Grrl Power #1008 – Yarr har fiddle dee dee…
Option 1:
“Do you have anything to declare?”
“I do declare, it’s powerful hot, suh. I may have the vapors! And not just because of the all-bean-and-Mexican-tapwater diet!”
“Seriously, miss…”
“I as serious as a German school marm! I’m at DefCon 1 over here! Where’s the restroom!”
“>sigh< Out the door to the right, past the next terminal. NEXT!”
Option 2:
“What are these?”
“Glass… things?”
“Glass things?”
“Knickknacks. That’s the word. Colorful glass knickknacks. Non-suspicious, colorful glass knickknacks. >cough<”
“>Long Pause< I’m barely cracking minimum wage here, just go.”
I’m not sure what else to say about this page because most of what I want to say is on the next page.
Tamer: Enhancer 2 – Progress Update: Getting Proofed!
Still getting proofed. About halfway through the book now. This is from the first proofer who got back to me, and once I edit in all those corrections, I’ll run through it again with notes from the others. That tends to go faster, because some errors will be noticed by most, though different readers catch different things.
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Option 3: What are these?
Magic orbs that grant me super powers, this one lets me fly when I hold it.
Sure kid, that is some imagination you have there.
I mean this is before superheroes were public
The best lies are truths that no-one believes.
She probably just popped them in her bag and hoped for the best. They can’t be detected unless physically visible.
I’m pretty sure that x-ray machines showing blank white spheres would be something the customs people would at least look at.
Actually, yeah, do they block everything or just not show up? Like, would they be voids, or solids to backscatter?
Void, nothing shows up.
I was also thinking about this.
She would not have known about that property of the orbs at the time so was it just a “shove them in your carry-on and hope?’ or did they travel by some other means?
It is possible they drove to there or even sailed across.
A little more background will help and I think we may get that in the next few pages.
Honestly if they just drove, the boarder check is incredibly lax, especially for US citizens, you can smuggle fire works from Mexico to Arizona for instance with very little difficulty.
It seemed it was implied they lived in Texas, but yeah, long drive, but if they drove down there it would be incredibly easy to get them across the boarder.
It also depends on when exactly we are talking about the comic started in 2010 but what year it actually takes place in is not really stated and it implies that she had them for at least a few years before then. It is hard for people to remember how lax airport security used to be pre 9/11 or even 2005 compared to what we are used to now.
I always assume as a default that all comics, animated series, shows, movies, ect.. take place in a different history, just close enough to get references, but different enough that the authors/writers can take liberies. Made up senators, different years of important events, some myths being historical events, some other fictions being historical events *think how often Sherlock Holmes is a historical figure in so many series*, different tech, ect…
like most shows will vary from 70-99 percent the same as real life to keep the contemporary feel while adding their own spins or fantastic elements *get below 70 percent and you enter Naruto, Steam Punk, Cyberpunk, ect… type territories and so on from there*
but yeah I’d say Grrl Power looks to be in the *was over 90% the same UNTIL (the event) *superhero revealed* and then dropped a little from there with more supernaturals and aliens, so like 80+ percent the same, which is well within different presidents, made up politicians, different laws and global relations. (Also maybe made up countries like Marvel and DC do…which Grrl Power has at least one made up country*.
No one actually touched on this: with what tiny amount I know of marine salvage I’d think Sydney has a solid argument.
Depends on how close the reef is to the beach, and/ or if the reef is completely claimed by the country in question. From Max’s reaction, she seems to know the answer to that already.
Probably not in territorial waters. The US has laws to that effect, don’t know about Mexico..
I don’t know about how far it is from the coastline, but the scorpion reef is actually claimed as a national park by Mexico.
That, and it’s definitely inside the 200 mile limit. There are two small areas in the gulf (Called the Doughnut Holes) that are technically international waters, but the reef is only about 60 miles off the Mexican coast.
The 200 mile limit is the contiguous zone, not territorial waters (which is 12 miles). Unless we are talking about fishing rights or economic shipping lanes, this is irrelevant for distances over 12 miles. There was a deep sea salvage lawsuit a few years ago about salvage rights in that zone vs environmental rights for Mexico even. I will post more about it when not on my phone.
https://www.maritime-executive.com/editorials/deep-sea-salvage-firm-uses-nafta-to-fight-mexican-environmental-rules
Her argument is a lot more valid if it’s over 50 km offshore. That still counts as ‘international waters’ at least for some purposes in at least some countries.
But inside that line wherever that country draws it, you’ve at *least* gotta tell ’em what you got and pay taxes on it, and depending on the country you don’t even get to keep it at all.
The problem is that the Scorpion Reef has islands. Considering the reaction they seem to belong to Mexico.
I remember that Iceland had a ‘island’ miles off the coast. This extended their territorial waters and national fishing grounds. The island was a small rock you could not stand on. I remember the news that said rock was sinking. Island sent out ships that poured concrete on that rock to keep it above the surface and therefore secure the fishing rights.
Not to mention China building islands and putting bases on them to extend its own territorial waters.
China’s argument about the artificial islands is legally bunk based on international maritime law though. There’s precedent against that based on deep sea oil platforms. They even know it’s a bunk garbage argument. They’re just using it as a ‘We dare you to say something about it’ political move. :)
There have already been lawsuits about this between deep sea salvage companies and Mexico, which Mexico lost.
What would be the taxes on priceless and impossibly powerful super powered items?
This might sound a bit pedantic and nit picky…. but you technically cant tax something that does not have a net worth. Tax is usually based on a percentage of something’s price or agreed upon currency value. Try to tax some sea water that you scoop up in a bottle. Same concept. The only worth the orbs currently have is based on sydney’s ability to use them, since she does get a salary for those services, and thus pays income tax. On the services, not the orbs.
19-22 km, not 50km. Just wanted to mention that.
Watch Sydney be able to produce a customs form. As a business owner, she probably is used to paperwork and declaring some “glass balls ornament” would be no big thing.
As soon as she touched fly ball, they all became tethered to her anyway. It’s not like she went mining in a national park. She was scuba-ing, saw something shiny and picked it up. Much like if you walked along a beach and saw a shiny bit of wave smoothed beach glass, except they “followed her home”.
Shining balls that gave the first person to touch them super powers? I can definitely seeing the Mexican government (or a customs official in the pocket of an organized crime ring) deciding to test whether shooting her in the head would “reset” the orbs to be ready to accept a new owner.
Also, wasn’t Sidney worried about being vivisected in her early appearances? Those worries would be more justified in a country that she’s not a citizen of.
The Mexican government is filled with a good portion of actually pretty decent people (about the same as the American government) who would NOT commit murder. On top of that, even a customs official in the pocket of an organized crime ring would NOT just shoot some random tourist with floaty glass balls…because that would be ABOVE their pay grade, and she was not traveling alone; she couldn’t be easily “disappeared” without a LOT of questions being asked by others.
The Mexican government as a whole, however, would absolutely commit murder in the interests of national security. Also the American government. And the Canadian government. And any country people think is better than any other.
Yes, I’m including the Vatican.
> decent people who would NOT commit murder
> about the same as the American government
Pick one.
A soldier is a decent person that would not commit murder, unless ordered.
I believe you mean “at all.” “Murder” is an illegal order and a soldier’s duty if given such an order is to refuse it and report and/or detain the issuer.
It is forbidden to kill; therefore all murderers are punished unless they kill in large numbers and to the sound of trumpets
-Voltaire
There is currently a whistleblower in jail for leaking videos of US soldiers killing civilians and first responders and laughing about it. Sorry, but just because it’s illegal doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.
So the Iraq invasion to stop the WMDs that didn’t exist, was an illegitimate war. Thousands dead and injured on both sides. Do we really think that any government would even hesitate to fabricate a “reason” to remove the halo from Sidney by any means necessary.
If 20 people in an auditorium full of 1,000 people get into a yelling screaming brawl…is *everyone* involved in that brawl? I mean sure, it sounds like it, and it feels like it…but that’s still 980 people who are NOT screaming & yelling & fighting violently.
By “about the same as the American government” I meant that most positions, over 50% for abso-damn-lutely sure, are filled with people of good conscience who aren’t going to commit murder. Yes, we have a lot of bigoted murderous assholes in positions of power…but it’s still 20 people in an auditorium of 1,000 who are doing all that screaming, yelling, fighting, & murder-y-bits.
The average customs agent isn’t going to be a bad person who would commit murder. Maybe someone susceptible to graft or bribery, but not murder. And they most definitely are NOT going to step over the line of what they themselves are allowed to do. They WILL pass it on to a superior…IF they know that these funky glass ornaments are not just funky glass ornaments.
…But how would they know that? How would they know the orbs are alien artifacts of immense power? NOBODY knew until Sydney got very slightly revealed at the bank, and then got called in to ARC HQ. And not even Dabbler knew what they were, just that she had a slight theory. Cora was the one who started suspecting the theory was a possibility, especially since Cora & crew were the first to see the Ethereum Causeway thingy. Again, NOBODY KNEW. No random customs agent would know about aliens, elves, vampires, etc. Their first thought would be “Okay, where’s your receipt” IF they had any questions…but if Sydney filled out the customs declaration for “seven glass ornaments” and had a “handwritten receipt” nobody would really bother to look it up. They’re just glass balls…as far as anyone else can tell, when she’s making them just…lie there. Probably in tubey, with foam padding, which we saw her pull out of tubey when she revealed them.
It would be 100% legitimate for someone wanting to hand-carry (presumably expensive) glass objects onto an airplane in hand luggage, rather than subject them to the brutalities of checked luggage. It would be Just Another Tourist in the life of a border agent, and a bored case of Thank You For Buying & Stimulating Our Economy, etc.
well that’s a plot twist i didn’t expect
Setting aside the fact that the United States does this sort of thing ALL THE TIME…
It’s not too hard to smooth it over. Just require Halo to be on call to assist the Mexican government. Or maybe… I dunno… let the team retrieve some of the guns we gave away to the drug cartels during the “Fast and Furious” operation.
Doubtful they’re Mexican artifacts and very likely lost alien tech that happened to have been lost in Mexico waters.
So, if she found a computer under the waters and kept it doubtful they’d say anything.
Seeing as how the balls bonded to her, it could be argued the balls may be an alien life form with it’s own agency and agenda. Depending on how long they have been there, they may even qualify as a Mexican Citizen. This would put the balls in the “Illegal Immigrant” category, except you could argue they are “married” to Sidney and military service has been a ticket to US Citizenship at times. They may need to grand the balls a green card or something.
I like this line of thought…though it does come with one drawback.
Dabbler WILL tease her about her “polyamorous” relationship situation, with the orbs AND Frix! XD
Except she’s already trying to be more comfortable with poly relationships.
She might actually appreciate the desensitisation such teasing would provide :)
That might complicate the situation, though.
As far as I’m aware, the marriage laws of the USA only acknowledge two-partner situations, and treat any higher multiples as one or more married couples and/or singles who happen to be consistently adulterating with each other. And unless similar situations to Harem’s have already prepared the law for individuals who happen to be spread over more than one body, they assume one person per body and one body per person. So even if we assume that the Orbs are recognised as sufficiently ‘a person’ to marry Sydney* and gain entry that way, that may only work for one Orb.
*Taking her surname, naturally.
All research into the matter unfortunately points at Sydney breaking the law as it is illegal to remove anything from a National Park. Yes, you can be charged, fined and possibly jailed for taking a pretty rock, flower or shell from one.
Her only real hope is that she grabbed them before 1994 when Scorpion Reef was declared a National Park.
Highly unlikely. Sydney would’ve been, at the most, a toddler in 1994.
More to the point, the Orbs were gained “recently” (her partner at the shop commented on her new accessory in the first chapter) and Obama is POTUS, so, at earliest, she found them in late 2008.
At earliest she found them in 2012. Nieto was President of Mexico when she barged into the conference room.
That would depend on whether or not she was still within the national park zone. My state has designated UNDERWATER state park areas, but they are very clearly defined underwater. Most national parks are LAND zones, and only include the water zones for a designated distance (VERY SHORT, comparatively) off the tideline–literally it’s considered to be “the lowest possible tide ever”. And it’s not like she willingly took them from the park! Besides, you CAN pick up a pretty pebble in a national park, you know. Or pick up a fascinating bug. It’s not Sydney’s fault that a NON-native “species” clung to her–if anything, those orbs are clearly non-native and non-local (to the extreme) that was discarded in some manner. People ARE allowed to not only pick up trash, but are encouraged to REMOVE it…and they’re NOT fined for being infected with a disease from something they touched in a national park either, if you want to go that route, too.
…Seriously, it’s not Sydney’s fault if that discarded and crumpled paper cup actually held a $15,000 space-sapphire ring inside! A ring that bonded to her body like giardia…or Montezuma’s Revenge…
Reefs in general are usually considered protected areas like that nowadays
I mean there’s also the “The US Goverments really wants to keep these strategic asssets in its arsenal” angle which somehow seeems to trump ordinary legal arguments.
A frank look at history will confirm that “we have more and better guns than you” is a valid legal defense if things escalate far enough. For a given definition of “valid” anyway.
Effective is what matters, I believe.
That would make sense if she had taken them of her own free will, the problem with the “you can’t remove things from a national park” srgument is that the orbs bonded to her, and cannot be removed from her.
Yes, however there is an assumed clause in that argument that you can take stuff that you can’t reasonably avoid. Dust, parasites, rainwater. I argue the orbs count as a parasite.
I see a lot of people mentioning the bits about the orbs being “artifacts” and the location being in a protected area, but nobody has yet pointed out the obvious bit that the PPO is VERY CLEARLY a WEAPON. Not just any weapon either: one at LEAST on par with modern heavy ordinance, if not even stronger.
If the orbs were indeed “stolen” or “smuggled,” well…
Granted Sydney probably didn’t know that at the time (she did mention being cautious about testing them), but it adds yet more Fun Times™ should this end up in a legal kerfuffle.
Cases could probably be made for the Lighthook (given its strength) and Shield (given it can stand up to heavy ordinance, plus ramming if used in conjunction with the flyball) orbs as well, though that would likely depend on who did the ruling there.
So that’s at least one, possibly THREE of the orbs that can probably be classified as “weaponry” or at least “weapon-adjacent.”
“Plus ramming […] depending on who did the ruling”
That would be equivalent to consider cars as weapons
Literally anything can be legally considered a weapon if used to attack someone, and vehicular homicide is a thing.
Really though, as Math and that poor shadow/knife guy from the restaurant fight can attest, ALL of those balls are weapons when Sydney’s slinging them around, and there’s no need for technicalities there.
The relevant restrictions probably aren’t limited to weapons per se, to include any other military-grade tech. Protective equipment gets caught in that web in our world: the same regulations that limit the export of guns from the USA also limit the export of ballistic or chemical-weapon protective materials, even for declared civilian uses.
Pretty much what I was thinking, yes. Past a certain level of durability, armor becomes complete overkill for any non-military purpose except perhaps in certain laboratories, and THOSE fall into a whole other can of worms not relevant to this discussion here.
It’s one thing to have a barrier that can stop common handgun rounds. It’s another thing entirely to have one that can stop anti-tank missiles.
Past a certain point on the durability meter it ceases to have legitimate non-military uses (outside labs/space, again not relevant here), certainly not enough to justify the expense. And therefore make those in power wonder what you ACTUALLY plan on doing with it.
Obviously the orbs are a special case here, but there’s a real chance of a legal debacle simply pointing to those existing rules and then saying that the shield orb obviously falls into the same category, and is therefore a “weapon” or at least “weapon-adjacent” (I assume there’s an actual legal term for that, I don’t know it if so).
(Assuming the orbs are spacecraft-adjacent in function, then the shield being so powerful makes perfect sense. Space is DANGEROUS, and I know if _I_ were leading a design team for such a thing I’d tell them to buff the defenses as much as reasonably possible. Still scary as hell to any pre-FTL civilization though.)
So uh…the orbs killed the dinosaurs? I think the orbs killed the dinosaurs.
The reef is technically outside the crater’s inner rim. So they would have to have been blown out of the crater to the north after the explosion. And then they would have had to somehow get ON TOP of a reef that formed AFTER the crater was made. So probably not.
Another quesiton then: did someone who was SHOOTING AT the previous owner of the orbs kill the dinosaurs?
IN before SPAIN claims rights to the Orbs… ;)
Mother ocean like to stir things up and wash things from the deep depths after hurricanes. That’s where all the gold coins come from on the Florida beaches. No Gallion has wrecked on the beaches to be conveniently looted, after all. Like as not the orbs were uncovered down deep and washed upwards into the reefs.
Yeah, I hope the previous owner is more recent than the dinosaur slaying event. Then again, Not even Dabs has sources that know how long ago the god-like beings that made the orbs lived or anything about the cultuire. -And she has access to DEMON history. That has to be a history archive spanning /scores/ of eons. Unless Pew-pew orb makes iridium as a byproduct of its biggest badaboom. it is unlikely to be the dino-killer…
/Unless/… The owner tried to shoot down the asteroid/comet and made an even bigger mess that killed the owner, dropping the orbs well outside the crater… ^_^;;;
I hope not if only because (x killer the dinosaurs) is kind of a tired trope in sci fi. Now it being coincidence and people think something did but it actually showed up much later sight seeing, that is another story.
Can they simply not say anything about it? Unless they plan to go to the site to check for anymore artifacts, I think the less said the better.
This would probably be the best solution…unless someone wants to go look for more [orbs/space craft/etc]. Then things get dicey because you have to explain why you want to search in another country’s waters.
Yeah that would be a lot like the Canadian government demanding to excavate Yellowstone National Park. Gonna be a big fat NO there.
Well, it’s not like Sydney “took” the orbs any more than Maxima “took” the golden-skin-with-superpowers water: she just touched it and stuff happened. And not by choice as she didn’t have any say or knowledge that the orbs or the goldstuff would attach to her. By any stretch Maxima is just as guilty for stealing her superpowers as Sydney is.
Sure, because we all know that a judge or jury would care about the distinction.
At BEST, it would probably add weeks to the case just getting THAT little tidbit verified and entered into consideration.
I mean when it comes to national strategic assets it seems like the kind of thing where the US just stamps “classified” on its and vehemently deny where they were found. While it might become an international diplomatic incident, I don’t really see any scenario where the US goverment doesn’t have her back 300% even if she had taken them off the mexican president’s corpse after murdering him in cold blood in public.
At least publicly. She would very likely face some sanctions and ongoing monitoring internally, especially since Max seems very big on keeping the rules, but you don’t sacrifice a key player with galactically unique powers to little things like personal justice or international diplomatic relations.
Actually, juries WOULD have to consider that distinction, because intent / motive is a major part of any sort of trial.
Sydney had as much criminal intent as picking up a pretty rock in a national park, which is to say, ZERO. There is no crime in doing so. (Note, this is NOT the same as moving a cultural heritage object, such as what happened during the filming of the Hunger Games films, where the actress knocked over a stone she was told she must not touch…and went and sat on it anyway. These orbs are NOT a part of any Mexican cultural system!) You are allowed to touch the pretty rock.
For those who say “But you have to put it back when you’re through!” That would be true if the rock isn’t capable of bonding itself to you without your will, with abilities you didn’t even know about. We’ve seen Sydney TRYING to leave the orbs behind, and utterly failing. In a way, she’s been taken captive by an alien force (not Mexican in nature, at all, whatsoever, by literal lightyears). Since they’re not native to Mexico, they’re not a part of the national park. They are discarded trash.
that last part is a very important distinction.
they aren’t part of the reef, there is no indication they tie to any cultural significance, it is the same as finding a discarded camera, fork, stuffed animal, whatever that someone had left behind in a national park; basically litter. There really is no legal precedence for the park or government there of to claim rights to something like that *found in a sunken ship of cultural relevance is different for those who want to point out salvage precedence* but these are functional, non-local items, if you found a fork in Yellow Stone neither the park or the government could say you couldn’t take it…
yes there is a weapon issue, but again…they bonded to her, and they aren’t part of the reef or have local cultural significance.
From the perspective of a fair, just, and neutral court system, it’s probably in Syndey’s favor that the orbs are hers, as long as a government doesn’t try to invoke some supremely elastic ‘public safety’/’weapons clause’.
The bigger picture here is that whatever court system would be trying her has a massive incentive to make sure that this trial isn’t anything approaching fair, just, or neutral.
The US would want to ensure that their high-value super hero operative goes free, possibly even setting a precedent that “unaffiliated” “”tourists”” “””salvaging””” powerful Super-tier artifacts is a fair way to play the game. A US court would rule in her favor hands-down, unless there was another political angle that was to be gained by ruling against her.
Whereas Mexico(? Scorpion Reef is administered by Mexico IIRC) would have every intent to rig the trial against her so as to either acquire the Priceless, Immeasurably Powerful Super Hero Artifacts for themselves, or otherwise leverage massive concessions from the United States – presuming the US doesn’t just take their ball and go home.
I don’t think for a moment with these stakes that Sydney would receive a fair and just trial from -anyone-. The two sovereign nations involved have too much to win/lose to let it go to a ‘neutral’ jury. It’d be a show trial at best.
That being said, regardless of how it goes down, I bet there’s going to be some dealmaking to be had in the future.
Sidney should immediately:
1 Bubble up.
2 Warp to galactic space station.
3 Gain citizenship in an spacefaring civilization.
You don’t “stand trail” to a planet bound government when you are an intergalactic spaceship. That’s like an aircraft carrier Captain standing trail in front of the chief of some 2000 person micronation for violating the no wake zone.
exactly,
add if either of these things can be verified to have their own agency, or at least program to bond.
Its not an uncommon trope, find strange item…strange item is either a sealed entity, ancient tech, alien creature, ect…and it bonds with a person. Venom, Blue Beetle, Enchantress, Guyver, various other villains and heroes…and more if we include the *I am freed from that seal but due to this ancient ritual am now bonded with you human that opened the box* type of scenarios.
sort of like the symbiotic equivalent of the Facehuuger, a “hey what’s this?” it jumps out and latches onto the host.
Considering that theorbs have “bpnded” with her, it can be argued that THEY took possession of HER, not the other way around. And as it cannot be proven that the orbs are Mexican citizens, the whole argument would be irrelevant.
It could also be stated that the orbs have become – throught admittedly exotic connections – an actual part of her body. Thus are not “artifacts” per se.
(ANd I must ask – did Halo’s orbs kill the dinosaur?)
and on the theory if killing of the dinos can see a alien trying to stop it to protect the eden class planet type thing but failing thus why old owner or watcher or what ever is dead. and why it was fuzzed out. OR he mis calculated the jump and did the starwars hyper space jump ship into another on accident.
The fuzzed out display was most likely due to the time-traveling spatial rift opened by the bungled blood spell. Anything as powerful as the orbs clearly are would definitely have a chronometer function, and losing 50+ days would bork the system.
Waiting for the first person to point out the impact crater is there. THAT will be a memorable reaction from all concerned.
I wonder if the location of the orbs is the same location as when we last saw these people
https://www.grrlpowercomic.com/archives/comic/grrl-power-745-como-llego-al-banco-de-sangre/
Oh, good call. This new story arc could very well lead back to that group.
Max’s outburst seems… overdone, considering that she’s well aware that Sydney can’t leave the orbs behind. Max herself once tried to separate the two (though she wasn’t quite aware of it at the time) and Sydney remained stubbornly attached to them.
So she’s just yelling to… yell, I guess?
She’s more angry at the fact it’s the first time she’s hearing about it than anything else
I mean, she could have asked?
We only know what the author shows us, but Sydney’s been working with and training with the team for some time. A full debrief on a possible source of super powers that can, as far as they know, be picked up by anyone would have seemed like a priority for a team like Arc. That they didn’t prioritize that seems like it’s on Max, or the General.
I think she’s primarily upset that Sydney lied about where she got them, as knowing the come from Mexican territory complicates things, and, at least hypothetically, if Sydney had told the truth in the first place, they could have at least had a plan in place for how to handle that information if it ever came out, preferably *before* announcing Syd to the world alongside the other first superheroes ever. Additionally, if some branch of the ARC *wasn’t* already searching the area where they were found, probably also backtracking currents, they likely had plans to do so at some point (I would honestly be surprised if they didn’t have a team searching already, who had been there since Syd showed up, possibly deployed before the press conference even started), meaning not only does the fact that it was found in a Mexican national park complicate said search, it *also* means if they’ve been looking they’ve been wasting time, effort, and money/resources working with totally false data, meaning they need to start over. And if there were *OTHER* artifacts to be found in the area in addition to the orbs, someone may have found them already by pure happenstance, meaning they need to prepare for the possibility that there might be someone down in Mexico with Sydney powers or at least Sydney level powers, and losing several months that they could have been gathering intel and making plans and preparations because Sydney provided false intelligence not only reflects *very* poorly on both Sydney AND Maxima, it also could wind up putting both the team and, arguably more importantly, innocent civilians in severe danger all because Sydney didn’t lied about where she found the orbs.
If it was *just* about the legality of taking stuff from Mexico that might be one thing, it’s another entirely if Sydney’s little fib potentially cost not only millions (or more) in taxpayer dollars and valuable Agents time, but also the lives of the citizens they are sworn to protect, and the lives of their team. This is extremely important information from a security/defense stand point, and the fact that Sydney lied about it and in the intervening time *never* cleared it up is a very, *very*, VERY big deal.
Notably, none of what you’ve mentioned is what she’s seen yelling at Sydney about.
“I think she’s primarily upset that Sydney lied about where she got them,”
To be fair to Sydney, at that point in time she was just being questioned, not being interviewed to be a member of ARCHON, and Sydney dodgy for months about even letting anyone know she had the orbs PERIOD because of the very totally real and definitely not Sydney-imagination-induced possibility of nerve weasel experimentation.
Then afterwards…. stuff kept… coming up. And it’s not like Sydney is the most focused person. :)
Okay the scenarios seem to range from in some way part of the KT boundary event (I kind of hope not even only for how prevalent it is in sci-fi to have some advanced alien kill the dinosaurs for some reason…heck I should check my own notes to see if I ever retconned having the Trans-Dimensional Goddesses kill the dinosaurs because evolution wasn’t going in a direction they wanted…I think I retconned this…)
any who,
so in Grrl power we have per the sci-fi scenarios.
A: Crashed Shio: Either the orbs were part of a bio-ship’s controls, were locked up on the ship, or the previous owner of the orbs was on the ship. Science Vessel, Prison Ship, or War ship, doesn’t matter; something went wrong, they crashed, interstellar engines explode, mass extinction event.
B: The previous owner of the orbs and something else were fighting and either the battle its self or blowing up the previous owner or something else caused the KT boundary event.
C: Washu’s Crater scenario: the orbs were being studied or produced in some hyper advanced lab outpost, and the lab exploded, this caused the KT boundary event and dangerous elements from the lab to be scattered on the planet.
*and now the not actually related to the KT boundary event but came much later*
D: An alien, possibly posing as one of the Aztec/Mayan ect…gods had the orbs *they may not be from the species that made them, just brought them to Earth much like if Sidney lost them on another random planet*, and for one reason or another lost them into the sea *killed, detached from them, ect…*
E: The original owner was a tourist/explorer *hyper dimensional being navigation equipment, child’s toy, a swiss army knife, relation to alien not important* but this alien or aliens showed up much later, possibly recently, either to explore Earth or just as a tourist at the reef for basically the same reason Sidney was, and accidentally dropped the orbs there. So no dino death, red herring, just oops…
to be honest in any of these cases I don’t see how any government could make a claim to something they never knew about and didn’t likely originate from any person or cultures of the area, I mean this could be salvage or this could be like finding someone’s dropped pocket knife on the beach. Add in the fact they bonded to her and I can see from her previous fears not wanting either the Mexican government or US government knowing about them, heck she lied to Archon yes at the same time she was afraid of being whisked away..so giving them more of a reason was likely something she’d want to skip over.
One of the theories about the Chicxulub impactor is that it came from the asteroid belt, which are likely the remains of a (proto)planet that was torn to shreds. Much like the scrambled waypoint on the causeway history.
The orbs / their wielder may have been ejected from the destruction, or deliberately encased in a rock and fired through their home planet, with ancient Earth as the backstop.
No, no, no. The V’straki (our dinosaurs) Empire were mutually demolished by the Igraen Alliance about 65My ago, what we call the KT boundary event. The weapon used by the Igaen forces was an asteroid. (NOTE: the V’straki were totally exterminated due to a singularly stupid policy of not permitting females off-home-planet.)
Except that they weren’t. Birds are defended from the tyrannosaurs
Well, d’uh. Of course the tyrannosaurs can’t touch the birds. Tyrannosaurs can’t fly. Except in spaceships and airborne demolition machines.
And we note that the birds did survive the Igraen Hammer :)
As a note, not in favor of the dinosaur killer thing, more in favor of alien tourist dropped them and by Nth *4th tier or higher civilization standards* the orbs are actually either a basic tool or a toy that was accidentally left behind while on holiday/vacation to the scenic planet at a scenic location. Not every impressive artifact needs an epic backstory (last great hope of the universe, fought over by civilizations tens of millions of years ago leading to extinction events, or some other such scenario)…just *wow this thing is a game change, oh…but to those that made it, its just an everyday item that their kid accidentally dropped/left behind while packing up the picnic for the drive home*
The Gods Must Be Crazy has been mentioned here several times in the past, specifically the inciting narrative of the glass bottle discarded near a tribe of hunter-gatherers and the trouble it causes them.
your first link just comes to this page.
Doh, meant to link the IMDb entry
“Legitimate salvage!” Every Expanse fan just cheered.
I’m just curious as to what legal basis Mexico had for declaring the reef a national park. My reading of the 1982 UN Law of the Sea regarding territorial waters establishes those to not exceed 12 nautical miles from the low water line of the coast of a country. The Scorpion Reef is 87 miles from the Yucutan peninsula, which, I think, puts it most definitely in international waters.
There are islands there. Those Islands are Mexican territory, so the Reef around them is also Mexican territory.
those same laws extend territorial waters to include the continental shelf, which in that area extends quite a way out, and the reef area lies within that boundary. the 12 mile agreement only applies to regiosn where there is no natural feature like the continental shelf to delineate things. countries also have a 200 Nautical Mile exclusive economic zone, in which they control the resources of the region, this includes fishing and would allow for the establishment of a nationally protected reef.
One of the islands is apparently inhabited (has a lighthouse) – so, 12 miles off the reef is territorial waters (plus the 200 mile economic exclusion zone, though I don’t know how that relates to parks).
There are another factors, claims and agreements on water bodies shared with adjacent countries.
If the 200 mile economic exclusion zones would overlap then they basically split the difference along the shared border area. That is what happens in the gulf between the US, Mexico and Cuba.
https://www.marineregions.org/eezdetails.php?mrgid=8429
http://atlas-caraibe.certic.unicaen.fr/en/image-258.jpg
This is also also why the Great Lakes don’t have international waters.
Britain and Denmark claimed out to 12 miles in the 60’s to stop radio pirates. Also because some people took over a world war II AA pedestal that Britain built off their east coast in then international waters, and declared it their own nationality, the Principality of Sealand. To stop something like that happening again, that is where the continental shelf parts of the rules come into play.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_of_Sealand
Don’t forget the fishing rights fights.
Which is why the UK maintains just enough habitation on Rockall Island.
No. She didn’t take them. They latched on to her and refused to let go :P
Well, this definitely introduces some interesting international intrigue.
I honestly dont see the problem here. So what she picked up some glass balls while on vacation?
What was she going to do? Once she found them, she appearantly couldn’t return them.
Since power IS authority, what’s Mexico going to do that wouldn’t justify Sid nuking them from orbit. And yes, attempting to arrest someone who can personally nuke your country from orbit is the same as declaring war on them.
The question is, what is ARCHON going to do? Looking forward to next week for a possible answer to that question.
In the real world Arianna would have a talk with the general. Then Sydney, Maxima, Arianna, and a few other people. Then there would be a talk with various greasy eminences in the DoD, the State Department, White House staffers, and possibly Cabinet Undersecretaries. At some point the Mexican Embassy and various contacts in the Mexican government would be drawn in. Lawyers would be deployed. Negotiations would happen. Eventually things would get Worked Out
It’s not like she had a choice. Once she touched them, they were hers, laws not withstanding.
You don’t normally expect that things you touch become attached to you unless you are a character in that sticky world ball game….katamari I think it is.
precisely, Maxima and Halo are both “victims” of the friendly facehugger scenario. touch neat thing, neat thing leaps onto their face; but luckily its a good thing and not a parasite.
to be fair: how would she hand them over to local authorities? they’re stuck on her and she was afraid of being experimented on.
“Okay, number one: abandoned in the ocean, not linked to any particular shipwreck or other nation’s endowment? That means mine.
“Number two: what do you mean, *TOOK*? These things were LINKED to me as soon as I touched them – which I did NOT anticipate at the time, thank you, and I nearly drowned before I realized that they were benign to me.
“Number three: Oh, wOW, aMeRiCa Is TaKiNg SoMeThInG tHaT hAs A dUbIoUs ClAiM tO sOmEoNe ElSe; tHiS hAs NEVER hApPeNeD bEfOrE…”
1) The counter-argument would be that if it’s within 12 miles, it’s still Mexican territory. And it IS a ‘shipwreck’ of sorts if the orbs are a portable spaceship, and if it belongs to an Nth level civiliztion, it does belong to another nation. But all that actually HELPS Sydney’s case and hurts Mexico’s case, since in salvage law, the nation does not necessarily GET the salvage rights – the original owner does. The more likely there’s an actual owner out there, the less likely Mexico has as strong a claim to it. Also, I’d probably stay away from wording like ‘abandoned’ and use wording like ‘lost’ – the latter gives Mexico less claim to the orbs.
2) That’s an excellent argument to make. I think I made a similar argument elsewhere in the comments section, comparing it to ‘eating a fish in Mexico’ but with less agency on behalf of Sydney, which works in her favor legally-speaking.
3) Fair enough point, lol. Reminds me a little of another bit of American history having a dispute with Mexico about Mexican ‘property.’ In early January 1831, Green DeWitt wrote to Ramón Músquiz, the top political official of Bexar, Mexico, and requested armament for defense of the colony of Gonzales. This request was granted by the Mexican authorities delivering a small used cannon for defense against frequent Comanche raids. The small bronze cannon was received by the colony and signed for on March 10, 1831, by James Tumlinson, Jr. The cannon was altered to be a swivel cannon and was mounted to a blockhouse in Gonzales. At the minor skirmish known as the Battle of Gonzales—the first land battle of the Texas Revolution against Mexico—a small group of Texans successfully resisted the Mexican forces who had orders from Colonel Domingo de Ugartechea to seize their cannon. They made a flag, which was basically picture of a cannon and the Lone Star, and underneath were the words “COME AND TAKE IT”
A possibly even more well known historical event that is similar to a Mexico/US dispute on ownership of an object is when Frodo Baggins, of the Shire, who was in possession of the One Ring, created by the Dark Lord Sauron, was pursued by a reclamation group of Nazghul. An elven woman, Arwen, fled with an injured Frodo across a river, initially with help of Aragorn, aka Strider the Ranger. One across the river, she said to the Nazghul, “Ifyou want him? Come and claim him!”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTS-BNf4EY8
I only mention the second one because it might be influential to Maxima, on getting off Sydney’s back about this, since she’s a big Lord of the Rings NERRRRRRD. :D
I’ve suspected she got them from that exact spot for… well… almost a decade now… It ties in to a hypothesis I have that was later modified by the alien kaiju things seeming to recognize the orbs and then going into a total “kill it! kill it!” panic in regards to Sydney.
The hypothesis is this: the dinosaurs were wiped out, not by an asteroid or more accurately a centaur (giant asteroid) collision, but rather either by the previous owner through some means that lead to the previous owner’s death (original hypothesis) OR by aliens trying to kill the previous owner of the orbs and following them all the way to Earth where the ensuing fight resulted in the crater and wiping out of the dinosaurs (modified version of the hypothesis given recentish data).
The latter scenario is more likely especially given the last destination on the causeway was glitchy, indicating some kind of damage to the data, possibly caused by said firefight.
I guess Syndney better brush up on her spanish.
Oh god her orbs wiped out the dinosaurs
If so, the Fracture station (on the flight orb’s history list) is really, REALLY old.
not unprecedented in sci-fi,
heck in Marvel comics (but not the movies) the Kyln prison is used by numerous species as a prison, however the structure its self was built billions of years prior (and by Galactus apparently) and the first prisoners were Galactus level beings.
I had that thought too…
I wonder if Sydney caused an international incident and would the Mexican government beat a path to Archon’s door demanding that those orbs be returned or will the Twilight Council intervene?!?
Nooo, the /Artifacts/ took /Sidney/ off the coast of another nation…
You put that young woman back, orbs. ;P
If she didn’t sneak them out, she’d have been trapped in Mexico.
So, how many of arc’s resources were taken up by searching the Florida keys?
…. So I take it the field trip to Mexico is going to involve them crossing paths with Sciona.
LOL – Maxima has the best expressions!
If Sydney’s even remotely politically savvy (which, if she’s being cynical about her medal, she probably is), the obvious response is ‘So cover it up and lie about it. This wouldn’t even be on the US’s top 100 scandals of this decade’.
I also believe she’s not socially savvy enough to withhold this comment, standing across from her Superior who blew up a mosque during an invasion (or possibly black op) in a third world country.
If Sidney got those in Mexican waters. That’s clearly an act of terrorism and war, to remove them from the country under false pretenses. The Mexican government could actually legally demand Sidney be brought to them for execution for something like that.
I’m not up to date on my political definitions, but is it possible the word you’re looking for is ‘espionage’ and not ‘terrorism?’
Jon seems to think the Mexican government is a bunch of kill-crazed lunatics thrusting for the blood of Americans. He is incorrect
Civilian tourists stealing things doesn’t fall under any definition of “terrorism” or “war” that I’m aware of.
There is no such THING as “Rights of salvage”. Those are justifications made by thieves to try to cover up that they stole treasure that belonged to either whoever lost it, or their descendants.
Second, those things really shouldn’t be public, the more sensible thing would be to lock them away, and “disappear” anyone who claimed them, they’re clearly insanely powerful artifacts, and a crazy lady like Sidney is the LAST person you want with stuff like that.
And finally, the fact that they’ve become public knowledge that they exist is just about guaranteeing an international incident WHEn it comes out where Sidney found them. Sidney could easily be arrested and executed as a terrorist for stealing those things. (And no, saying she can’t put them down isn’t a valid excuse. the orbs are clearly more valuable than a single life, so killing her to keep the orbs out of the wrong hands is a sensible reaction)
Simply put, Sidney is in COLOSSAL trouble.
The problem is that Sydney might be a colossal powerhouse, but the world is currently in a Superhero arms race.
She might be massively more powerful than even Maxima, but she’s still on the scale enough for that to be a reasonable comparison.
The US wouldn’t reasonably execute her and Disappear the orbs in the name of safety for a variety of reasons.
The first salient point being: ‘they still have a nuclear arms program, don’t they?’
The second salient point being: ‘Maxima is still alive and on their payroll, isn’t she?’
Sydney is a superpowerful asset that is under their control and fairly easy to control. She’s also easier to neutralize than, say, Maxima, guaranteeing that the US won’t view her as being much more of a flight or rogue risk than Maxima is.
The third salient point is “If any attempt to “neutralize” Halo for ‘reasons’ fails, she can neutralize the country and whoever gave the orders. The rest of Arc-Light may even be on her side not ours.”
Right
Do not make the point that your S-tier supers are disposable in front of the other S-tier super hero.
The other S-tier hero who has a passable moral compass and a sense of duty and right and wrong.
If you take out Sydney because she’s ‘too dangerous’ you’d better take out Maxima in the same breath, or else you have a big problem.
And if you send the message that you’ll kill your own team to keep the peace, the rest of the team will definitely revolt.
Right of Salvage does exist as a part of international maritime law but is not applicable to this case as there is no obvious direct link between the orbs and a vessel in distress.
Also, even if it did apply, Sydney would, strictly speaking, only be entitled to monetary compensation for salvaging the items from the original owners or underwriters.
(Quick quote from the relevant article on Wikipedia)
Traditionally, salvage only recognizes a ship or craft (“vessel”), cargo on board, freight payable, and bunkers carried on board as the subject of property in danger.
The scope of salvage has been expanded by the 1989 Salvage Convention, and protection of the environment is part of salvage. Oil pollution can cause damage to the environment. If the salvor prevents oil pollution from happening, he indeed performs a valuable service to the community as mentioned by (1997) 1 Lloyd’s Rep 323 (HL), pp 326–28. Therefore, the salvor will be rewarded with special compensation, i.e., liability salvage instead of property salvage.
The convention does not consider saving lives to be part of salvage, but if one vessel saves life and the other saves property, the arbitrator may apportion the salvage reward between them as he thinks fit.
“There is no such THING as “Rights of salvage”. Those are justifications made by thieves to try to cover up that they stole treasure that belonged to either whoever lost it, or their descendants.”
Hi. Lawyer here. There are most definitely such a thing as Rights of Salvage. It’s a major part of maritime law. And yes a variant of it does exist even when not in international waters, but then it’s usually based on existing treaties between nations. The US, Mexico, and Canada have quite a few of these treaties in place.
Btw, Damoinion’s post is EXCEPTIONALLY well written to the point whre I didnt have to write that much here.
Very well done. +1 internet for Damoinion.
One thing not mentioned in his post, though, is that if the right to salvage exists, it wouldn’t be Mexico who has to pay the monetary compensation – it’s the owner of the orbs that would have to pay monetary compensation, since they’re the only ones who have the actual rights to the orbs as the original owner. Mexico was not, at any time, the owner of the orbs, any more than if if you drop your amazingly water-proof experimental phone in the ocean near the Scorpion Reef while taking pictures. It doesn’t then ‘become’ the property of Mexico.
If Sydney was to find the phone while scuba diving, she can ask for compensation for the effort taken in recovering the phone. OR she can ask to keep the phone. It would be up to the original owner about what happens to it.
“(And no, saying she can’t put them down isn’t a valid excuse. the orbs are clearly more valuable than a single life, so killing her to keep the orbs out of the wrong hands is a sensible reaction)”
Um… it actually is a VERY valid excuse, and killing her to keep the orbs out of her hands is not a sensible reaction. It would be a declaration of war against the United States, given Sydney is currently an active soldier in a branch of the US military.
But if Mexico were to want to play hardball about this, ARCHON could always use the Texas method of negotiation.
“Come and take it.”
https://www.usflags.com/pub/media/catalog/product/cache/dcb81d4ae761db357a9a38181bc1eb2e/g/o/gonzales_banner3a.jpg
Oh, right.
Also you do not want to try kill a Super in front of another S-tier super ‘just because it would save lies’.
You would very shortly have Supers not trusting the US government. And Maxima, who at least tries to have a moral compass and sense of reason whilst pretending she’s chained to the US, would very likely go rogue in short order.
and would be just the sort of thing that any other S-class supers, or heaven forbid an Omega sitting at home would see and point as “see THAT is why I didn’t sign up, you can’t trust this country, they treat supers as expendable commodities and not people* and now we have super civil war grrl power edition.