hold foreign titles of any kind (& England’s Bar Associates hold the noble title of Esquire), those with foreign law credentials were forbidden to sit on the Bench. This is why an American judge does not need to be a lawyer as a qualification.
Wow, ‘something new every day’. I am an esquire, but I did not realise that when I pop through my wormhole, to the wild west, I should be discreet about that, if I did not want to imply I was a barrister.
Thanks bud, you might have saved me from being tarred and feathered! And, trust me, that plays merry hell with the fur!
In accordance with the Constitution, you could still hold a government position, if you officially renounce all foreign titles & advantages/privileges thereof.
;)
However, having dual (or multiple)-citizenships while in government is likewise forbidden by law…Citizenship IS a title that carries tangible benefits, such as legal rights, privileges & protections while in that country. Then look again how many of our own real-life Officials have such a number of citizenships & get away with it.
It is more than just that, officially magic has not been recognised. The entirety of the press conference was about super powers. Fortunately the aggro aura probably is a super-power, as opposed to a magic spell*.
So, whilst it may be harder to convince people that unseen super powers are real, that can be done in fairly small steps. First you point at the flying super heroes who can summon flaming death on demand.
Pretty hard to deny the existence of those. Then you point out the tangible results of the aura (or other invisible power that is being disputed). Such as cops starting to attack each other inexplicably. It is not a terribly hard sell.
Of course, the issue of whether strongly religious judges might hold that all super powers are demonic magic granted by the devil, now that is another problem completely.
* That is the impression I get anyhow, I have no idea what conclusions may have been drawn in the comments, whilst I was off on my holidays and unable to keep up with the discussions.
I like how the mohawk guy in the first couple of panels phases out of what Max is explaining to eavesdrop on Arianna’s convo with Sydney.
By the looks of that parking lot it seems like they have some super with the ability to restore places to their original condition…
Looks like it may actually be a different parking lot. That would make sense to me, they’d get away from the combat zone to deal with this stuff.
It is probable the parking lot where the press,because Suzi News and Arianna are there
With potential broken gas and electrical lines in the ground and building this is probably a good idea.
original condition? You mean jungle foliage and tar pits? :3
I suppose theoretically, Max could restore an area to it’s “original” condition: space vacuum & dust particles…
I believe he’s the “not evil beautician who just showed up because his friend asked”. Also, one of my favorites of the group so far.
He is wise to do so. The things they are saying will stand him in good stead, when he is seeing his lawyer.
Not that it matters, as that guy is likely innocent, but hopefully she will learn to be a bit more circumspect about where she holds such conversations in future. Especially when the press are nearby making live broadcasts.
The things she is saying need to be said. But she, of all people, should know the risk of it coming out the wrong way, at the wrong time. Such as being quoted by the defence lawyer in a multi-defendant super trial.
Poor Arianna.
This is definitely the worst case scenario as far as PR, but I’m surprised that Sydney is siding with the villains given she has plenty of reason to believe they were not being affected mentally by Vehemence until he was already at high power.
Naa, Maxima has a past history of flattening mosques. There is potential for waaay worse, yet to come.
“ONE mosque! And it was an accident! Mostly…”
And now one steak house. Which in certain states is also a sacred shrine.
Let’s be fair about this…Maxima was NOT the one to flatten the restaurant. She just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time for that.
;)
That seems to be her defense on the missing mosque as well.
We have no established, observed facts on the details of that incident…That’s what makes it a “Noodle Incident.” All we have is her claim that it was an “accident.”
;)
:)
This point is still under contention, though. Sydney only knows that for the entire time she was looking for the aura, it was there. She knows there was a certain point after which it started to definitely affect her, but as has been noted, V’s ability to affect others may have increased the entire time.
The point is, there’s a lack of solid data about V’s aura, and that lack plays to the defense’s advantage, not the prosecution’s.
Well long time reader/lurker, never posted before but I’m a firearms collector and historian and can offer a little insight into the whole “wet storage ammunition” thing. First off any moisture is bad for ammunition. Ideal storage is a coo, dry place. Storage in a moisture rich environment, or actually IN water is a bad thing.
First and foremost is the primer seal. The little round thing on the back of a bullet that makes the whole thing go bang. Certain military grade ammunition has a sealant that is put in place over the primer, but even that is not 100% reliable. Moisture degrades the primer and when that happens you pull the trigger, the gun goes click and there is no bang.
On the other hand perhaps the primer makes it through the moisture and still functions properly. But the gunpowder in the casing becomes compromised. If that happens you could run into one of the more dangerous situations called a “squib” round. All this means is that when you pull the trigger, the primer detonates. The force of the primer is enough to get the bullet out of the casing and started down the barrel. However, without the gunpowder ignition to help accelerate the bullet, the bullet is now lodged inside the barrel and causing an obstruction. If this situation is noticed, realized and taken care of, well it’s little more then a nuisance, could mean damage to the barrel rifling.
However, if it’s not noticed (Say for instance in the case of firing 30+ rounds in a fully automatic firearm) the next bullet fired meets the obstruction, gas and air from the fired round has no place to go and you now have a catastrophic explosion and a gun that is blown apart and hopefully has not taken anyones fingers or worse with it.
*Re-reads wall of text and coughs*
TL;DR? Getting ammo wet isn’t ideal. But if you drop it in a puddle and dry it off, it won’t really do too much unless you’ve got some structural compromise somewhere in the casing or the primer pocket. Picking a bullet out of the edge of a lake that’s been there since the 50’s though? Yeah that could cause problems.
Welcome out of the shadows. And thanks for the info. Don’t worry about the ‘wall of text’, it was interesting, and I have done far more, and am not alone in that. Albeit that I am the most frequent culprit.
*looks sheepish*
+1
I don’t know what you know about those of us with ADHD. But when we do start to focus on something it has our undivided attention. This occurs generally with topics or situations that we have a true interest in, i.e. gaming for hours on end, favorite subject at school, and in this case saving the world.
*Dangles a fluffy piece of string, up and down* Look, pretties!
DaveB has given us much insight, as have various members of our community.
See the string twitch and twirl!
Sorry, I was sleepy. Had I not been, hopefully I would have resisted going for the joke, given that it followed on from a serious comment. Which we do appreciate. Thanks for sharing.
*attempts to discreetly use hind-paw, to push the string, under a carpet*
Yeah for max effectiveness you really need to put something shiney on the end of it. But what Jozef said is very true. Many people with ADD (myself included) can focus so intently the rest of the world fades away. One of the theories of why ADD would survive evolution is that it was a great advantage for tracking animals. Trackers have been valuable for millennia even today.
So, by the last panel there, Arianna has learned an important lesson about reality: Life is what happens to you while you’re making other plans.
;)
Even better IMHO:
“How do you make God laugh?
Tell Him your plans”.
Or even, “Go tell Murphy what you’re planning.”
:)
8-)
As you probably know, the original idea of “Murphy’s Law” was to encourage designers to prevent things going wrong, by good design.
Unfortunately, there are limits to your foresight and no limits to the idiocy your designs will face.
Obligatory quote:
“A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools” – Douglas Adams.
Its not like they will have much choice in the end about releasing them again. The effectiveness of Vehemence’s aura was directly demonstrated on live TV.. so i doubt the captured Supers would need a very good lawyer to get off on account of temporary insanity or something like that.
yes it was demonstrated, so you can see the beginning and the end. what before it? before it his aura is irrelevant.
Whilst there is a reasonable possibility that it was in effect earlier, it remains very relevant. If it can be proven that it was not used earlier, then you are right. Otherwise, there is a big legal headache. See the vein beginning to throb in Arianna’s head? You will.
Your missing the point then. Its is very relevant because people cant see if its active or not.. and there are direct evidence of V being able to make civilians attack each other.
Actually, only Sydney actually saw the aura…But everyone in the area saw (& felt) the effect of it.
Ariana was fighting with the reporter.
if that part was on camera then we know when it begins and ends.
that’s what i meant when i said it was demonstrated.
also, the hair dresser was the only one that stopped fighting without being knocked out.
if he can surrender then anyone could, but they didn’t.
“if he can surrender then anyone could”This is without basis. We have no idea of how intensely different individuals are effected. Super Hiro and Stalwart are seasoned, experienced super heroes, and failed to resist. Sydney is inexperienced, yet when she was exposed to the full force of Vehemence’s power (with them both in the force field), she did not succumb to it.
It is wholly unfair to say that just because one person can resist an effect, that another person was at fault for failing to.
Note that we know, for example, that some people are ‘highly suggestible’ and can easily be hypnotised (in the real world). Yet others are highly resistant.
there are different results cause there are many variables to the equation.
sydney, when exposed was awake and AWARE of the aura, which made her resist more.
hair dresser was confused, therefore easier target.
that’s why i consider hair dresser as “the weakest link” of the aura theory.
Your points are fair and well made. But do not contradict mine, which I stand by.
cause he just so happens to have “mind effect immunity”… sure….
but to be fair, i can’t find him
https://davebarrack.deviantart.com/art/GP0277-Aura-Fight-Closeup-501816279
so i guess the possibility is there.
Not sure why, but the pattern on Arianna’s shirt reminds me of the outfit patterns you could get for City of Heroes characters.
*hugs*
Shh, it is still too raw to talk more. But you are in the right community here. We can grieve our loss together.
Random question: Haram, cold she train to have yet another iteration body? Like having one body engage in multiple sparring sessions at once in several places? sec1- vs Hero at the park, sec2-vs enville in some dojo.. while wearing some heavy armour. So she both train in rapidity, volume & processing..
If she does this with the body she double crossing them with, she’ll have an easier time not getting caught.
Yes, that’s part of what makes Harem so knowledgeable. Each body provides it’s own input into the person that is Harem, meaning she is capable of learning/experiencing/doing up to 5 things at once, so up to 5 times as rapidly as a normal human. And each body can have its own configuration at the time, so one might be weighed down in armour, while another could be in zero G, for example.
but as we have seen, if the experience is strong and sudden enough, all of them will answer.
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/389 – “dirty move”
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/402 – “reflex”
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/524 – “dodge”
and since all 5 bodies share the same mind
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/572 – “mass hysteria”.
and if she makes the “other” bodies disappear, those that stay are made stronger somehow
it was explained at some point, but 4 links lin a single comment are enough.
“…those that stay are made stronger somehow…”
That would be in Dabbler’s Science Corner #2: https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1302
She’s limited to a maximum of five at the moment, but that’s due to her current power level rather than an inherent limitation of the power. Undoubtedly at some point she’ll ‘level up’ and be able to manifest a sixth instance, but there’s been no indication of when that might be or how long it is since she ‘leveled up’ from four to five.
Each instance starts out the same, and she then customises them as she goes along (I think ‘Thing 1‘ is closest to stock condition). There wouldn’t be anything to stop Harem-6 being customised in the same way as Harem-5, besides boredom at having two of the same.
The downside is that having more instances active means less power (and attention) in each one. At some point you run into diminishing returns, where the gain from the extra iteration is outweighed by the cost to the others of running it.
My thinking was that that was why she can’t currently have num 6, she has to be mentally capable to juggle the different inputs, and have the physical resources to support a body at current strength.
So.. Training.
Dave
I think that should read “I think the font I used for Max’s gravelly voice…”
not “I thing the font I used for Max’s gravelly voice…”
Ari can actually use the outbreak of non-super violence to make her point.
It makes it clear it wasn’t a “supers are violent” incident, but a “people are violent when someone’s using violence-inducing mojo on them” incident.
And sure, if Vehemence had targeted an NRA rally and people were shooting all over the place the aftermath would have included people saying “See? This is why we need stricter gun control!” But those are almost exclusively the folks who would have been saying that anyway.
So really, what ARCHON should be doing is keeping an eye on who decides to take advantage of the super demographic’s moment of apparent legal weakness. It’ll tell her who to watch out for later.
He could have been running the aura at lower power, and only turned it up at that point. But that’s a moot distinction to draw: the evidence of Arianna and Suzie shows that there was a definite increase over a definite time period.
Under advice of counsel, I can neither confirm or deny that I commented on today’s comic.
You’ve already got the evidence stacked against you on that point…
;)
I was only commenting because I was under the influence of a third party who was making me comment and therefore can not be held legally responsible for my actions.
(ARC and local law enforcement are going to have SO much trouble with this argument in the future. Heck, even some of the brighter kids are going to start claiming that a bad guy MADE them take the cookies out of the cookie jar.)
When I was a kid I tried that with my mother. Didn’t work…
Children have no right to a trial with their parents, and reasonable doubt goes out the window. Your mother was judge, jury, and executioner. Always throw yourself on the mercy of the court.
Well, mums are far less easily swayed by legal mumbo-jumbo than a court. Besides, mothers have an inherent “lying little brat detector” ability. :)
Well, in my house, there’s no democracy. Only a dictatorship. ;p
Being a civilian, Sydney might not know this, but ammunition for several heavy weapons, Mini-guns, chain-guns, tank shells, etc. are stored in a large bucket, and that’s called a “well.” So Ariana’s metaphor “a bottomless well of ammunition” is an apt and accurate one.
Most people automatically equate “well” with water, but there are other types of wells. An oil well, comes to mind also.
Heh, nice irony.
Not irony. Lead-y.
Brassy.
Coppery.
Depleted uraniumy.
Mercury…ry.
binary napaly
i thought that was TRI-nary?… you know: Chocolate, Strawberry and Vanilla
The point, Arianna, is that Suzie – ie The Press – was ALSO effected by those “mind fingers.” She has to explain her actions as well, in other words she’s going to be on your side in getting the spin right.
I don’t think her telling people how some guy totally turned her into an out of control rage zombie is going to detract from the public fearing that there are some people out there who can just grab some extremely powerful super’s mind and make them level a city which was Arianna’s PR worry: That the public would see supers as WMD’s sitting around where some mind controller could just switch them on as needed so they would start jumping on nasty anti-super-freedom bandwagons and such out of fear.
IF the cameras were off or aimed oddly during the rage incident (the guy filming with it being a rage zombie you would think it would be used as a bludgeoning device or dropped to the ground) maybe there isn’t much film to fire the public’s imagination but there is more than one reporter plus crew who would have to agree…
Arianna gave exactly the second peice of perfect ammo should the smart ones land in jail / they complain to the right people. Now I really wonder what the super villain version of her looks like? And if (s)he’s anywhere near as awesome / super hax, as IRL super villanous lawyers [shared last comic via the cracked.com links].
__________
Oh and the Klingon tun qolqoS nga’chuq (sp?) was pretty sweet I guess when Ari and Susan were going at it. Although I’ll admit I was more drawn to Vemmy’s less soft version of “kissing” … I wonder if that’s be a Klingon Pay-per-View event. It’d make whoever out sourced it what evers higher than trillions.
Yeah, and especially the part with Arianna & Suzy would probably be very profitable on Klingon Pay-per-View…
Very much so. It’d probably be more Klingon Meme worthy than kittens with spikes.
So, all this time, I’ve been watching lots and lots of free Klingon porn for most of my life. No wonder we’re such perverts.
Interesting note. Police can ticket or arrest anyone at any time for any reason.the legal system is what gives you the record, not the police. The police are also not judges so they are in the position of enforcement not interpretation.
These supers damaged a building, and attacked people. they get transported to the station and processed. End of story. No pr needed. If a judge wants to do something pr-ish that’s up to them. Archon was designed as a police force. They need to act like one.
This is why pr isn’t allowed in the field. Police PR is Damage Control.
“Interesting note. Police can ticket or arrest anyone at any time for any reason.the legal system is what gives you the record, not the police.”
Actually, not entirely true. As I mentioned on the other page, I worked a job for several years running criminal background checks. The records had several potential parts (name might vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction):
Arrest: If the police formally arrested you. Included what they arrested you for.
Indictment: If the DA chose to charge you. What you were officially charged with when sent in front of the judge.
Prosecution: What you were actually tried for if it went to trial (so you might initially be charged with murder but be tried for involuntary manslaughter. This would also include the verdict.
Sentence: What sentence you received if guilty.
But the point is, the arrests showed up (sometimes as far back as the 40s if the jurisdiction had converted the records) even if the DA never decided to prosecute.
“Interesting note. Police can ticket or arrest anyone at any time for any reason.the legal system is what gives you the record, not the police.”
Actually, not entirely true. As I mentioned on the other page, I worked a job for several years running criminal background checks. The records had several potential parts (name might vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction):
no, it IS entirely true.. the cops CAN haul you in any time they want to, for whatever reason they deem necessary to put on the required paperwork to do so…whether or not it can actually be legitimized and have you sent up to prison is an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT matter and is subject to laws, lawyers, trials, common sense, public opinion, etc… but that did NOT STOP the cop from hauling you in in the FIRST PLACE… it was the LEGAL SYSTEM that “should” get the truly innocent off, and catch the guilty.
Yes! For once my prediction turned out to be correct!
Actually, I’m surprised no one has mentioned this but Sydney actually used her vision orb a few times throughout the fight and didn’t see an aura untill vehemence activated it late into the fight. this means she can testify to it that the villians were acting on their own accord/under peer pressure at worst. Normal people say stuff like ‘why did I even go along with this stupid plan’ tons and they’re not under any magical coerceon, merely greed/boredom/peer pressure/etc.
And yes, at the very least the supers should be arrested untill this can all be sorted out with the option for them to serve community service at ARC. As far as I understand in this story there isn’t a lot of precendent for supers going to jail yet. Ariana is going to be busy lol.
It could be argued that V did something to them BEFORE the fight which enough after effect to keep them fighting even when he wasn’t using his field.
ah I was just too late with this point. She saw there was no aura previously
Did she?
She started studying her truesight orb specifically to see if she could get some more information.
You’re basically saying, she had a telescope with thermal imaging capability. She used the telescope several times. She would have seen the fire, had there been one.
I’m saying, she had to turn the “thermal imaging feature” on first, and did so, to discover the aura.
What others are saying is, Vehemence may have “pushed” a bit with the aggro aura to pump up his would be recruits. Make them aggressive just as he’s been drawing their mind toward taking down the “super pigs”. He didn’t need to even fill a room with the aura before this, (at least not until a final rally speech just before going down there, to “remind” everyone who might have been having second thoughts), and we don’t know if it’s one he “developed” during the fight, or just another ace he kept tucked away.
You think he personally got in the vicinity of every one of these people and exerted mental influence to get them to show up? No way. Vekter made the calls, Vehemence wasn’t anywhere near these guys until they showed up ready to fight. They’re at least guilty of conspiracy.
Maybe. He said he let Vekter think he was in charge but in a couple of places he heavily implied he at least called the ring leaders within the group to get the ball rolling. All he would have to do is just be “helpful” to the “leader” Vekter. Don’t know why it matters who called since his powers don’t work over the phone. (I hope… ) The question is did they come to a central meeting area to discuss exactly what they were doing and whatever passes for strategy with a pick up group and so Opal could then open a large portal for them all to come through at once (or a lot of portals timed to send them simultaneously). It makes the most sense that the would do so if only to make sure they got to the target all at once so as not to give too much of a chance for the enemy to see them coming.
If there was a brief meeting before rock and rollah time then V could mingle solidifying their aggressive resolve to attack (or just throw a weaker wave through the whole room while Vekter talked) while they find out exactly what they were going to do.
Being anti-whatever types, criminals and “nut jobs” themselves it might not have been impossible to convince them of the need for some serious vagueness for the reason of the meeting until they showed up at the secure area to hear it in person. Or they could claim that.
I’m not sure what the charge is for agreeing to go to a meeting to talk about things they thought “might” be illegal but didn’t actually have any words in the discussions leading up to it that proved for sure that it would be.
I’m sure if ARCLIGHT takes their time digging around they might find the witnesses etc… to show that they were slanted this direction and likely went there because they hoped it would lead to something illegal but I don’t know if they could prove they knew for sure it would. And then they have to do that for every last one of them separately. We will probably be hearing about the clean-up and legal fall-out of this first fight for the rest of the comic…
Don’t forget that guy who gave up, the hairdresser who was just there because his buddies were; https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1420
or “Hex” who didn’t know why she was there; https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/1384
Seems to me like the fog was clearing.
How do you prove in a court of law that basically: the witness saw through her crystal ball that some guy cast a magic spell on someone else and made him do something against his will?
The current court system and CSI is designed to handle physical evidence, not metaphysical evidence.
And even then they get it wrong more times than not. ie DNA evidence solely used to convict – yes your honor only one in a million would be a match – Objection, the bay area alone has a population of 7 million and the US is over 300 Million. So where are the other 300 plus matches?
As for CSI – That is to Forensic Science as Star Trek Next Gen is to Theoretical Physics.
Offcourse, a full DNA profile is way more accurate than 1 in a million
Sydney used her vision orb in its normal mode to detect illusions. It was not until she fiddled with the orb and found its “detect magic” setting that she was able to see the aura. So no, her earlier scans wont rule out that he might have been using a (presumably) weaker version of the aura earlier in the fight.
Not exactly. Vehemence could have used his aggro aura localized to convince people to go in the first place.
Also, she had to flip a specific rune (button) on her ball to see the aura in the first place. She hadn’t done that until the point where she did, so she would not have seen the aura even if it was there all along
Sydney only learned she could see the Aggro Aura after trying other switches on the Com Ball. She didn’t know it had that ability until later in the fight so even she can’t testify as to when the Aggro Aura was first used.
Ah, right, yes, you are all very correct, all 5 of you :D
heh anyways regardless of that little er, point, the aggro aura, even when pumped up, immediately ceased to effect anyone the second it turned off. This of course does not discount any OTHER unknown tricks he may have used but at that point it’s purely guessing.
There is also the fact that when he presumably activated his aura the effects were ALSO instant (the er, klingon kisses for example) so based on that I would discount a low level aura unless again he has an aura that only effects people already predisposed to hostility that only effects them.
Honestly however many great NORMAL men throughout history have been able to incite far more violence through sheer charisma with no magical aura. It could purely come down to vehemence just being very charismatic or manipulative as it could perhaps be the green haired guy (Forget his name) that thought he organised everything.
Nah, he doesn’t need a bunch of separate aura effects. A “dimmer switch” on the one he has shown at high levels could account for all sorts of LEVELS of effect.
Levels:
1) May appear mildly irritated. When thinking about solutions to problems or answers to questions the most violent ones pop up on their mental view screen first but they can move on to other ideas if they want to.
2) Personality becomes Aggressive and Forceful. Violent ideas start popping into their heads unbidden. When a question or problem comes up they will 98% of the time go with a violent answer/solution unless a trusted person talks them down carefully. (which would require them to be unaffected somehow). A lot of things start looking like problems needing a “solution”
3) Extremely aggressive and forceful. All thoughts are tinged in violence or segue quickly to a related violent thought. Will now actively seek out nearest enemy, even ones they sort of buried the hatchet with previously, to channel all of this need for violence. Anyone (or anything) who gets in the way will very likely be attacked. Definition of getting in the way is very loose.
4) Violence Zombie. Attacks nearest living target (ally or foe), preferably sentient, but if none is available just starts destroying random stuff.
_______________________
And since its a dimmer switch there could be any number of levels in between as needed. According to Dave you get some resistance if you know something is messing with your mind though so that would bump you down a level or two depending on your will and amount of exposure I guess.
Likely Vehemence would only have access to 1 or maaaaybe 2 before powering up at the big fight.
+1
Vehemence also said that HE convinced Vector that the plan was all Vector’s idea.
Considering the paranoia surrounding gun owners, supers were never going to be trusted. As for ammo storage. https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/ZAA-250
And yet its Arianna’s job to roll that boulder up a hill anyway. She is starting with getting people to see them as people and then people who are just as likely to want to live their lives as commit crime. Especially with a police force on par with or well above their abilities to hold them to the law. Having that entire police force (ARCSWAT being the face of ARC after all) quickly turned into a weapons of convenience by the big bad supervillain with strength equal to Maxima (that’s sort of what it looks like on tape anyway) is going to do serious damage for the public’s willingness to believe in that last part.
Its a pretty rough day and just really bad luck that they right away come up against a super with so many powers or sub powers that he had one of their major weaknesses on tap: Mind Altering or Control powers. But its a good wake up call for the ARCies that they need to get lost of countermeasures to these sorts of effects and have at least one (if the teams small) or preferably several with lots of active defenses going at all times so somebody is with it enough that they can set off the other countermeasures in the plan.
Why are they discussing the fact that the supers might have been under Vehemence’s influence?
Sydney could see the aura with her Truesight orb, and when she used it to pop over and say hello to V before he revealed himself there was no aura visible. Yes, her illusion-self does not have true sight, but the aura would have encompassed the whole battlefield, so real Sydney would have seen it.
Therefore, Sydney knows that the other supers were NOT fighting under V’s influence. Presumably she will remember this and say so on the next page? She may just not have thought about it yet.
Not necessarily. She had to specifically activate the aura vision power. She wouldn’t have seen the aura before as she didn’t specifically use aur-o-vision before when talking to/looking at V.
Plus she doesn’t have Harem’s abilities so whatever her actual self sees when using an illusion may be more of an afterthought or peripheral thing to her awareness unless she consciously switches her focus back and forth looking for something. We don’t even know if it will do both at once.
And then there is the idea of manipulation at any of the initial planning or arrival stages prior to Sydney being on the scene. Once they were involved in combat V would probably not need to aura them to keep them fighting. He chose people clearly predisposed to fight authority to some extent. Except for some extra tagalongs anyway.
Because this aura was just one thing Vehemence did. He also did a lot of other things. We know he has power to incite violence + we know he has lots of different powers. It’s possible that he has a way of mind control that is much subtler than the everybody-fight aura.
After Max’s demonstration and Vehemence existence I think we may see a ‘Marvel Civil War’ level of metahuman registration bill pass (at least some of press will press on that bill) :P
I express support for the point you press for in parenthesis. The first part though won’t be happening in this comic. That is not DaveB‘s scene, and the press conference made it plain that is not the way the current administration are handling things. Plus Dave has spoken to that effect.
Besides which Marvell have done that scene to death. It is is a tired path, and one that does not have merit. That way lies repression and civil war, not justice and harmony.
Maybe they will pass laws making everyone register and submit bio data like alergies, past diseases, implants, blood types and such for their own safety (and perhaps for government run universal healthcare insurance) and then just segue over to the idea that as a physical trait that might affect their treatment any body with powers should also register them. Then it looks like favoritism of some sort to the public if they don’t register their powers as they are registering everything else right along side everyone else.
We are all probably gonna be chipped (for “convenience”) some day anyway… (I wonder how many cries of “Mark of the Beast” will go up on that fine day? or will it be so gradual nobody even realizes?)
They regularly chip dogs and cats, it’s possible with people, the powers that be just need a good enough
pretextmarketing wheeze to get us to accept something like this. Just like ‘black boxes’ put in cars, to save on motor insurance.No, that’ll never happen.
I would die before that happened. And I would not be alone.
huh, i figured you’d go for the Demolition Man route and all those people living in the sewers, and covered over remains of old SanAngeles… the ones that DIDN’T have a chip in their hands to be allowed to do ANYTHING in the above ground society.
You could always ‘borrow’ someone else’s chip, with a machete.
People who think like you is why we will end up with a whole bunch of chips capable of monitoring if we are alive and for signs of tampering so they can deactivate.
For each oppressive action there is a violent reaction.
Nope. I would fight the implementation of such chips into society. Either in a patchwork fashion, where companies would be permitted to chip their staff and require such in order to work there. Likewise banks or other firms only providing goods and services to individuals who agreed.
Or in the form of nation-wide enforcement, in the style of a national identity card.
I would use every legal means at my disposal to challenge that. But, if that failed, I would be perfectly willing to take up arms to fight it literally. And would press the fight until it was either abandoned or I died.
Better dead than living in a society like that.
In the end it will be the “convenience” that dooms us all. As it has so many times before.
VERY “mark of the beast” type stuff. Spooky. “Then the beast shall make it that no man, free or slave can buy or sell, save those who wear the mark of the beast on their foreheads or on their hands…”
I am very proud that, as an Englishman, my word is my bond. If I tell somebody who I am, I am not obliged to hand over a document proving that. It may make a given situation more convenient to do so, but it never rises above that.
I am not required to provide, nor even own, a passport. Nor any other form of identity card. The closest to that is a driver’s licence, but I would only need that if I chose to drive on the public highway. So that is an option I have.
And, even if I opt to get one, I can choose to leave it at home. If a traffic cop asks me to show it, there is no legal obligation for me to have it. I am entitled to go to a police station, at a time convenient to me, and offer proof as to my identity.
Whether or not somebody else wants to have documentary proof, in order to provide goods or services, is a matter of their own choice. I can choose to go elsewhere for those.
Or if they are in a monopoly position, I can decide to have a reputable person confirm my identity. Should the provider refuse to accept that, the courts will support my side of the case. This has been confirmed in court.
The British Public are extremely anti identity cards. Whilst we permitted it in World War II, as a security measure, due to a clear and present danger. It was abolished thereafter. And successive attempts to re-introduce it have met failure time and time again.
But, even that falls short, by an order of magnitude, on the impingements on our rights that would be imposed by implanting chips in us!
“…as an Englishman…”
Don’t you mean “an English dog?” Albeit with a strong appearance of a German Shepard?
Yorp,
Of course, it’s becoming increasingly difficult to maintain that sort of principled stance:
Want to open a bank account? Photo ID.
Move house? Try signing the papers without ID.
Internal flight? Still need a passport.
Problem with Paypal? They reserve the right to… can you guess? “Please scan your Photo ID…”.
It’s not about convenience any more. It’s about avoiding mega-hassles in your everyday interactions. If many organisations insist on it (invoking ‘money-laundering’, ‘security’, etc.), how many people will resist?
I assure you that the authorities are perfectly willing to take my solicitor’s word on my identity. She is above reproach. To suggest otherwise would open them to charges of libel or slander.
Whilst banks may ask for a photo ID, they are obliged by law to accept other forms of identification, where circumstances demand it. So somebody with neither passport, nor drivers licence, cannot be required to provide that.
This is the England we are talking about. I have to annually travel the width of England (literally, to the furthest Westerly point, from pretty much the furthest Easterly), and it is still more convenient to go by car, coach or train than by plane.
For online services though, you are right that things are getting more difficult. Especially with heavily enforced money laundering and anti-terrorist legislation. But there are ways to conduct online business without a passport. And any company which only allows that will loose a lot of business. Because a lot of people do not have one.
Please bear in mind though that I do not advocate the right to anonymity. There are certain facts which banks, and other organisations handling financial transactions, are obliged to ascertain. And I am happy to provide them. Offering verifiable proof as to my identity, address and the legality of any financial transactions I am making.
But it is not necessary to have a national identity card to do that. And it sure as hell isn’t necessary to have a chip implanted in you. No matter how convenient that would be to international finance, anti-terrorism, government repression and death squads.
Ahem, not trying to cast aspersions on anyone’s solictors. Just an anecdote from someone I know (and it’s possible they might not have known each other for very long, I didn’t ask), so I won’t argue that one.
And, OK. I’ve never felt the need to fly up to Scotland from the South, but it is still the method of choice for some.
*Tap, tap* Hmm, Gatwick to Edinburgh, 50 quid… No! Carbon footprint etc.! *more tapping* Christ! Off-peak return train fare: £250! *falls off chair*
I didn’t say it was impossible (I know it is possible). Just mucho hassle. You’ll need a person of sufficient standing to attest for you, and they like to charge for doing it.
Yea, the Scotland point is well made. And I have never been there, as a result. Back in my interrailing days, it was a far more realistic prospect to travel round the rest of Europe, for a month, than it was to do that trip by train. Which I did, several times.
But Scotland is not England! *
:-P
* But, even so, you can cross the border without a passport. ;-)
Mind control creates trust issues !?!
For real???
Whoa, my mind is blown…
Top notch Arianna, top notch…
Technically, V’s aggro-aura was a form of emotion control, not mind control…
Seriously speaking, depending on what kind of drugs a person uses, shuffling around some natural chemicals produced by the body itself can throw a person into a particular mood. In truth, medicines like what Sydney has to treat her ADHD do exactly that.
I almost agree with you.
It’s well documented that drugs were being used in recent conflicts in Africa that made “normal” people behave like true animals.
Still they didn’t behave like that with their “allies” but with their enemies/victims.
No matter how pissed they were, making Hiro punch Stalwart on the nuts has to involve some kind of mind control, either that or there is some really nasty unfinished business between the two.
Once anger goes beyond a certain point, it becomes blind uncontrollable rage. That is how powerful Vehemence’s aggro aura had become, by the end of the fight. He had dialled it all the way up to “HULK” setting.
Seriously, you do not need mind control at that point. That is smash whatever is in your face level.
I have even known an otherwise good man, to get into such a rage (arguing with his girl-friend), that he punched her, in the face. He immediately snapped out of it, and begged her forgiveness. But the act had been done. In a moment of blind rage.
It took them a long time to re-establish trust. With him being suitably contrite and rage-free from then on. And they got married, last year. But she will never be completely trusting that he may not Hulk out again, someday. And strike whatever stands in his way.
The big green guy was not an idle invention. He is the personification of one of the darker sides of the human psyche.
Sorry Yorp,
In complete disagreement, I have serious anger issues, never hit a woman.
Know others like me that also never hit women.
Know others like me that did much worse.
A “blood rage” or Berserker rage is achievable and you do get completely blind, but there are specific circumstances to do so and trust me, you don’t just snap off of it.
I LOVE the Hulk, always did, but his behavior is considerable more “considerate” than a truly crazy enraged human.
Unfortunately I do know what I’m talking about.
That darker side, I do know it, hope you never do.
I am a very placid person, who it takes a lot to rile. But, push the right buttons enough, and my temper can snap. Fortunately my response is usually verbally based. So I have a lot of empathy with Sydney’s rants.
But more than one frustrating bit of technology, or infuriatingly badly programmed CD, has been violently smashed or ejected through the window. Luckily never a shut one.
As a child* I have directed that anger at people, under (moderately) justifiable circumstances. And I did snap out of it, in one instance. After the deed was done, mind. And force myself to calm down, gradually, in the other. But I think there is a distinction to be made between the anger, and it’s release, and the ability to snap out, once that has happened. They do not necessarily correlate.
Some folks might immediately drop out of the rage, whereas most, I imagine, will take a while for the anger to run it’s course, or to consciously calm down. And, at the other extreme, you have the natural berserks, who will remain in a destructive rage for a considerable time.
* Thankfully, although I have faced similar circumstances as an adult, where violent action was necessary, although the adrenalin was up, and I was very much feeling the anger, I did not let it overcome me. So was able to keep the action proportionate and aimed to constructive ends.
In one instance requiring stopping at the tipping point, where any further there would be serious repercussions. The opponent, who realised just how close he was, to bearing the brunt of that, could clearly see his fate, and utterly capitulated. Despite having about four inches on me, and a physique like the guys we see above.
I am damned glad that I did not give in to the darker side, though, as I too would have had to face the consequences of the, potentially terminal, act. So your point is very well made, and appreciated.
Plus I do have a friend, who I know to have served time for manslaughter, from before I met him. I understand that he was in a similar situation, and it went the other way. The dividing lines between justifiable homicide for self-defence, manslaughter and murder can be thin at times. And rage can provide push you over that point.
As for the question of striking a woman, I would never condone it,* could never see myself doing it, in even the darkest rage, nor would I forgive myself if I did.
However my friend is a highly honourable man, who holds totally the same opinions. Having one notable difference, between us though, in that he suffers significantly from rage issues.
He has never forgiven himself for what he did. Nor have I. But I do understand how it happened.
* Other than in an act of self-defence, and even then it would need a very clear and present, plus deadly, danger to justify the act.
I do apologize for any misunderstanding.
It was not my purpose to pass judgment, if it felt like so, my sincere apologies.
I’ve been in to many situations to have any kind of moral high ground.
Just wanted to make a point that to go into mindless rage it takes a lot.
Extreme exhaustion, sleep deprivation, drugs and pain are normal ancillaries circumstances.
If you’re able to think and stop your behavior, you simply are not there.
No matter what you may think, you may feel out of control, but if you feel that, you’re not.
Oh no need to, I did not feel a slur was intended. My reply is just one of those things which needs to be said, under such circumstances.
Purely as a point of interest (and because it corroborates your comment about the need for provocation circumstances), his girlfriend did hit him first. Neither he, nor I, consider that sufficient justification for his response though.
As a result he never offered that as an excuse. In fact, I would not even know that it had happened, because he never even mentioned that part. I only found out because his girlfriend mentioned that to me.
That said though, he should have taken the blow like a man, and found some other way to defuse the situation, than hitting her. Most guys are physically bigger, and tougher, than girls, and he is no exception. Plus, in his case, he had many years experience in subduing violent criminals, so he had many options at his disposal.
I see his anger issues in the same way as I would an untreated mental illness. So I have to take that difference into account, if I try to put myself into his shoes. But, unlike insanity, it is not something that the sufferer cannot do something about.
I have worked hard to contain my own anger, as an adult. Helped by knowing that I had lost control, as a child. But, had I seen that I was failing (and he knows he has the issue), I would have sought professional help. Hence the unforgiven part.
So, just for argument sake, what do you do if someone says “Bite me!” ?
Try and figure out what they are actually unhappy about. If I can do that, and fix it, then we can be laughing and having a drink within a couple of minutes.
That said, I have been in the situation where somebody has said something grossly insulting to me. I gave him a back hander, across the face. He bleated about it, to anyone who would listen afterwards. I told them what he said. He promptly got ejected from the cinema and was banned from ever returning.
Technically, what I did was assault. But there are some things that society does not accept. The management were perfectly happy to eject the disruptive person. Whereas I was well known to be a polite customer. My response was considered proportionate to the offence, and a blind eye was turned.
It quite amused me when I saw, the other day, that the Pope has a similar feeling on morality, in such circumstances.
Suzie has a Who’s Who tag! However, I thought it only applied to those who had dialog on the page.
That is the normal rule. In this case though, she both makes an appearance and is referred to by Sydney. So it is wholly appropriate to include her.
Besides which, her look spoke volumes.
And so, several days of internet arguments later, DaveB makes it clear which way he’s going. And everyone moved on with their lives. Lol. Such is the bitter mistress that is internet arguments.
We discuss possible ways this comic can go to kill time, and for fun. Not to try and steer it
Sure, I know. No one was more involved in those arguments than me. It was a self reflective post about the irony of it.
In that case, cary on
The internet is made of arguments. And cats.
Come on, argue with me!
… and mistakes. Should have been a link.
It’s mostly made of porn.
^∪^
And arguments about cats.
And arguments about cat-girl porn.
nah, those aren’t *arguments*…
And about cats v. dogs preferences…
*wags tail and makes puppy-dog eyes*
Sorry, I’m a cat person.
I would ask if you are positive. But I can clearly see that the charge is irrefutable.
*lies down, places paws over snout, and looks dejected*
Jiggawatt is my nemesis…