Grrl Power #1319 – The Full Peggy
Weren’t everyone’s family portraits done under some sort of duress? Usually it’s mom cracking the whip, or sometimes it’s mom and dad, but I never met any kids that were excited to be forced into a collared shirt so you could go rest your arm on that fuzzy saddle thing while mom glared at you to “smile nice.”
Peggy’s foot is attached and functional, but Frix gave Peggy a few instructions like to avoid heavy exercise for the first week, to some toe dexterity exercises, stretch out the muscle, etc. He probably gave her a few pills to help the “seams” in the tissue integrate optimally. Stuff like that. The general tech level of “space” in the Grrl-verse is good, but it’s not “I’ll just run you through the transporter and perfectly re-trans-integrate your missling leg, and also screen out any potential hereditary diseases and also make your hair longer if you want.”
Honestly, I think it’s a missed opportunity in Star Trek that they never dealt with the ethical implications of what you could really do with transporters, like “Oh, you’re 40 pounds overweight? I can transport that away no problem.” which then leads to all kinds of shenanigans. I can fix your fertility issues, I can ensure your baby is perfectly healthy. Runaway gene editing, the pursuit of super soldiers, so called “master races” etc. And don’t tell me transporters can’t do that, they’ve definitely done little tweaks here and there before. Sure, maybe Starfleet transporters aren’t set up to do that, and they probably have a raft of regulations discouraging that sort of behavior, but you’d never convince me that the Founders wouldn’t exploit that stuff, or some obscure alien race wouldn’t do everything they could to become the ultimate warrior species or whatever. And sure, that race would inevitably wind up in a Morlock/Eloi kind of situation, or they’d all devolve or produce incurable cancers and are desperately searching for an exemplar of their race preserved in hypersleep or in a transport buffer so they could do a reset, because a lot of sci-fi writing is a bit predictable, let’s be honest.
It is amusing all the storylines that did spring from transporter technology though, because – and let me be clear that I have no evidence of this, it’s only conjecture – that the whole idea of transporters had nothing to do with a vision of futuristic technology, it was all about keeping productions costs down. A cross-fade with some overexposed static is a heck of a lot cheaper than having to shoot a bunch of miniature and full-sized prop shots of shuttles leaving the docking bay and flying down to a planet. Granted, O.G. Star Trek had like six shots total of the Enterprise that they kept reusing, with the exception of a few episodes like when they fought the doomsday ice cream cone, so they could have economized shuttle footage if they really had to. But I’m still convinced it was about saving money, and also a four second shot of a transporter dis-and-reintegration probably saves more screen time than shuttle launch and landing sequences, leaving more time for interracial and interspecies kissing.
I do think there are limits to some technologies. Handkerchiefs probably have an upper tier. That said, you could keep pumping improvements into a thing until it only superficially resembles its antecedent. Like a hanky that Star Trek-style transports tears and snot into nothingness, but also analyzes all fluids and proactively applies a cure for that corneal cancer that it predicted and also perfectly moisturizes your skin and also leaves your fingers dry and clean but also not so dry that trying to pick up a piece of paper becomes an iffy proposition – and if you unfold the hanky it’s also a portable hole with access to essential survival tools and a pile of Werther’s candies and everything else available from the Warehouse at the End of the Universe so if you get Isekai’d with your hanky, you can blow your nose and cure the Oblivophage and produce a jar of honey because honey is more valuable than gold in the world you got sent to.
So when I say there are limits, I guess I really mean that there are limits to how advanced a thing can be and still be considered that same thing. But it still looks like a hanky. So… people would call it a hanky. At least colloquially. I suspect the Dictionary definition of “hanky” would still be limited to “a square of fabric people blow their nose into then stuff back in their pocket.” Because if you’re living in a world where a hanky is also a wormhole and a tricorder, then imagine what your shoes could do, or your belt, or your everyday carry pocket knife. In a world like that the dictionary would either constrain itself to defining words by their original meanings, or there would be only a single entry that just says, “Look, anything can be anything else and it can all do everything. Form is meaningless. What do you want from me?”
The new vote incentive is up! (Finally.)
I’m revisiting a panel from a recent page, but I included some comic reactions and a few outfit swaps, so hopefully you all enjoy it. I also plussed up the art from the comic version a bit, though I suspect that despite the time I spent on that, not a whole lot of people would immediately notice that, so I’m gratuitously pointing it out here.
Double res version will be posted over at Patreon. Feel free to contribute as much as you like.
Oh boy, you opened a huuuge can of worms with these Star Trek comments! Star Trek lore contains all you mentioned and more from the eugenics war to the point where the whole Klingon race is a result of MASSIVE genmod effort (I mean, they existed, but modified themselves to built like a tank as we see them today). And yeah, in the federation gen mods are pretty much banned (except in cases to cure diseases) but there are dark alley exceptions, most of them rarely work out well – but there are exceptions (ST DSN, Julian Bashir is such a genmod “superhuman”)
Gene-mods in Star Trek are only illegal for humans (because of the trouble Khan and the other augments created).
Other races in ST have gone through that phase in the most sensible of ways, like the Denobulans.
In ST: Enterprise Dr. Phlox commented on this.
Yeah, I wonder why “we can’t do gene-mods without it becoming a world-ending threat” is unique to humans.
Perhaps it’s a comment on human nature. A totally predictable one of course.
They did it once to the end of the 20th century and that didn’t work out so bad that they outlawed it. One data point isn’t enough for a trend.
new canon in SNW is that anyone who joins the federation has to stop doing it even if it’s not been a problem for them
federation didn’t exist yet in ENT so it’s not inconsistent
I could see the Borg highly abusing this technology to advance their species. I’m wondering why I didn’t do it already. Oh wait they did
My personal headcanon on Klingons is that they’re shapeshifters, but deceit and trickery to win a fight isn’t honorable. So they just get together every few decades and decide, “Okay, from now on, we all look like THIS!”
I feel like it’ll be decided through some kind of battle royale though
The cranial ridges are actually an advanced case of herpes.
Well, they were called ‘Space Crabs’ after that whole ‘Space Porto Rican’ mess of the 60’s
The ‘body modding’ transporters? Section 31.
I like the Time Machine reference
I would think some of the teleporters would have been used for pranks first off. I mean who wouldn’t put a ‘kick me’ or “i’m with stupid” tattoo on the back of somebody. Let along the superfluous body parts in obscure places.
Ooop the hijinks run amock
The Asgard from Stargate: SG-1 had similar problem to the Morlock/Eloi one @DaveB portrays.
They’d reached what they saw as an evolutionary deadend and were searching for ways around it.
The main group was looking into both human genetics and a reset using Atavan genes.
Humans found such an Atavan specimen and handede it over to them.
In their extended universe a living Atavan Asgardian was found and introduced to the Pegasus Galaxy Asgard. They’d been using cybernetics to try and overcome the evolutionary deadend.
The way I see it, teleporters’ main function is to record a person’s “pattern” and replicate that exactly in the desired location. While you could “remove that excess body fat” by altering the pattern, screwing up could get as bad as “whoops your lungs aren’t there anymore”.
I’m reminded of a TNG episode where Dr. Pulaski was infected with a disease that caused her to age rapidly. However, the crew found her hairbrush that contained hair from before her infection and was able to use its DNA to “cure” the disease.
“It teleported inside out”
“And then it exploded”
Same here. We need a way to contact DaveB about things like this that doesn’t involve Twitter or Facebook.
Officially Star Trek transporters don’t “replicate” a person’s pattern, but instead transform the matter making up the person into energy, transmit that specific energy to the new location, and reassemble that same energy back into the person it was. That is the official transporter lore.
That then got wildly violated by all sorts of writers for the various Star Trek series over the years because writing an episode where the transporter does a weird thing takes precedence over making it internally consistent.
That’s the first example that comes to mind, and fits with what DaveB is talking about. If they can use the transporter to reverse her early aging, then they can reverse the regular kind too, or take some less vital borg mods out of freed drones. In Voyager they combined alien gene editing, holograms, and transporter tech to transplant Neelix’ lungs.
It has actually been officially stated that transporters were a budget and time saving solution, as opposed to landing the Enterprise or a shuttle (in the Star Trek Encyclopedia, 3rd ed., p. 519 apparently, though I have no way to check). So you are on the money there.
Yes, that was canon for ST:TOS. It was cheaper and faster, and it was easy enough to handwave if you mysteriously didn’t want it available. (Like every 4th episode or so.)
Stated far earlier than even that. There was a book published between the second and third seasons of the original series (making it 1968) titled, appropriately enough “The Making of Star Trek”, the first of a library’s worth of “behind the scenes” books eventually published focusing on that franchise. I can’t cite the chapter, page, paragraph and sentence like “Divides by Zero” has, but I distinctly recall Roddenberry stating that exact reason. Roddenberry went on to note it also functioned to expedite the narrative, using merely seconds to depict the transporter pad and then the destination (and later, often just the destination sequence) rather than potentially minutes showing a shuttle launch, then cruising in space or orbit, finally to a landing shot and then emerging from the craft planetside. Though, I would argue that after showing full sequences in a collection of early episodes, directors later in a season might have felt they could abbreviate the scenes by maybe having a team head for the turbolift on the bridge talking about heading for the launch bay and then the shot fades to them emerging from a landed shuttle. Edited like that, they would be down to a few seconds, ready to get into the meat of the story. I mean, Irwin Allen productions did that kind of thing with the flying sub and later the Jupiter 2’s space pod.
Gotta say, the new invotive is hellacreepy… and not in a good way
My family has a whole bunch of photos of us three kids at Easter, squinting into the full fury of the sun, because Grandpa wanted to make sure the photos were well-lit…
Still occasionally getting 403’d (sometimes posts go through, and then 403’d for about a week)
Ditto same here
When I found I could post using Verizon mobile, but can’t with CenturyLink landline. I have checked blacklists.
403 from nginx
Same here. We need a way to contact DaveB about things like this that doesn’t involve Twitter or Facebook.
In such a world, form isn’t meaningless, it’s fashion. Using the hanky’s portable hole functionality is gauche unless you’re actually in a situation that calls for it somehow.
Soooo … Picard’s hair was a fashion statement or lack thereof?
So this was actually addressed in an interview with Sur Stewart and Roddenberry! Roddenberry said by the 24th century, it’s not seen as a defect or something to correct, it was just something happens to certain humans. It just wasn’t a big deal by the time the big D was flying.
After a while will Peggy want to go back to her prosthetic foot?!?
Only when she goes back to playing Clue as Detective Holmes or D&D, because you know the games afoot? Peg(s) certainly going to have to update her bios in d&d for sure.
I’d guess that her facial scars weren’t fixed as they are seen as cosmetic.
That last episode of Picard really strained transporter ethics. It was a FAFO situation, but still.
If I recall the transporter kept seeing use for budget reasons, but was initially conceived of because the bulk of the shuttle set was going to be delivered several days late and they couldn’t afford to wait until it arrived to keep shooting.
^ This! It could be said handwaving people onto the planet delayed introducing the fancy expensive model a little longer than anyone intended after it finally showed up.
Regarding what you call advanced technology — a prime example of that is the tiny mobile computers everyone carries these days, but call “phones”
Yah they did become rather an internet appliance. It is very long list of physical devices and services that were pretty much obsoleted or integrared, Particularly since it’s connected to the internet and all of its features.
Being an optimistic transhumanist, my vision of the best future for humanity looks like Star Trek with a lot more transhumanism. I am in radical disagreement with the pessimistic portrait sci-fi often makes of transhumanist efforts to improve themselves. I see nothing wrong and a lot of good with using biotechnologies to get rid of a lot of disease, disability, and evolution’s bad turns, and make ourselves as good as peak human potential, the best of the animal kingdom, and optimized biology could make us. It would be no different from what evolution and our own unknowing efforts already made of us (e.g. to make many of us lactose-tolerant in adulthood) and look at the excellent job we made to turn wolves in our best friend. The promise of transhumanism and what Peggy and Cora got in this story is just medicine’s potential fulfilled, a promise made millennia ago when the first shamans started to use herbs to cure infection and disease. Every physician and nurse followed in their footsteps. Humanity’s nature is to change nature. Screw sci-fi pessimism and curse the Nazis for tainting the idea.
You are right that we could approach it in an entirely altruistic and benevolent way, and even then there are some pretty huge ethical quandaries to overcome:
1) Capitalism. If we’re still using this barbaric system to limit access to healthcare in large parts of the world, then suddenly, you have rich people who are genetically superior to poor people, and a wealth gap that is even harder to bridge. Also, it wouldn’t be implausible that certain augmentations will be non-optional if you want to get opportunities, as we see in cybernetics and bio-aug sci-fi.
2) Disease and disability aren’t defined the same way by everyone. To take one that would be hard to “cure” but is a clearer example of the problem – people with autism have both upsides and downsides to autism, and many don’t view it as a disability, but rather as a different way of being that is equally valid. In the same way we don’t consider brown hair a disability because it’s not blonde, or we don’t consider brown skin to… oh wait we are actually super weird about that one. The same is true for some groups of people many would consider to be disabled, that they view it as different rather than flawed. If we can suddenly “cure” these people, it goes from being a semantic argument to being an ethical one. Which differences between people do we allow to be eliminated? (Obviously we should allow fatal diseases to be cured, and we probably should think long and hard before we grant the population skin-colour pickers, but there’s a lot of grey in the middle there). Are there differences we should require people to get corrected? Are there diversities we should go out of our way to protect? How does perception of disability change when it gets viewed as ‘optional’? If the tech must or even can be used before the beneficiary is able to consent – how do we figure out who’s decision it is to make these alterations? There’s a loooot of ways we can screw this up and our current society is, imo, more likely to screw it up than get it right.
It wasn’t just Nazis tainting the eugenics concept, it’s all of our biases and bigotries throughout all of human history saying that given the opportunity, we will make people conform whether they like it or not, and the only thing that has stopped us so far is that it is hard and messy to eliminate all the people who are part of the out group. But we still try over and over again.
I too have high hopes for transhumanism, but I feel that the odds are very high we will screw it up *badly* before we get it right.
See Gattaca – for transhumanism to have a hope of advancing in an ethical fashion, it needs to happen in a post-scarcity society.
I see your argument and it has point, but from my PoV it comes down to an appeal to exercise reasonable amounts of caution, benevolence, and respect for autonomy, not a crippling and unreasoning fear of progress which would cause unnecessary hardship and invalidate our ancestors’ long struggle to get a better lifestyle. As it concerns the misguided attempt to apply capitalism to limit health care access way beyond any necessary socio-economic bottleneck, we need to overcome them ASAP for many good reasons, likely well before mature biotechnologies become available for positive eugenics. On the other hand, we need to be aware and tolerant of the fact that any significant technological progress necessarily goes through a preliminary phase where it is only available for the wealthy elites, the military, the ones with the right connections, and a few lucky test subjects (and porn, if applicable) as it happens for Peggy here. It is the nature of the thing and we should not make a fuss of it, just like Peggy eventually decides to give a finger to survivor’s guilt. We just need to make sure the improvements become available for everyone that needs and wants them once they are standardized. Hopefully, a lot of the bottlenecks that mandate scarcity are going to go away by parallel tech advancements (e.g. fusion power) at the same time and in a parallel way to mastery of eugenic biotechnologies.
As it concerns the ‘what is a disability’ issue, I again call for using a sensible balance between benevolence, common sense, and respect for autonomy. I see nothing wrong with treating certain conditions that have upsides and downsides such as mild autism as something best left to the individual’s choice as a lifestyle option when choice becomes a possibility.
On the other hand, I regard conditions with serious negative consequences and no plausible benefits (such as say most disabilities or morbid obesity) as a burden no one in their right mind should wish for themselves, their children, or other people, and we should exercise the outmost effort short of outright coercion to eradicate. In all evidence the vast majority of persons burdened with such conditions would wish to be rid of them if given the option, as Peggy did here. I have nothing but horror and contempt for the misguided efforts of a few radicals that glorify such conditions and try to get in the way of treating or ameliorating them for other sufferers, in a foolish drive for group identity pride, sour grapes or crab mentality, conspiracy thinking, an excessive attempt to cope with current limitations, etc. I think the likes of those should be given no influence in the way society addresses these problems, for anyone but the ones that hold those views and no one else. As it concerns the likely frequent case of those situations when eugenic treatments or enhancements need or are best applied to those who cannot give a valid consent, I assume the best guideline is to deal with them the same way modern liberal democracies address the issue of welfare of children and people in a similar state.
Last but not least, hopefully society shall come to a point, by a mix of social and technological progress, where ethnic and gender differences become as trivial and meaningless, and can be changed as easily as, choice of clothing or hair style. In the better sci-fi future I dearly wish for, everyone has the option to be an immortal shapeshifter, genius, and supersoldier, and we live in a Star Trek-like post-scarcity interstellar civilization, only with a lot more transhumanism.
Everyone here talking about the transporter stuff and nothing about how family photos always wind up looking terrible and needing a dozen takes edited together because getting a fake-genuine smile is nearly impossible after being forced into a collared shirt… (Moreso for some of us than others…I thought I escaped collars forever by becoming a slovenly engineer but NOOO…It’s been 4 years since I got rid of mine and I had to buy new ones…)
Still hoping to see Sydney in a morning talk show some day. So many possibilities…
I recall reading very early on (maybe in The Making of StarTrek) that besides budget it was very much a matter of pacing. Roddenberry was concerned that every episode would stop dead, maybe multiple times, for the shuttle transport scenes.
I think I wrote this before but maybe it was on Patreon, but I would trade a kid to get my leg back to pre-truck hitting me working status. I got hit over 23 years ago, and in spite of regular stretching and physical therapy I still don’t have full strength and mobility in that leg. It’s better but still not as good as the other leg. Blue starship captain lady could just about name her price to fix it. Not that I actually have anything an off-planet woman would want, especially with a harem of maliens, unless she wanted a bespoke bicycle. That I could make for her…
So I guess when you’re out in the galaxy, you really have to know where your hanky is.
In all seriousness, a phone back in the day was a big clunky thing that was wired into the wall. Now we have phones that fit in your pocket, with a camera, GPS, games, music, internet, etc. I could totally believe some aliens would have super-fabric tech.
Also, I love Sydney’s being her usual mixture of genuinely thoughtful and mildly tasteless with the pedicure suggestion and the discount joke.
I’d like to point out 2 uses for the transporter from other media:
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In Larry Niven’s 1976 book “A World out of Time”, he imagined a novel use, that I shouldn’t reveal here, as it’s a major plot-spoiler. I think it’s a worthwhile read.
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The webcomic “Too Much Information” is currently on hiatus, due to the Author’s medical issues, but they may have innovated the use of transporters as “bio-filters”, to omit contagious disease organisms and toxic impurities during transport. In one case, tattoos were removed automatically, when the filters detected compounds that were being used for their color, without regard for how toxic they were.
The thing in TMI was not a planned ‘feature’, certainly not the removal of the tattoos (or discovering Just Ace is chock full of tasty nanites)
Star Trek transporters explicitly have bio-filters designed to filter out harmful organisms and objects, so it’s not new to that webcomic. Of course, those filters would fail to catch “plot issue of the week” whenever authors decided they wanted them to.
TMI is done. The author died. Fairly recently. Posted a vid of his new cat playing with his old one in Oct. Died shortly after.
As I recall, The Making of Star Trek said the transporter was to save the time it would take to show a shuttle launching, de-orbiting, coming in to land, and finally disgorging the away team.
The transporter effect involved a crossfade between the scene with the actor standing in place and the scene without the actor, with footage of aluminium powder in a light beam faded in for the sparkle effect.
In response to your last paragraph: Cell phones.
No more 50% off + 10% for being in military service
Okay, I’m guessing Sydney doesn’t have an “on for the camera” mode to her personality, or otherwise has anxiety that comes into play when getting her photo taken. Makes me wonder if she’s missed her session with Parker Studio? Or did Candace Kane manage to get some good shots of her? I’d love to see Miss Kane come on site for some action shots during sparing–maybe as a precursor to having artist statues made? The studio could also branch out into 3D scans; I’m assuming the first statues would have to he them in their uniform, but after that some fun poses could be done.
I’m also wondering if Anvil even knows there’s a hole in her jeans? That’s one of those locations you tend to not notice a hole unless you suddenly feel a breeze, or someone points it out to you.
Seeing Sydney and Peggy getting their toenails done could be fun, especially if someone manages to take some clandestine shots so Sydney doesn’t know the camera is there.
That is and oddly specific amount of time on the foot modeling. On second thought, I don’t want to know.
Is there a Foot Club for Amputees? Seriously, if you only need one shoe, it seems like a torturous waste to have to buy both. What would you do with the extra, put it in a pile and stare at it?
Imagine a website where you could find people with the opposite missing foot of the same size where you get together and split the cost of a new pair of shoes?
It sounds like a sick joke, and it kinda started out as one, but as many people as I have seen with artificial limbs over the last decade, I have to wonder if there is a place for this.
The Idea started out as the “Foot Club for Vets” But there are enough car crashes and accidents to make a “Foot Club for Amps.”
I dunno, maybe there is something like that out there already. What do y’all think?
i Believe it was mentioned that such a website or sites do exist near the beginning of this story arc.
I read about a poor one-legged man in the nineteenth century who would wear first one shoe and when it wore out, the other. Seems uncomfortable, but as I said, he was poor.
Not that uncomfortable. Actually having dedicated shoes for the left and right foot wasn’t a thing before the late 1800s. I once it was actually the American civil War that got that started as a way of streamlining the process of getting soldiers into uniform faster. Before like 1860, all shoes were just uniform boxes that you put your feet into, or overly tough leather socks. There was no left shoe/right shoe divide, so it didn’t matter which one you put on which foot. They were equally uncomfortable no matter what.
I’m sure foot locker woud sell their soul … *Ahem* … sole for Peggy to endorse some products
Needs new matching shoes.
My secret weapon for keeping my kids’ attention in family pictures? The fart symphony: https://youtu.be/Tk-5RVMerfI?si=KDZqIOfB6DV4BMJl
the transporter thing is sort of addressed in the wrath of khan and the eugenics wars. Nerdout!
Love that second panel.
It seems to me that Sydney’s personality is EXACTLY the right one for this situation. Peggy is in an unavoidably weirded out situation, and Sydney is exactly the sort of crazy to off-balance the expectation of normal to the point that you just have to let go.
The transporters were indeed a way to save time and FX budget. That, and the shuttlecraft model wasn’t ready in time…
This is possibly the nerdiest thing I’ve ever admitted to on the internet, and that’s saying something.
I’m part of a group of role players, we have a guild in Star Trek online. My particular character is a Reman, You are known for their telepathy. Over 50% of her crew are teleporter clones of herself. She is very much of the opinion that if you want something done right, you do it yourself, and now she has the means to have more of herself doing things right, especially since they can then use their own telepathy to stay in contact with each other and essentially form a hive mind. The fact that she also has a couple of experimental Borg derived implants helps, obviously. But considering that she commands a carrier ship, think about all the pilots she loses in combat, and how easily she replaces them. Lot of cycle logical horror there when you start considering the issues of identity with telepathic clones.
Frix has a Squeeze Bulb horn? Is it a “super advanced space squeeze bulb” horn?
It’s Peggy’s old leg. Not super advanced.
Ah…I see it now. Sure looked like a squeeze bulb horn to me…
Wait, if he’s holding her leg, what is she holding? o_O
The shoe that’s the pair to the one on the prosthetic.
Gene Rodenberry pretty much said the reason TOS has transporters is because he couldn’t figure out how to land, and take off again, in the Enterprise.
[Runaway gene editing, the pursuit of super soldiers, so called “master races” etc. ]
It wasn’t transporter based, but Star Trek did have all those things. I think it was post world war three, after the nuclear horror. Even the Klingons jumped into the genetic arms race but it backfired on them really hard. As of Deep Space Nine it’s super illegal now in the Federation, to the point that there’s discrimination against “enhanced” humans.
Technically the transporter doing gene editing did happen, but that was more returning someone to their previous transporter pattern after some really recent gene damage. Much less build-a-baby than Khan and Bashir.
Anvil totally ripped her jeans again…
No one ever points out how transporters would pretty much eliminate all waste products.
That’s replicators. Transporters are basically just big ones with remote re/de-construction capability and safety checks to not delete nor duplicate people.
yea would probably need big ones to process large garbage dumps and contaminated places